Immigrants make better Citizens than Natives...?

Ex-RoNiN · 15 Jul 2007 at 09:50

disgust said:
all of them?

Have you heard of hospitality? Some people practise it.

also... is dirtydog's signature meant to be sarcastic or is it truely what he believes?

Ρε φιλε, αs τουs να λενε...δεν τα πανε καλα...

dirtydog · 15 Jul 2007 at 10:00

Ex-RoNiN said:
Ρε φιλε, αs τουs να λενε...δεν τα πανε καλα...

Which means?

Van_Dammesque · 15 Jul 2007 at 10:03

dirtydog said:
Which means?

Doesn't that reflect the attitiude most people have when they walk down the highstreet and they hear a lot of foreign voices and see romanian big issue sellers? WHERE IS YOUR WARM FUZZY GLOW FOR MULTICULTURALISM??!!??

VIRII · 15 Jul 2007 at 10:06

disgust said:
all of them?

No not all of them. Although it was about how things work and what is possible hence "Yes it does work like that and yes they can leech".

Mr Spew · 15 Jul 2007 at 11:36

VIRII said:
What utter garbage. Why not show us the figures for how much it benefits us. How did Abu Hamza benefit us exactly? Omar Bakri? How do you calculate the social cost? But hey it's ok because you might want to work somewhere else one day.........

I'm not talking about specific people, I'm talking about people coming here, paying taxes, spending money living here and we're letting them here. There are evil people in the world, deal with it. They come in all walks of life, how did Tony Blair help us? Letting our soldiers be killed and kill others in foreign countries, it's so hypocritical it's untrue.

VIRII said:
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahah Did you just make that up? You are completely clueless. Here's a hint google "birthrate UK"......
Yes, they can. Yes it does.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4553688.stm Just one of the many links.

VIRII said:
Wrong again, It was not always an island either. No-one is truely any nationality if you look at it that way however like it or not the people who made this such a desireable place to move to did so for their descendents not for all and sundry. THe wars fought to secure this land were fought for their family not all and sundry. Why not? You claim your house as yours don't you, I doubt you just let anyone walk into and use your house and garden do you so what is the difference? Seems a sharp dose of reality will be heading your way soon That doesn't mean they want you nor does it mean they should HAVE to let you in.
Care to elaborate, exactly what is the cost of teenage pregnancy? Supply and demand, more immigration = more demand...... doh So many more people allegedly doing "menial tasks" which pay less in tax then they cost to have around..... the added pressures on schools of having classrooms where no-one speaks English and so on.
Do you actually live in an overcrowded corner of England with massive immigration or are you still at home with mummy and daddy in a nice suburb well away from the realities of life still?

Wrong in what way? That we're not natives? I'm waiting for proof of this, none of us were here in the first place. I'm talking about the land, not housing. Of course my house is my own - the difference is that my house isn't capable of fitting hundreds of millions of people in it.

Dear me you're not the smartest. Eh? What are you talking about.. "reality"? Stop speaking in silly riddles trying to act smart and smarmy as it doesn't work.

Teenage pregnancy - child benefits being paid out, the teenager not going to school which is paid for by us, housing benefits amongst many others, not to mention the mother who more often than not won't have a job, or requires someone else to look after the child (which puts the carer, usually her mother) out of a job too just to look after her little daughters mistake.

If those jobs aren't taken, no tax is being paid, if they are taken, tax is paid. Since immigration is on a large scale (as articulated by others 'against' it), that's a lot of tax money that previously would not have been paid out.

A lovely assumption that no immigrant speaks English - it's simply not true. I've not come across any Polish people around here that doesn't speak fluent English, many speak it better than todays 'youf'.

I live in Northampton, second highest Eastern European population in the UK - and it's not overcrowded. :rolleyes:

Another lovely, childish assumption from yourself, I moved out at 17 (four years ago), I pay rent, taxes, bills etc (over £1k a month), more than I suspect you pay. So not quite in a lovely little west country suburb as you might assume. But that's all you do, assume. Assume everywhere is over-crowded and run down with immigrants, St Albans really must have an adverse affect on you.. it looks pretty nice from the pictures online, are you going to come and give me some figures stating it's a haven for immigration now?

dirtydog said:
I think that we should put the needs of our own people ahead of the needs of foreigners. Is that a strange concept to you?

No one is putting anyones needs ahead of anyone elses. Foreigners go under a strenuous process to work here, we don't have to. We get more benefits than them. What's not to understand here?

Van_Dammesque said:
Great a guy gets robbed and people blame him, (I maybe cross reference this with the madeleine thread ) it is also a point that these muslims are an IMPORTED problem and goes to show that this crime may never have had to happen if we had correct immigration controls.

BUT THIS IS MULTICULTRALISM AT WORK, DONT YOU FEEL A WARM FUZZY GLOW INSIDE?!!??

Aahaha, really? So crime wouldn't exist if we didn't have other races/religions over here? People are people, crime does happen and it has no bearing on colour of skin or religion.

Van_Dammesque · 15 Jul 2007 at 11:58

Mr Spew said:
Aahaha, really? So crime wouldn't exist if we didn't have other races/religions over here? People are people, crime does happen and it has no bearing on colour of skin or religion.

Crime would still exist, where did I say differently?

Can you not see that if criminal immigrants were not here the crime committed by them would reduce the crime rate? Can you not see that if we allow problematic people into this country we are ADDING to the problem?

Mr Spew · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:03

Van_Dammesque said:
Crime would still exist, where did I say differently?

