High income child benefit charge...oh ****

div0 · 21 Dec 2019 at 08:18

I saw this thread and thought we would be in same position as a lot of posters above. Looking at p60 for 2019 my total pay was still under £50k, presumably due to salary sacrifice / pension contributions. So looks like we're ok for now.

Something we'll need to watch for in coming years though, so thanks OCUk.

Kemik · 21 Dec 2019 at 09:08

Destination said:
This is George Osbourne, he specifically created this tax.

It's not really a tax (strictly it is). It's you not being entitled to a benefit.

Jez · 21 Dec 2019 at 11:16

Em3bbs said:
They aren't called Jeremy though (it's a quote from Peep Show)

Haha, just realised who this is

ci_newman · 21 Dec 2019 at 12:38

Guest2 said:
I might be being simple here, but why do people need to claim child benefits if they have a high income?
I wouldn’t have kids if i thought i had to rely on child benefits to fund them. There were a few of my friends moaning about their £xk a year being taken away by tories and it boiled my wee

Different areas of the country have different costs of living. £50k household income (pre-tax) in the South doesn't stretch nearly as far as £50k household income in the North.

That works out to about £3000/month take-home pay before pension contributions etc. A mortgage / rent on a family sized home is easily £1500 / month in the southern counties (or easily £2000/month in cities).

That leaves £350/week for food, nursery fees, council tax, bills, car running costs etc. The average cost of a full time nursery position is £240 / week / child. Leaving £100 / week for food and bills, assuming you have one child.

It's very feasible that £50k / year isn't considered high-income in large parts of the country.

That completely ignores the NI contributions that stay-at-home parents will earn from the child benefit too.

Guest2 · 21 Dec 2019 at 15:21

ci_newman said:
Different areas of the country have different costs of living. £50k household income (pre-tax) in the South doesn't stretch nearly as far as £50k household income in the North.

That works out to about £3000/month take-home pay before pension contributions etc. A mortgage / rent on a family sized home is easily £1500 / month in the southern counties (or easily £2000/month in cities).

That leaves £350/week for food, nursery fees, council tax, bills, car running costs etc. The average cost of a full time nursery position is £240 / week / child. Leaving £100 / week for food and bills, assuming you have one child.

It's very feasible that £50k / year isn't considered high-income in large parts of the country.

That completely ignores the NI contributions that stay-at-home parents will earn from the child benefit too.

High income and high rent/mortgage is relative to where you live. High income in London i’m sure might be over 150k. High income in Doncaster might be 15k

Generally house/apartment prices are relative to the area where there are high/low paid jobs.
It doesn’t change the fact that if you do not have enough money (or have only little left over) to pay your mortgage and bills, why have kids as this is just added expense?

Malt_Vinegar · 21 Dec 2019 at 16:17

Guest2 said:
High income and high rent/mortgage is relative to where you live. High income in London i’m sure might be over 150k. High income in Doncaster might be 15k
Generally house/apartment prices are relative to the area where there are high/low paid jobs.
It doesn’t change the fact that if you do not have enough money (or have only little left over) to pay your mortgage and bills, why have kids as this is just added expense?

National insurance contributions for non-working partners is a very good reason to claim it, and they recommend you claim it in those circumstances whatever your income.

So what you are saying is, that you would turn down the benefit if you had kids and were under the threshold? I suspect there are very few people like you

Tinders · 21 Dec 2019 at 16:41

You don’t always choose to have kids........

Uther · 21 Dec 2019 at 16:52

It's the benefits system, it's a total ballache as lots of poor people have found out to their cost with wrongly paid benefits that they are not entitled to and then have to pay back at great hardship to themselves.
Is everyone on benefits in this country now?

It's only going to get worse.

dowie · 21 Dec 2019 at 17:16

Uther said:
It's the benefits system, it's a total ballache as lots of poor people have found out to their cost with wrongly paid benefits that they are not entitled to and then have to pay back at great hardship to themselves.

Unless someone has been very unlucky and lost their 50k+ job too then I think "great hardship" is an exaggeration, it is no doubt a bit of a ball ache though*.

The anecdotes from earlier in the thread, if reflective of the advice given out doesn't sound great - advising people to claim as the husband/or high earning partner pays for it etc... and the notion some people have that is is "not means tested" isn't a good way to look at it, when it clearly is albeit crudely and based on individual incomes/using the tax system.

*not downplaying the annoyance of finding you owe several grand but just hardly comparable to say being unemployed, messing that up/getting sanctioned and turning to food banks etc..

Uther · 21 Dec 2019 at 17:30

dowie said:
Unless someone has been very unlucky and lost their 50k+ job too then I think "great hardship" is an exaggeration, it is no doubt a bit of a ball ache though*.

*not downplaying the annoyance of finding you owe several grand but just hardly comparable to say being unemployed, messing that up/getting sanctioned and turning to food banks etc..

These are the people I'm talking about. Anything to do with the benefits system is bloody horrible when you have to deal with it, as I do for a family member (getting cancer was the least of his worries once the DWP got their claws into him...)
Luckily the people in this thread will most likely be able to pay back their benefits overpayment, a lot of people aren't so fortunate.
My wife gets a disabilty benefit, the DWP have just deposited nearly 3k in her bank account for an 'underpayment' but she's not touching it as they will quite possibly ask for it back at some point, years down the line. :rolleyes:

Guest2 · 21 Dec 2019 at 18:55

Malt_Vinegar said:
National insurance contributions for non-working partners is a very good reason to claim it, and they recommend you claim it in those circumstances whatever your income.

So what you are saying is, that you would turn down the benefit if you had kids and were under the threshold? I suspect there are very few people like you

Of course I wouldn't. If the governemnt or anyone wants to hand out free money too me I will gladly take it.

Just seems like a ridiculous use of money along with things like benefits for families who have not worked in generations and have no plans to or free care for foreign people who travel to UK... only for people in the UK to go abroad and have to show insurance details and/or pay before they are even taken to hospital. Cases being myself in France skiing, a friend in Europe somewhere and my Grandad in Caribbean in the 90s

Guest2 · 21 Dec 2019 at 18:55

Tinders said:
You don’t always choose to have kids........

You havent heard of contraception?

b00merang69 · 21 Dec 2019 at 19:03

A 3 pack of condoms and some self control could have save a lot of you a lot of bother and money.

Tinders · 21 Dec 2019 at 19:07

=XDC=FluphyBunny · 21 Dec 2019 at 19:11

b00merang69 said:
A 3 pack of condoms and some self control could have save a lot of you a lot of bother and money.

Except they don’t always work.

There are other reasons where you can have kids without planning to (myself falling into this category!).

Uther · 21 Dec 2019 at 19:13

=XDC=FluphyBunny said:
Except they don’t always work.

There are other reasons where you can have kids without planning to (myself falling into this category!).

Withdrawal method?

b00merang69 · 21 Dec 2019 at 19:15

Reason I added last part about self control, never erupt while ball deep unless you know for sure she is on the "Jack and Jill" (a must for one nighter's), give her a pearl necklace instead, far cheaper in long run.

Tinders · 21 Dec 2019 at 19:50

Child no 1 was planned for us, child 2 was a risky session. Child 3 was for sure condom failure.

The mrs did go on the pill and to be fair it did do its job.....she went right of sex

Ive no problem paying back the CB, it just would be nice if HMRC go their act together, with all the electronic data they have, surely thery could have a simpler process to inform people.

Uther · 21 Dec 2019 at 19:58

Tinders said:
Child no 1 was planned for us, child 2 was a risky session. Child 3 was for sure condom failure.

The mrs did go on the pill and to be fair it did do its job.....she went right of sex

Ive no problem paying back the CB, it just would be nice if HMRC go their act together, with all the electronic data they have, surely thery could have a simpler process to inform people.

Well I'm sure they could but then how could they fine you/charge you interest if it was easy not to get caught out...

Malt_Vinegar · 21 Dec 2019 at 22:30

My main problem with the whole thing is why did it take 7 years for them to figure it out?!
Like, why did they suddenly decide now was the time!!

High income child benefit charge...oh ****

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