German court rules circumcision is 'bodily harm'

As mentioned in my previous post, I have been searching, but have so far been unable to find any reliable data on the subject. If you know any, I would be very interested. :)

I have none immediately available to me......my job means I am conversant with this topic professionally, so much, of not all of what I post is based on my own knowledge and that which I come across professionally. So forgive me if the 'me' came across as a bit off...my apologies. I will post anything relevant if I happen across it, but I don't really have the time to start sorting through studies etc at the moment....I will however elaborate a little on my premise if that helps clarify things.

It is a relatively easy thing to see that countries who do not have the basic freedoms I refered to have an increased potential toward indoctrination of the State endorsed ideology, be that religious or otherwise. This is indoctrination by imposition. Another example is this, if you are born in Saudi Arabia, you are more likely to be a Muslim of particular interpretation than a Muslim born in Turkey.....if you are born in Italy, you are more likely to be Catholic, in Britain, Protestant, in Tibet, Buddhist and so on.....so the geographical position of your birth is very likely to inform your choice of beliefs as it the prevalent culture into which you are born.....it is quite difficult for parents in prevalent cultures that are different from their own to stop those cultures influencing and informing their children's ideologies and cultural identity....and the more diverse the culture, the more difficult it becomes. And that I think is held up by what we see in society today.

In the UK, and most Western nations it is increasingly difficult to indoctrinate a child effectively into believing the same as their Parents into adulthood unless they themselves consciously make that choice themselves when they are able.....the 6 year old who believes in Santa and Angels and thinks that their deceased hamster is happy in the hands of Jesus is increasingly unlikely to still hold those beliefs when she is 16 for example....

And this is the point I was making about indoctrination, to be effective it must be done in isolation...a child exposed to other relogions, other idealogies and philosophies is unlikely to simply follow their Parents without applying critical thought to the process as they become older and more inclined to think for themselves.

The idea that somehow limiting parents rights to raise their children in the religion they themselves believe in will combat indoctrination of children into adulthood in the UK is simply not supported by what we see in our society....where the young are increasingly less likely to follow the religion of their parents, and many of those that do, either do so by their own choice or in the case of some recent growth in evangelism by going in a different direction regarding their faith......

We simply need to ensure that children and vulnerable people of all ages are not isolated or restricted from their legal rights in regard to freedom of expression and religion......so while the family going to church on Sunday or sending their child to a faith school within society as a whole is fine and will have limited impact on the ultimate freedoms and choices of that child in adulthood, the parent or group who isolate and remove their children from society itself in order to indoctrinate should be subject to the law.

I suspect people will disagree, and they should, I am not an oracle after all...but this is my basic opinion based on my knowledge of the subject. :)
 
Last edited:
I'm not surprised that Nazi Germany are spewing their hatred towards the Jews by passing stupid laws.

I would call the religious 'law' for circumcision considerably more stupid than a country's law of the practice being banned.
 
Well said, do you know now why I say that people are xenophobic? These people hold the mentality that in order to get along with other cultures, religions, tribes, nationalities etc etc that you need to assimilate their beliefs rather than have an understanding why people practise various rituals.

I'm not surprised that Nazi Germany are spewing their hatred towards the Jews by passing stupid laws.
Idiotic post.

Well done on playing the Nazi card.
 
Well said, do you know now why I say that people are xenophobic? These people hold the mentality that in order to get along with other cultures, religions, tribes, nationalities etc etc that you need to assimilate their beliefs rather than have an understanding why people practise various rituals.

I'm not surprised that Nazi Germany are spewing their hatred towards the Jews by passing stupid laws.

Whip out the anti-semetic card, once again, good job. You may join the rest of the uniformed masses. Just because you oppose a religion, does not mean that you hate Jews.
 
I would call the religious 'law' for circumcision considerably more stupid than a country's law of the practice being banned.

This thread has sparked some interest in why the practice is still prevalent as many such customs fall away or become increasingly symbolic as time passes and interpretations of scripture change as informed by prevalent moral and cultural changes over time. Baptism is a good example, now it is simply a ceremony shortly after birth...at one time it was a full on almost drowning...

It seems strange that this particular one, particularly in Judaism is still practiced with such vehemence, given the reform Judaism movement tried to challenge it several hundred years ago and then capitulated....

I am going to do some research on the relative interpretations and reasons and if anyone is interested I will post up what I think in a day or so.....
 
This thread has sparked some interest in why the practice is still prevalent as many such customs fall away or become increasingly symbolic as time passes and interpretations of scripture change as informed by prevalent moral and cultural changes over time. Baptism is a good example, now it is simply a ceremony shortly after birth...at one time it was a full on almost drowning...

It seems strange that this particular one, particularly in Judaism is still practiced with such vehemence, given the reform Judaism movement tried to challenge it several hundred years ago and then capitulated....

I am going to do some research on the relative interpretations and reasons and if anyone is interested I will post up what I think in a day or so.....

I'm intrigued as to why it is so commonly practiced in the US on non-Jewish babies.

Look at any US porn and the guy will be cut. I'm on a largely American forum, and pretty much all the women on there are like "Foreskin? Ewww gross! Looks like an ant-eater! Bleurgh", and purely because they are only used to cut guys.
 
I'm intrigued as to why it is so commonly practiced in the US on non-Jewish babies.

Look at any US porn and the guy will be cut. I'm on a largely American forum, and pretty much all the women on there are like "Foreskin? Ewww gross! Looks like an ant-eater! Bleurgh", and purely because they are only used to cut guys.

Cultural maybe.....I am part American, my mum is American, but I'm fully endowed....maybe it is simply a cultural affectation. In the porn industry it is due to infections and guarantees of cleanliness though. I read it somewhere (playboy probably)
 
Last edited:
Sometimes I look at some of the worst examples of tattoos, and wonder why there isn't a law protecting stupid people from mutilating themselves in order to fit in with some equally tattooed group.

That Jews wish to do this and do not seem to regret it is reason enough to ignore the practice. To be born Jewish but to be excluded from that group seems not to be worth a scrap of skin.

Both practices leave scars but both groups seem happy with the results, this strikes me as pointless nannying driven only by a dislike for anyone's religion. If you took all the lolreligion people out of this thread you would have about ten posts left.
 
Sometimes I look at some of the worst examples of tattoos, and wonder why there isn't a law protecting stupid people from mutilating themselves in order to fit in with some equally tattooed group.

That Jews wish to do this and do not seem to regret it is reason enough to ignore the practice. To be born Jewish but to be excluded from that group seems not to be worth a scrap of skin.

Both practices leave scars but both groups seem happy with the results, this strikes me as pointless nannying driven only by a dislike for anyone's religion. If you took all the lolreligion people out of this thread you would have about ten posts left.
Nobody is born believing any particular religion.

Neither do the baby's give consent to be mutilated.

What do tattoo's have to do with anything?, do you even understand the basics of the argument?.
 
Cultural maybe.....I am part American, my mum is American, but I'm fully endowed....maybe it is simply a cultural affectation. In the porn industry it is due to infections and guarantees of cleanliness though. I read it somewhere (playboy probably

European porn is full of uncut guys though (and hairier women :D).

What I want to understand is how did it become cultural in the US for non-Jews, how did originally get accepted as a generally good idea?
 
Sometimes I look at some of the worst examples of tattoos, and wonder why there isn't a law protecting stupid people from mutilating themselves in order to fit in with some equally tattooed group.

That Jews wish to do this and do not seem to regret it is reason enough to ignore the practice. To be born Jewish but to be excluded from that group seems not to be worth a scrap of skin.

Both practices leave scars but both groups seem happy with the results, this strikes me as pointless nannying driven only by a dislike for anyone's religion. If you took all the lolreligion people out of this thread you would have about ten posts left.

Thats OK, because no one is arguing that consenting adults shouldn't be allowed to get circumsized if they so wish.

If it makes you feel any better I would be equally opposed to tatooing infants too.
 
In the porn industry it is due to infections and guarantees of cleanliness though. I read it somewhere (playboy probably)

That's definitely it, and their parents all had the genius level foresight to have them circumcised at birth, knowing that they would eventually enter the world of adult entertainment.
 
[Damien];22260195 said:
That's definitely it, and their parents all had the genius level foresight to have them circumcised at birth, knowing that they would eventually enter the world of adult entertainment.

Who said they were circumcised at birth?

It was simply something I read somewhere, I am not particularly bothered if it is true or not, or even if porn stars are or are not circumcised for the market or even if they simply look like they are circumcised due to an erection.....

So you can stow the bad attitude, it just makes you look foolish.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom