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Is Russia's rash move into the Crimea a sign that...

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Golf1.6, Mar 8, 2014.

  1. Colonel_Klinck

    Hitman

    Joined: Oct 3, 2007

    Posts: 528

    Location: London, UK

    Russia is a danger to all of us. Or rather Putin's Russia is. If you think he is trying to divide the West, do all he can to break up the EU including Brexit for our benefit you are crazy. He's murdered in the UK with polonium and then again with novichok. If Putin and Russia want normal relationships and trade with us maybe he should halt all his actions against us and our allies. He won't though.

    I feel for the Russian citizens. They have been robbed by a tiny percentage of the population and Putin is totally complicit in it, he is in fact the head of it all. He's made himself the richest man in the world through raping his country, its just organised crime on a ridiculous scale.

    98 Russian Billionaires Hold More Wealth Than Russians’ Combined Savings

    https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2019...-wealth-than-russians-combined-savings-a64720
     
  2. CaptainRAVE

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Nov 21, 2004

    Posts: 30,101

    Smart man if you can get away with it - which he has.
     
  3. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,294

    But still not as bad as the U.S.

    Russia's GINI coefficient was 41.2 in 2015 https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2172rank.html
    U.S's GINI coefficient was 45 in 2007 https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2172rank.html

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2006

    Posts: 11,560

    Not down to smarts, he has an army of henchmen protecting him at all costs. Anyone who opposes him is either arrested on spurious charges or found dead (including those abroad). He's a dictator.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
  5. Colonel_Klinck

    Hitman

    Joined: Oct 3, 2007

    Posts: 528

    Location: London, UK

    It is a mafia on a State scale. He has full control of the every aspect of Russian society including its rampant organised crime. Nothing happens that he doesn't/won't approve and if it does people pay a heavy price. Russia has gone from one form of brutal dictatorship to another. He is a kleptocrat on a scale not seen before.
     
  6. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,294

    But some EU citizens live in ghettos. Why don't you feel for them?

    This is a picture of an average apartment building situated just 6 miles of the so-so popular among the Brits winter resort Borovets in Bulgaria, EU.

    [​IMG]

    And now compare it with how people live in Saint Petersburg, Russian Federation.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Colonel_Klinck

    Hitman

    Joined: Oct 3, 2007

    Posts: 528

    Location: London, UK

    What are you on Putin's payroll? Is Bulgaria sitting on some of the richest mineral deposits in the world? No it isn't it it. And showing a photo of a football stadium built for the WC which we all know is the biggest waste of money any country can spend. Putin and his cronies have raped that country, he is a dictator in all but name and imprisons/murders political opponents and journalists who dare to challenge him or paint him in a poor light. How anyone can defend him or any of his cronies is frankly beyond me. If it was just what he was doing to Russia that would be one thing but his active measures against this country and the West makes him incredibly dangerous.
     
  8. Colonel_Klinck

    Hitman

    Joined: Oct 3, 2007

    Posts: 528

    Location: London, UK

  9. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,294

    Nope, I am on a payroll of the justice.

    The above building needs a hundred or so litres of paint in order to be fixed. Why would a country need mountains of gold to achieve that? :D

    The focus which I wanted to direct you to is the background of the stadium, the living neighbourhood and to compare the living conditions which you have no interest in doing so.

    Nope, he is just the Emperor of the largest Slavic Empire on the planet and you must respect that fact!
     
  10. Panos

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 9,221

    Location: NE Lincolnshire

    Ahh how much I like when someone runs out of constructive arguments and results to trying degrade the dialogue by implying that everyone who doesn't agree with his ideas is paid or bot...
     
  11. Panos

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 9,221

    Location: NE Lincolnshire

    The same laws the UK and US has used to imposed the Cooper agreement to Greece to provide help in 1940 against the Axis? The same laws followed the day after the Cooper agreement was expired in 2010, when Greece found its banks ready to collapse forcing it to sign a new version of that agreement for 99 years?

    Show me which law allows the UK and US to prohibit a third country extract its own resources varying from oil to gas, nikel to uranium and gold?

    Which law gives gives the right to NATO to pressure Cyprus to share its oil and gas with Turkey, for the sake of not breaking it apart?

    Do you want me to carry on? Don't try to take the moral high ground, when you are at the bottom of the swamp.
     
  12. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2006

    Posts: 11,560

    Pressuring countries to get along and fix their mess isn't the same as land grabbing using mercenaries. Then killing anyone who speaks out against it.
     
  13. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,294

    The land that is Russian, anyways.

    We all know that the pressures towards Russia are all because of others' envy of the Russian resources and extreme desire for grabbing Russian land.
    Napolean tried and failed, Hitler tried and failed, now the U.S tries and will fail.
     
  14. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 17,492

    Perhaps in the past, with shale and growing lack of need for the sorts of growth in other carbon markets, that desire is slipping well away.

    It’s mostly about people, and Ukraine is an important population to control. As well for the most part Ukraine was a retaliation for the slow rot of Russian dirty influence over the country, once we stop playing fair with Russia, we can finally end this wasteful conflict.

    Though firstly once we regain control of the inwards embarrassment, a full trade embargo would be preferable.
     
  15. efish

    Hitman

    Joined: Jan 11, 2014

    Posts: 879

    The general rule with appeal to authority type arguments is that they should only be deployed if the validity of the authority is agreed by all parties (applying the law of charity) A non-charitable reading would be that 'an argument from authority' is a fallacy.

    Respect is important, as is justice and charity.

    You're conclusion is unreasonable as considerable mistrust of the authority exists (you seem to be aware of this hence you're appeal to power) and with respect I would note you seem to have an issue making a distinction between the concept of justice and that of authority.
     
  16. Panos

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 9,221

    Location: NE Lincolnshire


    A missconseption here.

    When then Russian troops invaded Poland again, Napoleon had no other option but to go for the Russian invasion.

    You see after the war of the fourth coalition, which resulted to another series of huge defeats for the French enemies, Napoleon tried hard over the period of more than 2 years to make peace with the Tsar Alexander. The agreement for peace was even discussed on a direct meeting between Napoleon & Alexander.

    However in Britain the idea that Russia could sign the peace treaty was too big to swallow, so the Income Tax doubled to 10% and the extra money went every year to Russia to keep the Tsar from signing the peace treaty.

    Four million dead solders for the coalition members of the five coalition wars, (up to that moment) weren't enough to accept a commoner to call himself emperor, or the French revolution ideas, let alone the outrageous legislation Napoleon passed across Europe abolishing serfdom and the Feudal Laws. Which existed since Codex Repetitae Praelectionis was published in 534, as second version of the Corpus Juris Civilis (part of it, is the Codex Justinianus) of 529 written by emperor Justinian himself.
     
  17. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,294

    First fix the internal gigantic problems the EU has and then focus on the Russian Federation.

    You can't build an European union with a golden head and feet of mud and clay. Doesn't make much of a sense, does it?
     
  18. Colonel_Klinck

    Hitman

    Joined: Oct 3, 2007

    Posts: 528

    Location: London, UK


    How is it Russian? It was traded to Russia in 1793. So that makes it Russian? The British Empire owned lands for far longer than that. So we'd be justified in marching our armies in to those lands with that argument? Ukraine is a sovereign country, recognised under international law. With your argument Russia could march into any sovereign country on its borders that used to belong to its Empire, USSR or Russian Federation. If Putin hadn't constantly interfered in Ukraine's politics and Gov they might not have decided to move towards closer relationships with the EU, who can blame them though, to the east is a dictator in all but name and rampant corruption, to the west democracy and potential investment to the betterment of their country.
     
  19. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,294

    In the most simple terms, it was a present to Ukraine, which according to the giver, they no longer deserve and which present needs to be taken back.

    If you have a problem, just declare a war to Russia and take it from them...
     
  20. Colonel_Klinck

    Hitman

    Joined: Oct 3, 2007

    Posts: 528

    Location: London, UK

    Haha yeah that sounds like Putin. Just the kind of person to take a present back at gunpoint. TBH I wish we would. Not a conventional war obviously, but we should fight fire with fire, Russia wants to interfere in our elections, politics and society we should hand it back with interest. Putin is not a popular man at home, we should feed that. Hopefully when the US has a POTUS who isn't a shill to Putin and the UK isn't paralysed by Brexit we will.