Five years to save English football

Soldato
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http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/07/07/five_years_to_save_english_foo.html

A brilliant article on what is actually wrong with the coaching system in this country. A bit of a long read but I'd highly recommended reading it. Maybe the press and the idiots in the FA took notice did something about it instead of looking to blame someone like they usually do this country would produce better players.

Maybe if England don't qualify for the European championships it is a blessing in disguise? I don't think they stand a chance of winning even if they get through and maybe all the so called football experts (whose previous footballing experience is probably playing Pro evo on their playstations) who work in the FA will stand up and take notice. Brooking has been banging on about it for years and his voice is falling on deaf ears.

People talk about foreign quotas in this league but all that will do is bring the quality of the league down. The English players who play beside these foreign talents have improved in quality dramatically over the years. Look at the current England team and you will find quite a few top top players. Has Frank Lampard not benefited playing alongside Makelele and Essien? Or Gerrard with Hammann and Alonso? There simply is no guarantee that restricting foreign players will improve the national side. The English league is without doubt imo the most competitive league in world football and much of that is down to the quality of the players here.
 
we already have more than enough quality players for national side, what we lack is balance. the 11 best technical players won't instantly make a better side than 3-4 of the best technical players, and 6-7 solid players who simply read the game better, are fitter and defend better.

our main problem is too many players that for their club drift out of position, this started with beckham. he wanted to play a free role for england, but because he plays with that squad once every few months compared to daily with his club, the rest of the squad can't adapt to how he played. if he had any dicipline and played as a right winger the whole team would have been more solid.

this has only worsened with joe cole shaun right philips and gerrard who all run about as if they are the main star, the ball should always go to them wherever they decide to run and theres no cover. gerrard is used to being the MAIN man at pool. so if joe cole lampard and SWP have run all the way into the box, he goes too. like wise, if the balls on the right wing and lamps gerrard has gone up so does cole because he has no idea that when most of the midfield has run up, he should hang back.

there is zero balance in the squad, and too many players who constantly give the ball away. barry, technically isn't the fastest, best shooter, best at skills, but he's still a fantastic player who was overlooked for the past 5 years. but frankly he should be replacing joe cole and then we have a player who is frequently the top assist maker in the premiership, who is also defensive and strong all over the pitch.

or a bridge/cole combination with barry in the middle, completely changes the feel of our side.

frankly, look at the arsenal vs man u game, for 70 odd minutes evra and giggs, both having great seasons after last year both being fantastic. we played sagna and eboue, eboue is very good going forwards but strong defensively. this dynamic left wing of man u's was completely and utterly silent for 70 minutes, eboue went off and suddenly both players came to life and made the goal. SWP is too small and weak, it doesn't matter if he can provide 30 seconds of speed and make one goal every few games, he has to play for 90 minutes, he's ineffective for 89 of them.

we need 11 players who are effective for 90minutes, not 5 players who are, and 5 inconsistant players who drift in and out of games constantly.

ronaldhino is on bad form and drifting in and out of games, hence not starting every game now.


awful manager choice, no other problem. also scared players like gerrard crying in the press about how good the manager is. because they are all worried about losing their place, rather than telling the truth and helping persaude the FA to get a real manager in.
 
Englands national team needs to be managed by a manager that can pick the side himself, and not let the press do it for him.
Someone who doesnt care what the name on the shirt is and how 'big' a player they are.
They need a Capello or a Hiddink.
 
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I hope we don't qualify. Might give that bunch of over-paid prima donna's a little dose of reality. Our first 11 earn about £1m a week between them and they can't even qualify for a tournament never mind win the damn thing.... you couldn't make it up!
 
Englands national team needs to be managed by a manager that can pick the side himself, and not let the press do it for him.
Someone who doesnt care what the name on the shirt is and how 'big' a player they are.
They need a Capello or a Hiddink.

McClaren has dropped big players and then brought heskey back which the press didnt like
 
McClaren has dropped big players and then brought heskey back which the press didnt like

What "big" players did he drop?

Other than Lampard (the wrong decision) he hasn't dropped any "big" players.

And bringing Heskey back just made a mockery of the international game and enabled Mclaren to get away with playing the awful, AWFUL football he currently has the team playing.
 
It's good to see a sensible article rather than this rubbish quota idea thats being flung around at the moment, it's hardly innovative either...lets make english players better rather than limiting the number of superior players around them to give their ego's a boost.

One thing i don't agree with though is Allardyces (as usual) comment that the government should help pay to fund coaching for the young. I mean seriously, this is an industry that pays top players millions, the PFA chairman is the highest paid union chairman in the world and the FA is an overpaid old boys club, why should my tax money go towards paying for something that they are well within their ability to provide already. The government has no responsibility to provide better footballers.

Nothing will happen about this because it's easier for the FA to ban a few johnny foreingers than actually acknowledge that they've screwed up youth coaching for the last 20 years.
 
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If the FA insist on restricting clubs to this stupid "local players only", they really should go about creating proper acadamies for them or something. Otherwise, you're just stuck with potentially brilliant kids languishing in low league teams, who simply don't have the finances or means to restructure their training systems.

That said, in some ways all it really takes is less "RUN RUN RUN" training, and more "PASS PASS PASS". That would be a start.
 
What "big" players did he drop?

Other than Lampard (the wrong decision) he hasn't dropped any "big" players.

And bringing Heskey back just made a mockery of the international game and enabled Mclaren to get away with playing the awful, AWFUL football he currently has the team playing.

He made controversial decisions in dropping Beckham, James, Campbell and then Lampard (maybe not 'big' players but all high profile ones), he then made more controversial decisions in bringing back Beckham, James, Campbell and Heskey (no matter what you say he did perform when called on).

Now i don't rate McClaren at all and think he should be sacked whatever the outcome (shouldn't have been appointed in the first place) but i find it strange when people say he has no bottle to make decisions etc.
 
Lampard was never dropped. He was injured and someone came in and did a good enough job to keep their place.

The fact that he dropped Beckham, Campbell and James, and now their all back in the squad and two are first teamers shows what a plonker he is. They're all just as good now as they were when they were left out of the squad to begin with.

Someone needs to come in and shake it up.
 
I have no faith in Trevor Brooking .. I watched him ramble on for 10 minutes during an interview and at the end of it he effectively said nothing. He has absolutely no concrete ideas, no vision, no road plan, no nothing when it comes to academies, youth development, coaching etc .. another FA crony with not a clue what he is doing
 
Lampard was never dropped. He was injured and someone came in and did a good enough job to keep their place.

The fact that he dropped Beckham, Campbell and James, and now their all back in the squad and two are first teamers shows what a plonker he is. They're all just as good now as they were when they were left out of the squad to begin with.

Someone needs to come in and shake it up.

Lampard was dropped vs Andorra and i don't disagree with him being a plonker but he has made 'big' decisions which was my point.
 
http://www.goal.com/en-us/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=480870

Consider this: between 1977 and 1984, English clubs won the European Cup every year except one. Just like now, the consensus was that England had the greatest league in Europe. Unlike now, there were very few foreigners plying their trade here. And how many trophies did the Three Lions bring home? So much for the quota argument.

This part stands out most for me, this quota stuff is just a cop out response from English people who simply can't accept the best players in this league are foreign and somehow think that removing foreign players will automatically bring the quality of the national league up. If you ignore the last 15 years and look before that when we didn't have these bad foreign players what did England achieve at national level? One WC which was won on home soil with the best player in the world injured at the time.

I think it is time some people in this country wake up and smell the coffee, this country has never dominated the national game and because they are not doing it now people are looking for excuses.

I have no faith in Trevor Brooking .. I watched him ramble on for 10 minutes during an interview and at the end of it he effectively said nothing. He has absolutely no concrete ideas, no vision, no road plan, no nothing when it comes to academies, youth development, coaching etc .. another FA crony with not a clue what he is doing

He doesn't know how to do it but what he is saying is the problem is down the coaching techniques in this country, they are poor and in general technically English players are mostly inferior to European or South American players. Until this problem is resolved you can throw every foreign player out and it will not make a difference.
 
Good read:

England: Great Club Players, Rubbish Internationals
It would be a major blow to England should the national team fail to qualify for Euro 2008. But for this inward-looking nation of football fanatics, England's absence from Austria and Switzerland might be a blessing in disguise, saving us all from another dose of our 'world beaters' suffering another 'shock' quarter-final exit. The truth, you see, is that England aren't that good. And that's nothing new.


Overestimating ourselves is an English tradition, be it on the football pitch or down the pub.

The fans are to blame to the extent that they buy into it, but it’s the media who repeatedly spout this hype every time a World Cup or European Championships beckons.

But look at the facts: England haven’t even reached the final of a major tournament for 41 years, and things don’t look rosy for 2008 either.

These are hardly traits of a world class national side, in fact we’re perhaps only marginally better than Uruguay, fellow faded winners of world football’s most prized trophy.

One cause of the perennial overestimation of our national talents stems from an overwhelming ignorance of football abroad. Open the newspapers or head to the websites of Britain’s mainstream football media and you will discover precious little coverage of foreign football. This is in stark contrast to France, Germany or Italy, for example.

Fixated on our own (admittedly very high quality) Premier League, the tendency has long been to rubbish what transpires overseas – players abroad who aren’t at Barcelona, Real Madrid or either of the Milan sides are often deemed inferior. If they were good enough, they’d be playing over here.

But do we really kid ourselves that the knowledgeable nations of world football marvel at our players in the same manner we do, that the talk in cafés in São Paulo, Madrid or Rome is of Ashley Cole or Frank Lampard?

This ignorance – some would say arrogance – has cost England many times in the past. Before the first of England’s recent qualifiers with Russia, captain John Terry was unable to name a single Russian player. Painful as it may be, he’ll presumably have no problem remembering who Roman Pavlyuchenko is now.

The abuse that Owen Hargreaves used to receive in an England shirt is another case in point. Deployed anywhere but his strongest position by Sven, English fans would jeer Hargreaves, labelling him substandard, seemingly oblivious to the fact that the guy must have had some talent to win the Champions League and start for Bayern Munich every week.

One outstanding World Cup and a £17m move to Manchester United later, Hargreaves is viewed by most as a ‘must’ in England’s starting line-up. It’s not his abilities that have changed, merely that he’s now visible to a media and public so intensely focused on domestic football.

It is perhaps this fear of being forgotten by the fans that prevents some English talents from hopping off abroad. Beckham managed it, but he wouldn’t have been forgotten if he’d sat on the bench for Dynamo Tblisi. With football an increasingly global game, the lack of English players abroad could be significant. We ourselves make a big deal of how ‘football is different over here’ and of how ‘foreigners need to adapt to the Premiership’.

So is England not lacking something by having no top players (Beckham aside) accustomed to the various individuals and styles of play on the continent? The French, Brazilians and Dutch have players based in all of Europe’s top four leagues. No, their domestic leagues are not of the same quality as England’s, but even the Spanish and Italians are now catching onto the idea that basing certain players abroad aids their personal development, especially if they’re from a country where competition for places in the top sides is tough.

Xabi Alonso has blossomed at Liverpool in a way that would perhaps have been impossible at Real Madrid. Italy’s Fabio Grosso swapped the bench at Inter for regular football at Lyon. Ligue 1 isn’t Serie A, but it remains a decent championship where he can play every week and enjoy Champions League football.

CSKA Moscow’s Vagner Love and Werder Bremen’s Diego are other examples: Stars for their clubs, their confidence has exploded and they proceeded to help Brazil lift the Copa America this summer. So what if their club sides aren’t as good as Chelsea? Surely their chosen path benefits themselves and Brazil more than Shaun Wright-Phillips’ almost permanent benching at Stamford Bridge does for him or England.

Blaming foreigners in the Premier League is a cop out. Good enough players command their place in the side regardless: Rooney at Manchester United, Terry at Chelsea and Gerrard at Liverpool. All English, all top professionals.

For those on the fringes of the Premiership’s biggest clubs – the likes of Peter Crouch or Wright-Phillips – their ambition to win accolades with England should be questioned. If they were truly motivated, they would head somewhere smaller offering regular football, be that in England or – if they want Champions League experience too – abroad.

But the dual lures of big money and a peripheral role in domestic club success ultimately prove too great to shift the inertia, as too does the memory of many a past English hero – from Jimmy Greaves in the 1960s to Michael Owen in 2005 – running back to Britain from a failed spell overseas faster than you can say ‘I missed the food.’

