I just passed my mod 2. Now, what do I buy?

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Having passed the mod 2 this morning (hurrah! Examiner and instructor had a big argument about it, but that's another story...) I'm now thinking about going to test ride some bikes to see what's best.

I've got a shortlist of things to test, but would appreciate other people's input into things I may have missed, or options I'm looking at that are probably worth a miss.

List is:

1) Honda CBF1000 (yes, I know, but apparently it's very forgiving and rather easy to ride. Torque is apparently perfect for motorways)
2) Honda CB600 Hornet
3) BMW F800S / ST
4) Triumph Street Triple
5) Fazer 600

Hopefully, that should give an idea as to the sort of bike I want. I'm using it 95% for commuting on the motorway between Hertford and London, so need something that'll be comfy on the motorways but also pretty good through town. ABS is also a must, and whilst I'm aware the Street 3 doesn't have it, I want to see what it's like anyway.

Only other thing is I'm below average height, so don't really want an especially tall bike.

Right, any suggestions or advice is welcome. Ta.

*edit* budget is probably up to about £5k, but obviously happy to spend less if it's not necessary.

 

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A mate's got a 850GS, and he loves it. Too tall for me though. The problem with BMW's seems to be price - looking around at the market, 800S's start at £4500 and the ST's start above £5k (for a good one). I'm also liking the fact that they're belt drive (no chain maintenance! Whheeee!)

ABS is a must because the only time I've come off is when the front's locked up in the rain. I'm not sure how it makes you lazy, I guess it depends on how intrusive it is. I'm after the safest experience possible, so if ABS is the difference between binning it or keeping it together, then I'll take it. At the end of the day, if you're braking in the wet, you're never going to outperform an ABS system, unless you're obscenely good.

SV650 I heard was very tall, is this the case?

 

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I'll add the SV to the list.

And I'm really worried that I'll like the street too much. Oh

 

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Well, I've got a test ride booked on an F800R this Saturday (they didn't have any S or STs), so I'll see what the engine / fit is like. I'll see if I can get a test on the CBF1000 in the afternoon. Should be fun

 

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is the seat height for F800R roughly similar to that of the S/ST?

I'm told it is. On saturday, I'll make sure to sit on an S/ST as well as taking the R out.

I think you should think carefully if you fall for the Triumph, the wind thing on lots of motorway usage may get annoying.

I don't plan to spend any less than 3 hours testing each bike. I'll take it through london and out to the M25 and round a bit to see what it's like in different bits.

If someone's got any useful twisty roads near london that they'd test down, I'd be interested to hear. Round Egham way gets a bit exciting in some places...

What aboot the Triumph Sprint ST? I believe there's a thread from a guy (Andri) who just got one, lovely fairing, lovely engine, lovely ABS, lovely...sound?

I'll take a look at this one. Although I'd probably struggle on the insurance as it's grp 15.

As much as I love the Street Triple I cant recommend it if your going to be commuting motorways all the time, sure your neck will get used to it but its still not a pleasant experience, definitely want something with a screen.

Still, need an excuse to take one out though

SV's are really low, why they are a popular bike for lady riders, not that the SV is a girls bike lol
Well maybe Dureth when he rode one...

I don't want a ladybike

 

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Just took a Hornet 600 and a CBF1000 out for a play this morning.

First impressions:

Hugely different bikes. Whilst there's loads similar about them (you feel very much at home on either, if you ride a honda on a day-to-day basis), even a n00b like me can tell they're completely different things.

There's a lot of drama on the 600 - the clutch was quite bite-y, and the engine note, wonderful as it is, always reminds you that the engine is doing its stuff. You pretty much don't need a rev counter, you can feel and hear what's going on. There's a lot of fun to be had on the hornet, it's certainly the one that made me grin the most. It feels very modern, with the digital dash Not exactly comfortable to be slogging miles down the motorway on though.

By contrast, first impressions of the 1000 are one of grown up sensibleness. It purrs rather than screams and generally feels a lot more planted and stable. The clutch is a lot smoother and the riding position a lot more forgiving. It didn't make me grin as much, but it'd be far more obvious a choice for my needs (commuting, including motorways).

That said, I got back to the showroom and the salesman pointed out that whilst the first impression of the 1000 is sensibleness, it's a bit of a hooligan underneath, and plenty fun on the back roads when you want it to be.