Can you not see that if criminal immigrants were not here the crime committed by them would reduce the crime rate? Can you not see that if we allow problematic people into this country we are ADDING to the problem?

Can you not see that "problematic people" exist in all walks of life, all religions, all races? Deporting one paticular group (or all of them bar white British people) isn't going to stop crime. If you deport that many people (which is many many millions of people), then not only would you have the whole world against you (countries would snub Britain and stop trade routes at a very base level), there would only be white people and white criminals. The rates of crime would be roughly the same on a ratio of population, you'd just have less people (which would then gradually increase as people feel the need to populate the empty land).

Trying to deport that many people would collapse the economy, it'd be self-destruct.

Mr Spew · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:05

VIRII said:
No not all of them. Although it was about how things work and what is possible hence "Yes it does work like that and yes they can leech".

How do they leech? Come on, I'm waiting for an answer. They pay tax, how is that leeching?

Van_Dammesque · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:10

Mr Spew said:
Can you not see that "problematic people" exist in all walks of life, all religions, all races?

Can you not see that I have already acknowledged this when I said:

Crime would still exist, where did I say differently?

I am not going to respond to the rest since whatever I post you just blatantly cannot read correctly.

disgust · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:15

dirtydog said:
I think that we should put the needs of our own people ahead of the needs of foreigners. Is that a strange concept to you?

of course not... it's what Hitler thought,Idi Amin Dada and so many others

What about the thousands of british who permanently live abroad?
Shall all the countries deport them back to your island?
Maybe you should build a wall around it and not leave anyone to come in..
Better still.. launch Britain into space.. this way you'll be far away from all those nasty foreigners who eat your money and drink your blood :rolleyes:

Mr Spew · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:28

Van_Dammesque said:
Can you not see that I have already acknowledged this when I said:

I am not going to respond to the rest since whatever I post you just blatantly cannot read correctly.

What is your point, then? If crime would still exist, why deport anyone?

Yeah, that's the reason you're not responding, not because you can't think of a witty enough retort. :rolleyes:

alexakasloth · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:43

Squarehed said:
Sorry for sharing my opinion that seemingly goes against the majority. I'll do it less often from now on .

Don't, it was a very realistic thing to say.

As has been said, there are people who were born here 'leeching' and there are people who come here and leech of the state.

Generalising for such a huge amount of varied people is an idiotic thing to do.

dirtydog · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:48

Mr Spew said:
How do they leech? Come on, I'm waiting for an answer. They pay tax, how is that leeching?

Paying tax does not necessarily mean that they are a net benefit to the country.

dirtydog · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:49

disgust said:
of course not... it's what Hitler thought,Idi Amin Dada and so many others

What about the thousands of british who permanently live abroad?
Shall all the countries deport them back to your island?
Maybe you should build a wall around it and not leave anyone to come in..
Better still.. launch Britain into space.. this way you'll be far away from all those nasty foreigners who eat your money and drink your blood

Let me give you one example of Britain for the British, although there are many.

Why do we give social housing, which is in scarce supply, to immigrants while there are native Britons who are on the waiting list? This cannot be morally justified.

alexakasloth · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:49

dirtydog said:
Paying tax does not necessarily mean that they are a net benefit to the country.

Quite true, iirc members of the EU can claim it back if they go to their home country for a couple of weeks each year.

dirtydog · 15 Jul 2007 at 12:51

$loth said:
Quite true, iirc members of the EU can claim it back if they go to their home country for a couple of weeks each year.

I didn't know that. But even if they don't claim it back - the small amount of tax that low paid immigrants give to the exchequer does not make up for the cost of their impact on public services, housing and infrastructure; plus the negative social effects of overcrowding and multiculturalism. Oh, plus of course immigrants routinely send money out of the country, whereas natives would tend to spend it back in this country.

i know nothing · 15 Jul 2007 at 13:03

dirtydog said:
....whereas natives would tend to spend it back in this country.

So we can in turn pass it on to China

Toryglen-boy · 15 Jul 2007 at 13:08

Mr Spew said:
It's not your opinion, it's a skewed idea of one that you've come here to brandish about like it's something to be proud

eh? how dare you tell me what it is and isnt my opinion if you dont like it tough, just because you dont agree with it, dont go saying its not an opinion.

it is, i am entitled to it, and i will speak my point of view

:mad:

disgust · 15 Jul 2007 at 13:21

dirtydog said:
Let me give you one example of Britain for the British, although there are many.

Why do we give social housing, which is in scarce supply, to immigrants while there are native Britons who are on the waiting list? This cannot be morally justified.

give me some more examples please...
also give me some examples of the negative effects of multiculturalism.

and also respond to my question on what should all the countries who have british immigrants do with them.
You seem to have avoided that.

dirtydog · 15 Jul 2007 at 13:29

disgust said:
give me some more examples please...

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/... council to build four new schools/article.do
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6654055.stm

also give me some examples of the negative effects of multiculturalism.

Don't take my word for it, listen to what the black mayoral candidate for London has to say.

"Multiculturalism divides, it does not harmonise. Multiculturalism holds communities back, it does not empower.

"And the division it casues infects social cohesion, performance in schools, life chances through higher education, choices of career, standards of living and whether or not someone lives where they want or in a house of their own.

"Multiculturalism is the key factor in most areas of social policy - crime, drugs, behavioural problems, education and health."

http://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/...e_is_the_new_black_says_mayoral_candidate.php

and also respond to my question on what should all the countries who have british immigrants do with them.
You seem to have avoided that.

It is up to those countries to decide their immigration policies; I won't presume to tell them how they should run their countries.