Is SOPA really that bad?

[RomanNose]

I will try and offer a rebuttal.
Firstly before posting statistics, please actually give us some proof they are true. I know of plenty of people use facebook who are not dumb and are not dossers.
Secondly, just because you dislike something it does not mean that it should be banned.
Now lets assume that everyone who is using the internet is a grown adult and has a job, why should you control what people do in their free time? People like to do all sorts of things in their free time, from dungeons to dragons to LARPing. The internet is just another activity that people like to pass time with.

 

[flibbage0]

Shut down the internet and only allow it to be used for business or education is my theory.

90% of people on Facebook are just bums that pay Poker or Farmville all day. Get them off Facebook and into work.

Extract.

Are you serious, shut down the internet, what a ridiculous thing to say absolutely ludicrous, I'm out.

What a sweeping generalisation, so most of my friends that are at uni doing degrees in some field of engineering or a history/law are bums are they?

Also LOL at the I come on OCUK forums to be educated by you lot.

 

[Tefal]

90% of people on Facebook are just bums that pay Poker or Farmville all day. Get them off Facebook and into work.

and ironically put all the thousands of people who work for facebook/data centres/game manufactures/ISPs out of work.

 

[spoonjaffa]

Speaking of irony

Edit: noticed it's posted already in this thread = http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18354980&highlight=sopa

 

[BlackDragon]

A quick Google will tell you why SOPA and PIPA are bad. Example here.

There is a lot of opposition from all the industries and people that the lobbyists pushing SOPA/PIPA claim to be protecting. They do not want these laws, as it is going to severely cripple the innovation and creativity.

All your favorites big websites like Google, YouTube, Facebook could be taken down for having any trace of content that is deemed to be violating copyright. It is simply technically and financially unfeasible to enforce sites like these to ensure what is pirated content, especially for smaller sites.

The lobbyists should be considering why people are pirating content, and coming up with methods of increasing value of content so that people buy it (which really isn't that hard), rather than using a sledgehammer approach. People will always pirate content, just like you will always have people stealing from shops. You don't chain your shop customers up to a security guard, and have a GPS device implanted as a suppository to ensure you don't steal anything, so why should such equivalent draconian methods be allowed on the Internet?

 

[iraiguana]

I suspect it would simply drive those who pirate media would simply switch to TOR based systems instead along with maintaining other encrypted file transfer means.

These laws will be all show and impossible to enforce on mass.

 

[Longbow]

All your favorites big websites like Google, YouTube, Facebook could be taken down

Those sites make a lot of money, so if they were under threat they would just move their operation to another country.

So regardless of SOPA, Facebook and YouTube are here to stay.

 

[m4cc45]

SOPA would be Worldwide. Why? Because the root DNS are based in USA and it's at that level they'd be blocked.

It's a bad idea on so many levels. We are talking about taking sites down on a whim. One guy who, before SOPA kicks in, had his website taken down, because he had vidoes where by artists posted, by the Feds - they gave no reason and he lost money in advertising and also lost people counts due to it being offline. He couldn't appeal and it took months to find out what happened.

There's loads of stuff like the following:

http://ourtaxdollarsatwork.wordpres...wn-84000-websites-claiming-child-pornography/

Essentially there will be ways around SOPA but it's stupid to try. Taking down illegal sites through the legal system is the best way as it can be appealled and it also takes time so if mistakes are made they can be removed before it goes to court.

The reason why I enjoy using the internet is because there it's almost a neutral territory. Where as if this bill gets passed then who is to say what is next? One thing I can guarantee is that if it does get passed and is enforced then it will not be used for what it is aimed at it will be wholescale censorship.



M.

 

[hurfdurf]

What happened in Denmark (quoted from someone).

7 years ago we got a child pornography filter on the Internet in Denmark. Some people said that it was a bad idea, but others said these people were just paedophiles, or trying to help paedophiles. Some people said that it was against our constitution, which it was. So the censorship was implemented in a way so it was formally (but not in reality) voluntary, which ensured that it was not formally a violation of our constitution.
Some people warned that once the censorship infrastructure was in place, it would most likely be used to censor other things. But they were told "Never! This is ONLY to prevent this horrible crime, and will never be used for other censorship."
Fast-forward a few years, and the Danish recording industry did not like ********.com, so they went to court to get a court order against the Danish ISPs to start censoring ******** off the Danish Internet. The judge basically said "ahh, you already have the infrastructure in place, so there will be no extra cost", and issued the order to censor ********.com. It was not a violation of our constitution because it was ordered by a judge.
Since then other "pirate" sites have been censored. Most notably The Pirate Bay, which found out that the court would not even allow them to speak their case in court, or even submit a written brief.
Then our politicians found out that they wanted to protect and expand income from taxes. In particular the high taxes gambling providers pay. The official excuse was to limit the horrible disease of ludomania. So they decided that foreign gambling providers had to pay the taxes in Denmark too if they were on the Internet and could be seen in Denmark. If they refused to pay taxes, they should be censored off the Danish internet. So they passed a law saying that if a foreign gambling provider refused to pay taxes in Denmark, a court would - on the request of our government - have to order ISPs to censor its sites off the net, and payment processors to block all payments to it. If an ISP does not censor, or a payment processor or bank does not block payment, hefty fines are issued.
Now our politicians worry that some foreign companies selling medicines on the net are not licensed to sell medicines in Denmark. So they are preparing new legislation that will censor these sites off the net, and block payments to them.
So our Internet censorship started a few years ago with a very limited purpose and good intentions. And it was solemnly promised that nothing else than child pornography would be censored.
But once the infrastructure for censorship was in place, the censorship started spreading to other areas. And the censorship is getting more and more widespread.
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20...re-much-more-widespread-censorship.shtml#c710

 

[*Moangroan*]

The problem with internet censorship is anyone not agreeing to a particular goverments agenda/ ideas will be therefore censored. You could in effect be labelled a terrorist as the laws they have brought in are companions for this.

 

[iamtheoneneo]

What happened in Denmark (quoted from someone).

Everything that quoted listed is common sense...what your afraid companies have the right to defend their products, or for drugs not to be misused or for gambling to be controlled? Give me a break, a company should have the right to actively target sites that profit from selling/distrubuting its products illegally, a country also has the right to its people to make sure the Internet follows its laws if it's going to actively promote or target citizens in that manner.

Here's the problem with the Internet at the moment: there are far to many people thinking they have the right to have all their fingers in all the pies and expect no consequences Just because it's the "Internet"

I'm no saying sopa is the way to go, but your little titbit on Denmark control just shows how OTT or narrow minded some Internet users are and don't understand the bigger picture

 

[stuman]

Everything that quoted listed is common sense...what your afraid companies have the right to defend their products, or for drugs not to be misused or for gambling to be controlled? Give me a break, a company should have the right to actively target sites that profit from selling/distrubuting its products illegally, a country also has the right to its people to make sure the Internet follows its laws if it's going to actively promote or target citizens in that manner.

Here's the problem with the Internet at the moment: there are far to many people thinking they have the right to have all their fingers in all the pies and expect no consequences Just because it's the "Internet"

I'm no saying sopa is the way to go, but your little titbit on Denmark control just shows how OTT or narrow minded some Internet users are and don't understand the bigger picture

i find myself agreeing with everything you have said.

 

[iviv]

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20...r-deny-all-due-process-hide-all-details.shtml

Read that. Then argue that SOPA is a good thing.

Imagine if the US government, with no notice or warning, raided a small but popular magazine's offices over a Thanksgiving weekend, seized the company's printing presses, and told the world that the magazine was a criminal enterprise with a giant banner on their building. Then imagine that it never arrested anyone, never let a trial happen, and filed everything about the case under seal, not even letting the magazine's lawyers talk to the judge presiding over the case. And it continued to deny any due process at all for over a year, before finally just handing everything back to the magazine and pretending nothing happened. I expect most people would be outraged. I expect that nearly all of you would say that's a classic case of prior restraint, a massive First Amendment violation, and exactly the kind of thing that does not, or should not, happen in the United States.

Just the first paragraph, the full story is much longer.

 

[jumpy]

was reading about this earlier on another forum; the general consensus appears to be "US lawyers tend to think that American laws are valid worldwide."