So, out of those two, the obvious choice is the CBF1000. But I'd want to test ride another one, this time down the back roads.

Tomorrow, the F800R!

 

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What about the K1300S... or am I just being silly?

Good review by the way, thank you. Looking forward to the next episodes.

K1300S is probably a bit ambitious as a first bike Something tells me insurance might be an issue...

This seems to be the opinion of most people that test ride the CBF1000, and to be honest I doubt that it will ever have you grinning as much as the Hornet on the same roads regardless of what the sales bloke says. To me bikes should be fun, inspiring and leave you with a grin when you get off them. I once made the mistake of buying a bike that was the sensible option and regretted it almost immediately. I'm not advocating you get the Hornet just suggesting that your first impressions of the 1000 were probably spot on and that you consider if that's the type of bike you want.

I absolutely hear what you're saying. Don't get me wrong - the 1000 was oodles of fun (I ride a 125 day to day). Just not as fun as the hornet. The Hornet seems to be designed to sing along between 7k and 13k rpm (The noise!) whereas the CBF is happier grunting between 3k and 7k. The handling on both of them felt quite similar, although they had different riding positions - from memory the 1000 is only 20kg heavier (240 vs 220). It does feel more stable, but I'm assuming that's a little the extra weight, and a little the faring.

Bear in mind that I'm going to be doing about 90% of my time at motorway speeds on the A10/M25/M11. That said, there's nothing about the 1000 that won't tickle me if I decide to come home the long way. If I decide I really *really* like coming home the back way, I can just sell it and get something more silly.

I did only spend about 45 mins on both this morning (boo). I've got as long as I want on the F800R tomorrow, although I'm limited to 100 miles (more boo!). I'll be doing a run down to BMW Guildford and back with a mate who's having his F800GS serviced (he gets an S1000RR for the day ). I'll post here when I get back

 

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You should try a Monster.

When I win the lottery

I use to ride a cbf1000, 90% of that was motorway riding, and it was a great bike for that. It's ok down the twisty roads, but I always felt it ran out of oomph quite quickly. Think it made about 90bhp, where the original fireblade engine made something like 160, so quite a detune. The cbf has adjustable seat height, bars and screen, making it ideal if your not "average" rider height.

96bhp I think. I "got the impression" p) that it'd do three figures effortlessly, so I've mostly got the feeling of "it'll do well to get better at riding on".

 

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There are Loads under 5k on this page & it was the First link on Google.
http://motorcycles.oodle.co.uk/ducati-monster/

Am i missing summit ?

My understanding of Ducatis is that it's the running costs that kill you...

 

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I don't know about reliabilty/running costs of a Monster but my mates that have 911's & the like throw buckets of money at them.
I'd have thought the Monster would have been much cheaper to run though & more reliable.

Perhaps - I'll stick it on the list Looking at mcn, they've made a few different engine sizes over the years (variants of 600, 800 and 1000), any in particular that are good/bad?

 

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So, I was out on the F800R yesterday. Some thoughts.

I originally wanted to take out an F800S or an ST, as I realise that a naked bike isn't going to be the easiest thing to live with on a day-to-day basis. My nearest BMW dealer (Park Lane, London) didn't have any of those to test, but offered me the R instead. I accepted on the basis that (a) it'd be fun and (b) it has a lot in common with the S/ST. In fact, the F800R they had was the Chris Pfeiffer edition, in BMW race colours and lots of other nice things, including an Akrapovic can. Here's BMW's page about it - it's quite a bit more cash than the regular R, but you get a lot more as standard, and it's looks amazing: http://www.bmw-motorrad.co.uk/motorcycles/urban/bmw-f-800-r-chris-pfeiffer-edition/

Initial impressions were mixed. First, the positive:

• The engine sound is really good, with a nice deep rumble. The power delivery is really smooth from about 3k to the redline at 8.5k. The burble on the overrun really puts a smile on your face, it sounds amazing.
• The controls were fairly conventional (I'd been warned about weird BMW layouts) and only needed a delicate touch: there were times when I just nudged the indicator and had to look down to check that it in fact was on. The dash is really easy to read, and the extras (average fuel consumption, temperature, digital fuel gauge etc.) were a nice touch.
• It felt very manoeuvrable and rather lightweight - I had no problems moving the bike around by hand and it's effortless to get it to do what you want in the corners.
• The brakes are amazing.
• It's reasonably economical. Despite being heavy on the throttle, I got 53mpg over 100 miles.
• I actually really like how it looks.