Those who have recently spoken in favour of footballing quotas maintain that removing such stiff foreign competition from the Premier League would prevent the likes of Crouch being restricted to bit-part roles for their clubs, and that this is therefore the key to obtaining a strong national side. Maybe so. But another thing worth considering is that great club players – as Rooney, Terry and Gerrard undoubtedly are – do not necessarily make great internationals. We’ve seen it time and time again with the Dutch and Spanish, and perhaps England are the same.

Consider this: between 1977 and 1984, English clubs won the European Cup every year except one. Just like now, the consensus was that England had the greatest league in Europe. Unlike now, there were very few foreigners plying their trade here. And how many trophies did the Three Lions bring home? So much for the quota argument.

Source: Goal.com
 
He doesn't know how to do it but what he is saying is the problem is down the coaching techniques in this country, they are poor and in general technically English players are mostly inferior to European or South American players. Until this problem is resolved you can throw every foreign player out and it will not make a difference.
I remember reading an interview with Dario Gradi, saying that he's allways trying to teach youngsters to pass the ball, think about the ball, control the ball. Basically play 'Brazilian', but everytime he turns around to look at something else, they end up going back to smacking the ball as hard as they can.

Englands improvement as a national team isnt a quick fix that can be done over a few seasons by getting rid of 'the foreigners'.
It needs to start at grass-roots level.
And its likely to be a decade, if not more, before we start to see improvements in the youngsters coming through.

Copying the Spanish system of A, B & C teams is a good idea imo as well.
 
englands problem IS a quick fix that can be done over the next few games easily.

what do winning sides have in common. italy, till this year basically, had most of their national side all playing in the italian league with a very large portion of italian players, playing defensively minded football, who i think played a 4-5-1 in the final, can't remember for sure, but they played to the players strengths.

the french when in top form beating anyone played a nice 4-4-2, with players from the team playing in multiple leagues, not that many/any from the french league really, which is a fairly attacking league where they learn their trade and i think a large portion of their attack was made up of players who played ina very attacking league. they played to their strengths as a team.

brazil, again their players almost all(if not all) play away from home league, in leagues without mostly brazillians, and were spread across europe with few playing with each other every week. they learnt attacking football, many of their attacking players play in attacking leagues/teams and they also played to their strengths.

germans, play fairly good mix of strong defence and good attack, also went 4-5-1 in major games, so more defensive.

the one similarity with them all is a very strong, recognised successful managers that made the teams their own, had the players playing their best football.

thats the thing england have missed completley, crap managers playing crappy defensive tactics when all of our players play in an extremely attack minded league, playing long ball crap football to a talentless tall man up front who is so far from international quality as to be a joke. macedonia would probably get beaten by brentford, there is a class of side we mean when we say international class, talking top 16 teams maybe in the world. crouch can't/doesn't score against any of them, scoring 58 goals against armenia and not scoring against the top 16 makes you crap. heskey was the weakest decision a manager has made for england. rather than having balls and trying defoe, bent, or putting another strong midfielder in and putting two attacking wingers further up the pitch, he went back to something that worked briefly what 5 years ago. it was pathetic that he was so out of idea's he called in someone who was good 5 years ago and has since been crap. he seemed to get credit for doing well because owen scored 2/3 goals, even though he rarely won headers, knocked very few on and he didn't set up all of owens goals.


we need a manager, that can pick a balanced team, without showboaters , without players who constantly give the ball away, that play attacking football on the ground. we haven't tried that for 20 years, hows about we give that another go.

yes coaching needs to improve, but thats the future, here and now we have dozens of players who play against the same players in the top 16 countries in the world and win games against them. chelsea have beaten barca, thats a bunch of the top 16 countries right there. arsenal have beaten real madrid, and chelsea have beaten arsenal. these players in our squad manage to play and win games against these same players. they are perfectly capable of doing it for england, but not if we have all attacking "tricks" players rather than a balance of strength and talent.

mcclown has been in charge for what, 4 years or so, a jokes a joke, get rid of him. it was clear to everyone that he was the main man in charge of sven's useless reign(or most of it), which, with a complete lack of change has continued to produce the identical same crap football that supposedly sven was producing.
 
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