FAO Penski and other mod-heads

im shocked that your even considering this.

if it was as a weekend / summer fun car then ok, but a daily driver?
save yourself the hassle and get a modern luxury saloon. either of the ones you mentioned would do you well.
 
Oh, and for me character is the same as soul.

Character is what keeps you interested in the car.

Character has nothing to do with irritating faults. Character is the way it drives, the way it makes you feel, the reason why you would never sell it, for anything.

Character cannot be named. It cannot be said "I fixed that rattle and my heater works again now, suddenly my car has no character"

Popele who say that character is rattles and a faulty demister have absolutely no comprehension of character.

Almost no modern vehicle has character, mainly because the hard edges are filed off during the design process. A hard suspension is softened, but not too much, a notchy gear change is made more slippery, but not too much, nervous steering is softened, but not too much and so on, and so on, until the car is merely a mish-mash of what the designers think everybody wants.

Character only exists in modern cars where the designers have decided their target, made the car and left it at that or someone has built character into the car by changing what the designers made.

If someone told me their Elise had character, I could accept that, if merlin told me his 'teg had character, I'd accept that, but if someone told me that an "off the shelf" 530d had character, I'd probably wet myself laughing.
 
Morba said:
im shocked that your even considering this.

if it was as a weekend / summer fun car then ok, but a daily driver?
save yourself the hassle and get a modern luxury saloon. either of the ones you mentioned would do you well.

Why do you think that an older car can't be used as a daily driver?

*n
 
penski said:
For the money you're talking about, I'd personally be looking at a stacklight (possibly even a fintail) Mercedes.

There's a beautiful dove grey/blue Fintail on the bay right now. It's almost good enough to make you weep.

Then buy an eighties SEC and transplant the running gear...get John Sleath to do it and strengthen the chassis at the same time.

More style, more class and more character than ANY BMW.

*n

Meh, not a big fan of mercs, although this looks nice...

http://www.carandclassic.com/car/C04817
 
penski said:

You are such a strange dude penski. You just byte anything and anybody including protagonists of the same opinion, provide no answers to anything and and just bark out single worded replies. And then you come back for a number of oneliner encores.
If you feel R30 had more character than R32 for example it's ok, perhaps you are right - convice us - reply in full sentence, join conversation, present an opinion. If it doesn't have character, what does? And please don't reply with Norby:

Something

*n/
 
volospian said:
purpose built vs purpose rebuilt.

The scim will be stripped down the the bare chassis and reworked. This isn't just a "slap a big v8 in the bay, job done" scheme were talking.

your talking about 600bhp. your no manufacturer, you dont even know if the chassis can handle it. yet your willing to throw time and money at it.
that makes it a project car, something for the weekends / cold rainy nights, not a daily driver.
 
[TW]Fox said:
'Modded Reliant or BMW M5'

Worst. Thread. Ever.

6571front1.jpg


that is awesome :eek:
 
Morba said:
purpose built v non purpose built.


All modern BMW's, are built to meet the expectations of tens of thousands of different people, all wanting something slightly different from the same car, therefore they are built as a complete compromise to what they could be, therefore you could say they have no specific purpose.

If Volospian does the Scimitar it will be built for having fun and enjoying his vehicle, it will be built to his exact requirements to do the exact job he wants, with very little compromise, therefore it will be the defining "purpose built"
 
volospian said:
I'd accept that, but if someone told me that an "off the shelf" 530d had character, I'd probably wet myself laughing.

As some others have said, 'Character' is hard to be defined and has a lot to do with personal opinion. You say a 5 Series has no character. I think it does have character. It has real road presence, it's large, looks like it means business and nothing else, like someone wearing a Suit buttoned up. Serious Driving, and not a rep mobile like a vectra or mondeo (although it may be used for that purpose). A proper executive saloon, with power and good to drive. Thats what a 5 series is when I look at it. I think that IS character. However when I look at an elise, all I can think of is a small plastic tub on wheels. I know this isnt right, but I cant help thinking it.
 
Entai said:
All modern BMW's, are built to meet the expectations of tens of thousands of different people, all wanting something slightly different from the same car, therefore they are built as a complete compromise to what they could be, therefore you could say they have no specific purpose.

If Volospian does the Scimitar it will be built for having fun and enjoying his vehicle, it will be built to his exact requirements to do the exact job he wants, with very little compromise, therefore it will be the defining "purpose built"

its built to be a powerful modern saloon, thats its purpose, thats why it rolls off the production line like that, thats purpose built. its made to suit lots of people, that way lots of people buy it.
the scim doesnt roll off the production line with a 600bhp turbo'd engine.
 
Kappa said:
it's large, looks like it means business and nothing else, like someone wearing a Suit buttoned up. Serious Driving, and not a rep mobile like a vectra or mondeo (although it may be used for that purpose). A proper executive saloon, with power and good to drive. Thats what a 5 series is when I look at it.

What you described is road presence and nothing else. Car with character doesn't have to have road presence at all. In fact most of them don't.
 
v0n said:
Car with character doesn't have to have road presence at all. In fact most of them don't.

I think thats your opinion, and theres no decisive way to say one car has character and one has not, you can just tick boxes and see if it adds up. Driving the 5 series is commanding, knowing of the road presence, the power, the handling, and also being in the cabin. :)

If you want to 'define' Character in a car, go ahead....

NINJA EDIT, I notice you said a car with character doesnt have to have road presence, if you read, i didnt say it HAD to have it. I find thats what gives the 5 series some character next to an E class etc. I was giving an example of how I find a 5 series to have character, and Volospian not. Thus saying that character is mostly down to opinion.
 
Last edited:
Morba said:
its built to be a powerful modern saloon, thats its purpose, thats why it rolls off the production line like that, thats purpose built. its made to suit lots of people, that way lots of people buy it.
the scim doesnt roll off the production line with a 600bhp turbo'd engine.


Lots of lemmings follow each other to their deaths each year does that make it right??????

Why not be different, not run of the mill, not follow the crowd, that is showing character.
 
Morba said:
your talking about 600bhp. your no manufacturer, you dont even know if the chassis can handle it. yet your willing to throw time and money at it.
that makes it a project car, something for the weekends / cold rainy nights, not a daily driver.

lmao. No, I'm willing to spend a lot of time and effort researching whether the car is capable of taking that sort of power and if so, what needs to be done to make it so. If that research shows the idea is truely viable, then I will plan the money and resources required to make it a reality. Once that is done I will look into the feasibility of persuing the project.

The only time and money being spent on this project at the moment is my bandwidth and my posting time on this and other forums regarding ideas, suggestions and advice.

That's the whole point of this thread, if anyone actually bothered to read the first post. Is a Ford V8 in a scimitar for a daily drive a viable proposition?

Indeed I wrote, in my very first post, "I'm beginning to think this may be too much work to get it right"

I will only do this if I can find enough knowledge and expertise to make the car meet my requirements. If the project deliverables do not suggest a suitability for purpose, I will not persue the project.

So far only Jonny69 and Lopez have added anything useful, and all of it about the Jag rear axle idea, for which I thank them.
 
Kappa said:
I think thats your opinion, and theres no decisive way to say one car has character and one has not, you can just tick boxes and see if it adds up. Driving the 5 series is commanding, knowing of the road presence, the power, the handling, and also being in the cabin. (...) I find thats what gives the 5 series some character next to an E class etc. I was giving an example of how I find a 5 series to have character, and Volospian not. Thus saying that character is mostly down to opinion.

That's what I don't agree with, it's not really down to personal opinion. Defining character in cars is like defining character in women - to paraphrase cinematography - it's like dancing about architecture. Journalists tried to erect many cars to "character" or classic status throughout years - Renault Avantime, Vel Satic, Rover 800 Coupe or Subaru SVX thus mistaking quirkiness with character. Others insist on road presence, which is again misleading, as wimpy looking, anorexic BMW 2002 Turbo has more character than butch M6's could ever dream of. Character is not performace, as it's only Aston Martin, it's also VW Beetle. Car being a classic doesn't mean it has character. Pug 205 GTI is a classic, but it has as much character as an argos folding bike. Car not being a classic doesn't mean it has no character. Trabant 601 will never have true classic status but character it has. It's not exclusivity or classification. Between the two. Elise has it. VX220 doesn't. And for certain - it's not personal taste or opinion - most of us don't like old Minis, there is no denying they have character. Given a free choice, out of all classics very small number of people would reach for something like Austin Healey but it has character. I don't think you can nominate it, I don't think you can force it. I don't think you can choose car to gain character with time.
I understand depending on where we live, some of us don't see 3 and 5 series as asian/wigger mobile, someone here even said it's a "man in a suit" car, even though I have never ever seen man in a suit driving 5 series, unless by suit we mean suit from Sean Combs collection. Despite its chavy association I have no doubt M5 is a future classic. Character tho... I don't think it's something possible for it to gain and in general it doesn't really have it now, does it?
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom