The simple answer to all of these is this; go through this with your child when they are of an age in which they'll understand all of this and let them decide for themselves. 90% of what you have listed will never be relevant to a child who is of an age that won't understand. The other 10% can't be sorted out by remove the foreskin for medical reasons. You talk about forcing my beliefs upon others which is ironic when you're going to do the exact same thing to your child.
German court rules circumcision is 'bodily harm'
- Thread starter dirtychinchilla
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The simple answer to all of these is this; go through this with your child when they are of an age in which they'll understand all of this and let them decide for themselves. 90% of what you have listed will never be relevant to a child who is of an age that won't understand. The other 10% can't be sorted out by remove the foreskin for medical reasons. You talk about forcing my beliefs upon others which is ironic when you're going to do the exact same thing to your child.
Soldato
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As a parent you want do do whats best for your child, always. By the time of consenting age it may all ready be too late for various of the above conditions. These are all genuine reasons, if as a parent you feel you want to protect YOUR child against the above, who are you to say otherwise?
Yes there are other ways to protect against a few of the above like HIV, a condom would be best. But providing extra protection on top of a condom is no bad thing.
For example an obese person can loose weight by dieting or excerise, yes? Or he can diet and exercise at the same time and his chances of becoming fitter multiply umteem times.
Actually they are not, and pointing out the two issues are different, with different levels of harm is not being sexist.
Soldato
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Surely he is being sarcastic?
Fair enough. I was only trying to put forth an idea. I am quite happy to be proved wrong - I still don't feel that there is enough conclusive evidence to suggest that the procedure is more good than bad from a sensitivity or sexual point of view. As such I'll remain on the stance that I don't feel that the positives warrant the action. I am quite happy for us to agree to disagree on that point.
With reference to your earlier point about preventative health benefits and so forth - would you have your child's appendix removed in case it might one day become inflamed and require removal/cause injury/death?
I guess the real debate here is whether it is okay for a parent to impose on their child their own will in this case? What if you children don't want to be circumcised? Considering that many uncircumcised men go on to live healthy, hygienic (as much as you can measure on that fact, a rather unsteady variable) and happy lives (free of the problems with which circumcision is touted to help prevent), why bother?
Just as I find it abhorrent to impose upon your child religious beliefs, I find it abhorrent to impost upon your child what is widely considered to be mutilation in so much as it causes personal injury and has caused deformity and even lack of function in some cases.
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It seems strange that Muslims who claim to wash five times a day are so reluctant to wash their genitals - VERY, VERY ODD
ps - Could someone more familiar with the Koran than I am, point out to me where in it Mohammed spoke about fellatio . . . should make an interesting read
Name the conditions that actually have a decent chance of affecting your child by the time he'll be ready to talk about.
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Aesthetics
Soldato
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Phimosis
Which can be dealt with IF it occurs.
Soldato
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An obese person can loose weight by having their foreskin cut off... wait... am I doing it right?
I'm sorry but hygiene and STD related arguments are foolish. If you don't clean yourself every day then you're a filthy cretin, and if you have sex with someone you don't know and don't use a condom then you're a bloody idiot. Really? These are arguments for cutting off a babies foreskin bereft of their choice? I'm glad I didn't have you as my father.
The gist of your argument is that the argument for circumcision is not having to wash and having unsafe sex? Genius.
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nvm
Last edited:
Soldato
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As i said theres conflicting information regarding this = not a valid point. Out of the discusion.
Appendix is a different animal in its self, it a much bigger procedure compared to a 30 second snip. Furthermore appendix issue is one issue, whilst the foreskin can involve dozens of different conditions.
The parents arent exacly doing this to punish there child are they? They are doing what they feel is best for their child for what ever reasons. As a parent you inpose your will on the child always, who better to impose thier will than the parents.
Its also widely NOT considered "mutilation" by just as many if not more people than who class it as "mutilation". Its not just religious beliefs is it? its commonly done for hygenic, medical and appearence as well as for religious reasons. If a circumsision provents any one of the above mentioned conditiones its worth it, especially ones like AIDs.
I guess the crux of the matter is Athiests feel parents should raise their children as such? and let them decide at consenting age if they want to be a christian, jew or muslim etc? Sorry just not going to happen.
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Aids, consenting age is what 16/18. I know i was ******* well before then. i may have all ready seen the benifits of circumcision considering ive only worn a johnny a handful of times and most without. Never had any type of STD or infection, maybe because of circumcision?
But you will be doing it because of your religious beliefs no matter how much you play the medical card. As for the AIDs part, seriously? You think your child is going to get AIDs by the age of about 15 when you can sit him down and go through all of this and ask him if he wants it done.
And yes, you should let your child choose what religion they follow if any at all.
Or maybe those who aren't circumcised don't get an STD every time the have sex without a condom
.
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It happens though doesnt it? Night out, bit of alchohol in the system. Like i said just becuase YOU dont feel above conditions are worth of this minute procedure dont do it.
And no thats not the gist of my argument, but you go on believing such
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You could say them same about the umbilical cord though.
One is a natural occurrence, one is not.