Holidays at work - the legal requirements vs policy?

[CHokKA]

Hello everyone

This is just a general question that I'm sure some of you might know the answer to, or might have even asked yourselves at one point or another.

Regarding UK holiday entitlements, I was wondering whether most company "policy's" regarding the length of time you can be on holiday for can actually be legally enforced.

Where I work, my boss is lenient and will allow me to take as much of my holiday as I need, provided I give at least 1 weeks notice for every day I wish to take. Alot of the time this doesn't apply either because I have been allowed to take a week off at short notice etc. In my current circumstance, I am planning a 3-week holiday for March / April next year, but my fiancée has told me that it is her company's policy to not allow holiday to be taken for more than 2 weeks at a time. Now we're going to go to South Africa, but it is pointless to go there for 2 weeks as it takes a day to fly there (not a day but after all the travelling and such you lose a day's holiday) and back and the places we visit when we're there take a long time to drive to so you need as much time as you can feasibly get to make it worthwhile. Time also flies when you're on holiday so it would be nice to have as much as we can there to make it enjoyable.

Now I've asked her to approach her boss about this but she doesn't think that he will allow it due to this "policy" that has been introduced. I know from past experience that policy's are usually a load of red tape, but I wanted to know whethere there is actually UK law supporting this either for or against us. Does anyone have any ideas? I've tried the usual, checking the DTI website, Google and a few other places, but all that seems to be mentioned is how your holiday entitlement is calculated, not any stipulations on how you are allowed to use this time.

Many thanks

 

[nin9abadga]

hmm, i'm not sure about the legal side of it but we have a similar policy here where i work. there have been cases where people have wanted to take 4 weeks off to go travelling and they've not been allowed to, there was even a guy who had to miss the rugby world cup final in australia because of it - he had to come home early.

i suspect that as with most of these things the company will want to ensure that they can continue to operate efficiently and effectively whilst covering holidays and absences. 2 weeks they can problably manage ok but longer may put too much additional strain on other staff.

nin9a

 

[Buttons]

A company I worked for had the same policy but it was flexible. Just tell her to approach HR and ask. They will almost certainly accomodate her request as long as there is sufficient notice.

She certainly can't lose anything.

 

[CHokKA]

There is no HR as such. It's a small business with only about 6 people

The company I work for is the same sort of thing, a small-ish business, 25 employees in total but it isn't a problem for me.

 

[CHokKA]

Well I've done a bit more research into this but I still can't seem to find anything solid about holiday entitlement and how you use your holiday. Would it be worthwhile speaking to the CAB tomorrow about it or are they unlikely to be able to advise on issues such as this?

 

[Bear]

Get her to read her contract of employment to see if its in there. If it is in there then its tough and you'll have to ask if they will let it go just this once. Many places have stipulations on when you can take holiday and for how long and in a small company, its perfectly reasonable and legal.

 

[Tomsk]

The amount of notice the employee needs to give is twice as long as the intended break. ie 1 working week hoilday require 2 working weeks notice

The amount of time an employer has to give to the employee to revoke the break is the same amount of time as the break. ie. 1 weeks notice to revoke a 1 week break.

Working Time regulations - http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si1998/19981833.htm

 

[Bri]

At my place of work (large national, several 1000s of staff), any leave over 2 weeks must be put in via a written rerquest where it will be considered for approval.

 

[Windle]

At my place of work (large national, several 1000s of staff), any leave over 2 weeks must be put in via a written rerquest where it will be considered for approval.

Likewise.

 

[nin9abadga]

There is no HR as such. It's a small business with only about 6 people

i suspect that's the reason then, it'll be much harder to cover with only a small amount of people...

nin9a

 

[leaskovski]

This kind of links in with the topic, but the minimum amount of holiday is set to change for some people...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/2006/08/28/cnhols28.xml

 

[tenchi-fan]

Annual leave entitlements are usually 4 weeks of the year... it seems reasonable not to allow a 3 week holiday as a general rule and legally your girlfriend doesn't have any case. Wouldn't stop her from requesting it anyway.

 

[Ex-RoNiN]

At my work, we can't take more than 2 weeks at a time, and we're also restricted for the week before x-mas holidays, as well as the week before easter, when no-one can take holidays.

 

[tenchi-fan]

At my work, we can't take more than 2 weeks at a time, and we're also restricted for the week before x-mas holidays, as well as the week before easter, when no-one can take holidays.

Basically every where I ever worked had a similar policy. Part of the policy was all holidays had to be approved, which instantly ruled out 3 week holidays anyway.

We have 4 weeks annual leave... subtract from that certain days over Christmas and Easter as when the company closes and you have to take annual leave (usually happens in office jobs). This really means we only have 3 weeks of our own choosing to take time off.... now add to the equation weddings, funerals and any other odd day you may need off (this adds to say, five days of the year) ... you're pretty much down to 2 weeks anyway.

 

[Tomsk]

This kind of links in with the topic, but the minimum amount of holiday is set to change for some people...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/2006/08/28/cnhols28.xml

IF the changes are implemented, they're not likely to be done immediately
http://www.dti.gov.uk/files/file30013.pdf

 

[i know nothing]

I'm afraid I don't know whether she can or she can't, but I would point out that if she were to approach them now, she would be giving them plenty of notice which I would expect the Company to view as a plus.

The very fact that they have called it a 'policy' suggests it can be altered to suit.

 

[CHokKA]

It just seems like a rather silly policy really. We accrue the holiday by working and the time we take is there for us to relax, so I don't understand why it needs to be restricted. If someone wanted to take their 4 weeks holiday all at once, for a good reason, like an expensive holiday somewhere, or other circumstances, then why can't that happen? They won't have any holiday left for the rest of the year, but surely that should be their decision if they can provide plenty of notice?

Also, what happens in the case of weddings. Next year when we get married, the same concerns will crop up because we'll be having our wedding overseas (hopefully) and we will need alot of extra time off to accommodate it all.

 

[Pookie Bear]

Man, after reading through this thread I've suddenly started appreciating my job's terms and conditions now (seven weeks holidays this year, very little notice required as long as I cover myself and no limit on how big a break I can take). Granted, I'm in a rather unique position, but even folk on our call centre can take more than two weeks, they just have to ask - saw one lad take four weeks for a trip overseas but then he didn't have another day off all year....poor guy. haha

Anyway, I can see why it would be difficult for someone in a small office to go that long...hope you get it sorted out - lived in SA for many years and some of it is amazingly beautiful (Cape Town's very nice, but you really want to visit some of the Eastern Transvaal - called something else now - and Kruger National Park - what a place that is). Just keep your eyes open when you're in urban areas


edit: ooh ooh don't forget Sun City if you get the chance....

 

[Dolph]

It just seems like a rather silly policy really. We accrue the holiday by working and the time we take is there for us to relax, so I don't understand why it needs to be restricted. If someone wanted to take their 4 weeks holiday all at once, for a good reason, like an expensive holiday somewhere, or other circumstances, then why can't that happen? They won't have any holiday left for the rest of the year, but surely that should be their decision if they can provide plenty of notice?

Because it's not convient for the business, and probably not fair on the other employees. In most small companies, the number of people who can be off at any one time is also small. WIth 6 employees, I would imagine the try and make sure only 1 is on holiday. If someone takes all their holiday in one block, it stops other employees being able to take any time off during that same period.

Also, what happens in the case of weddings. Next year when we get married, the same concerns will crop up because we'll be having our wedding overseas (hopefully) and we will need alot of extra time off to accommodate it all.

That would be at the management's discretion.

 

[CHokKA]

Man, after reading through this thread I've suddenly started appreciating my job's terms and conditions now (seven weeks holidays this year, very little notice required as long as I cover myself and no limit on how big a break I can take). Granted, I'm in a rather unique position, but even folk on our call centre can take more than two weeks, they just have to ask - saw one lad take four weeks for a trip overseas but then he didn't have another day off all year....poor guy. haha

Anyway, I can see why it would be difficult for someone in a small office to go that long...hope you get it sorted out - lived in SA for many years and some of it is amazingly beautiful (Cape Town's very nice, but you really want to visit some of the Eastern Transvaal - called something else now - and Kruger National Park - what a place that is). Just keep your eyes open when you're in urban areas


edit: ooh ooh don't forget Sun City if you get the chance....

I was born in South Africa and lived there for the greater part of my life

The Transvaal is now called Gauteng, although where I'm from (PE) Vaalies are to be avoided like the plague We have family over there so we go over and visit them at least once every 2 years if possible. It is always a great holiday, and it is something I always look forward to. This year, however, this whole situation about taking leave is causing problems. A big problem is that if you don't actually go for a long while, the flight costs seem to escalate in price quite dramatically (at least for March - April since it is Easter) so taking 3 weeks at a time is a good option. A few years ago I went back for 6 weeks. I took 3 weeks paid holiday and 3 weeks unpaid. I told my boss that if he wouldn't let me take the time off, I would hand in my notice, work it through, then go on holiday and if my old job was still there when I came back, I would reapply. He said there was no need, that it wouldn't be a problem, and gave me the time off.

I just feel that if you're valued as an employee, then there shouldn't be an issue such as this. I can understand that it creates strain on other people, but in our situation, it won't cause any. It just seems that policy gets in the way too much.