Right, now the not-so-positives:

• It's not that comfortable. The seat height was about right for me (I'm 5'9) but the pegs were too high, leaving me in quite a cramped position. On the A3, I was stretching my legs out every couple of miles just to get some blood back into them.
• The seat also wasn't that comfy and at the end of the day I had a little soreness. I was also getting strange aches in my left foot (?) and my right hand as the day went on - I suspect the grips are a little thinner than what I'm used to, so I'd have to adjust how I hold them if I were to run this longer-term.
• In agreement with a lot of the reviews about the F800, it is snatchy round town. This is probably partly a result of the gearing being quite tall - 1st gear is actually a useable gear, rather than something to just get you moving off the line. The downside is that it complained doing 30mph in 3rd @3krpm and felt a lot more comfortable in 2nd. Contrast with the CBF1000 which would happily do 20mph in 6th. If you're battling through traffic, you've got to concentrate a lot more on gear choice and use of the clutch, otherwise you end up in a horrible place where the engine lurches between being fuelled and not being fuelled. With practice, I could learn to live with that, but it doesn't make it easy.
• Like all naked bikes, it's really not good on the motorway. Obviously, this will probably be better on the S/ST
• The power delivery on the engine is perhaps too flat across the rev range. I know I put smoothness down as a positive point, but the downside is that you get a single engine characteristic. This is a little difficult to explain, but on the Hondas, you felt that you had a choice between 2 or 3 different charactaristics, depending on what section of the rev range you wanted to be in. For example, on the Hornet, you had a choice between sedate (3-6k), quick (6-10k) or insane (10-13k). On the F800, you get the same amount of shove at 4k as you do at 8k. I remember getting it onto the motorway and opening it up in 3rd from about 40mph, and then expecting to get an extra kick as the revs climbed. Instead, I glanced down and was surprised to see myself at 8k already and needing to change up. It's very predictable, but there's no "fun" kick to the engine - it's all very grown up and simple. That was probably awfully explained but I hope people can understand what I mean.
  

So, in summary, I liked it, but I want to ride an ST. I wouldn't buy an R, because I couldn't live with it. If I wanted a naked bike, I think I'd have more fun on a Hornet (which is also a lot cheaper).

Given that I'm actually looking for a sports tourer type thing, I'm expecting some of the negatives to be reversed on the ST (like comfort), but I really don't think the engine's going to beat what you get on the CBF1000.

So, up next, the ST. I'll probably hitch a lift down to Vines in Guildford and take it round the back roads there. Perhaps next weekend. If not, I'll try and get either the S3 or the Fazer out from Metropolis.

 

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You mean the Triumph Sprint ST? Hadn't really considered it, but it seems worth a shot over the S3. Might take that out instead. If I've got time, I'll take both

 

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Quick update:

Planned on getting a longer stint on the CBF1000 this morning. Had it all booked in for yesterday and then had to move it to today. Went down to find the dealer's doing a 'turn up and test anything in hour-long slots' day, so unfortunately they couldn't give me a couple of hours on the 1000.

I went out for just under an hour on mixed roads and felt really comfortable. There was a small point where my left foot went to sleep (?), but I think I was just sitting slightly skew. All in all was very nice, very smooth. That test bike had 26,000 miles on it, so was good to see that relatively high milage examples can still feel good.

The flip side of the open day was that when I got back, I had some time to kill. They asked me if there was anything else I wanted to take out for an hour. They helpfully suggested 'The Fireblade's free if you want a go on that?'. I said 'Yes please'.

Some thoughts on the CB1000RR:

Holy ****!

That is all.

 

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Minor bumpage, just rode the F800ST. Brief thoughts:

Pros:

• Really good riding position
• Super stable on the motorway, at pretty much any speed. Probably more stable than the CBF1000
• Cheap(er) to insure
• Epic brakes
• Decent amount of equipment
• Although it's the same engine as the R, it seems to make a bit more sense on this. It's not as powerful as the Honda, but the gearing and riding position means you can have a lot of fun. As the R, there's no magic kick about 6k, but it does make an amazing noise once you get near the redline.
• Feels very manouverable
• Belt drive (no chain maintenance needed)
• Fairly frugal - I did 50mpg over 60 miles and 2 hours.

Cons:

• Expensive. Second hand market starts at £5k, with a bit more than that for a decent one
• I could never live with the seat. I had the regular seat hight, which wasn't a problem, but after 30 mins I had quite severe aches in my legs and feet, and shortly after they just went numb. I'm 95% sure it's the seat being the wrong shape/too hard rather than anything else. I hear there's gel ones, but if I bought the bike, it'd be entirely a gamble on getting a seat that's comfortable. I also think that my previous comfort issues on the R were less about peg height and more a combination of peg height, bar height and seat hardness.
• It's not as arm-wrenchingly powerful as other bikes.
• The bike I had (brand new, 5 miles on the clock) clunked a lot. Shifting gear was a "major event" and there was a distinctive rattling in neutral. Could have just been the bike I had, could be symptomatic of a rubbish gearbox.

I'm totally torn. Aside from the stupid seat and gearbox, I really loved the ST, it's miles better than the R for what I need. It's so easy to ride and at the same time, quite a hoot to ride. On the way back, I pretty much never got above 3rd, hearing the engine roar up to 9krpm was quite addictive.

On the other hand, I could buy a CBF1000 tomorrow and be instantly comfortable with it. I couldn't do that with an ST. Shame I also couldn't insure the Honda until I move house. Boo

 

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I'd imagine the gear box was so clunky because it wasn't worn in yet, and the gears are still finding their natural mesh.
As for the rattle, it's a inline twin I think? That probably accounts for some of the rattle when in neutral. From my limited reading on twins that is lol, I've never actually ridden one yet.

The rattle was more the sound of a gear spinning and clipping another piece of metal. If I put it in neutral but with the clutch in, it was fine. Let the clutch out, and as the clutch engaged you could hear a repeated metallic knock sound, that was at about the right frequency of the engine revs.

Could be it needed settling in, could just be a clunky box.

 

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Right, final update to this thread. I promise. Because:

I BOUGHT SOMETHING!!!!!!!

What I've actually gone and bought is an '08 BMW F800S in Red, with 5600 miles and a bunch of extras including: alarm, heated grips, abs, computer and white-lens indicators.

Managed to get a reasonable (for a dealer) trade-in price for the CBF125 and the price on the F800 was pretty reasonable, so all in all I think I got a good deal.

Here's the obligatory rubbish phone picture:




Next things to do are:

• R&G bungs all round
• Mount the autocom
• Book an annual check at the nearest dealer (last one was 1500 miles and 13 months ago)
• Ride it.

 

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How much did you get for the CBF if you dont mind me asking?

£1100. It had some scratches on the farings from where I dropped it back in november and 4000 miles on it. Could probably have gotten £1400 private, but didn't really want the hassle.

Holy massive pic batman!

Looks tidy though! good job!

Weird picture issue I seem to have. It resizes sensibly in FF here, but everyone else sees *huge*. No idea why. Resized it now.

Just going through the insurance market now. Unfortunately, I was going to insure with ebike, but reading round, they sound like the world's worst insurance company. Oh well, keep looking.

 

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Thats quite a drop from new, I thought they were meant to hold their value!

It was £2000 new. Bear in mind that the second you buy it, it loses the VAT, which is ~£400. So a mint nearly new one would be £1600 max.

The problem with the 125 market is that it seems to be hugely compressed - £1600 gets you an absolutely mint hardly used one, £1100 gets you a banger. I'm not really that fussed over the £300 extra I could have got for it private.

The thing is, the next guy will buy it for ~£1400 and will be able to put another 6000 miles on it (taking it to 10k) and only lose about £200. That's really where they hold their value.

 

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I like these bikes. They look a bit different and have a bit of character to them.

You should have negotiated a service as a deal clincher though - doesn't cost the dealer anything really but saves you £100 or so.

Wasn't a BMW dealer, was an independent.

Nice it looks very long if you know what I mean, is that because of the underslung engine? and no belly pan, how long is it??

Could just be the dodgy angle.

Dimensions, taken from wiki:

Dimensions L 2,082 mm (82.0 in)
W 1,155 mm (45.5 in)
H 860 mm (34 in)

Is that long? No idea

*edit* to pick four completely random bikes by comparison, a VFR is 89" long, a street triple is 80" long, a FZ1 is 84" long and a CBF1000 is 86" long. So I think, if anything, it's on the short side.

Question, while I'm here. Radiator guards - worth it?