 

[Philtor]

Lets say they did censor the internet would it really be that bad?

Maybe kids will stop playing games then on dodgy websites and start doing something useful.

Less adult material == more horny teenagers out on the street enjoying their lives and banging ACTUAL women instead == less moody teenagers

Less piracy == more money and the economy being damaged less

There will be less tripe on the internet as it'll be cleaned up and anything unworthy of being on there will be gone. Surely this would be for the greater good. It does make some sense to be perfectly honest.

As of current around 99% of the internet is just pure garbage, it really is.

Its in dire need of a clean up and SOPA may help with that.

Sites like Facebook will be sorted out or closed down which will be awesome for everyone. Im sick of the damn site and all the dumb people on their telling me how they're waiting for a bus and its raining and miraculously they're getting wet.

Shut down the internet and only allow it to be used for business or education is my theory.

90% of people on Facebook are just bums that pay Poker or Farmville all day. Get them off Facebook and into work.

Thanks for listening. If you don't agree then please in a non abusive way put forward your argument. Im now going to have my first drink for the holiday.

Peace and God bless xx

'Shut down the internet and only allow it to be used for business or education is my theory'.

Problem with your theory.... it's wrong and reminds me of a dictatorship.

 

[Justintime]

There will be less tripe on the internet

So sad you're going!

 

[Kamwah]

Lets say they did censor the internet would it really be that bad?

Maybe kids will stop playing games then on dodgy websites and start doing something useful.

Less adult material == more horny teenagers out on the street enjoying their lives and banging ACTUAL women instead == less moody teenagers

Less piracy == more money and the economy being damaged less

There will be less tripe on the internet as it'll be cleaned up and anything unworthy of being on there will be gone. Surely this would be for the greater good. It does make some sense to be perfectly honest.

As of current around 99% of the internet is just pure garbage, it really is.

Its in dire need of a clean up and SOPA may help with that.

Sites like Facebook will be sorted out or closed down which will be awesome for everyone. Im sick of the damn site and all the dumb people on their telling me how they're waiting for a bus and its raining and miraculously they're getting wet.

Shut down the internet and only allow it to be used for business or education is my theory.

90% of people on Facebook are just bums that pay Poker or Farmville all day. Get them off Facebook and into work.

Thanks for listening. If you don't agree then please in a non abusive way put forward your argument. Im now going to have my first drink for the holiday.

Peace and God bless xx

Wow, you seem quite mistaken on quite a few things so i'll go through your list.

Yes it would be that bad, next thing they'll want to censor is free speech. (oh wait, they already do that to a certain degree lol)

It's not any of the governments business what a parent lets their kid do in their spare time as long as it's legal. I know there are plenty of kids who do worthwhile things when they're not in school but then I also know some who do absolutely nothing but play games. I don't see any problem with that especially if they're doing well in school.

More teenagers out on the streets enjoying their lives? You mean more teenagers out getting drunk, doing drugs and getting in to trouble? I know that the majority don't do any of the above but if you kicked all the kids out of the house or forced them to do something you thought was worthwhile you're going to get a lot of them fighting back against it.

I'll agree with the fact there would be less piracy but that does not in any way mean more money would be spent on buying what they would have pirated.

It's not up to you or anyone else to decide what's worthy of being on the internet or not, I'm not religious but do you believe the government is a god-like figure? It really isn't, it's closer to the devil. (I'm also not anti-government and everyone makes mistake but they seem to make quite a few). Go to a communist country that controls their populations internet access and find how it's more of a hinderance than help.

So you've added loads of idiots on FB as friends and you're complaining that it's showing up on your news feed? I hope you're aware that you can unfriend people.

Sorry if some of this doesn't make sense, it's 8:54AM and i've been up since this time yesterday =/

 

[Tom0]

Everything that quoted listed is common sense...what your afraid companies have the right to defend their products, or for drugs not to be misused or for gambling to be controlled? Give me a break, a company should have the right to actively target sites that profit from selling/distrubuting its products illegally, a country also has the right to its people to make sure the Internet follows its laws if it's going to actively promote or target citizens in that manner.

Here's the problem with the Internet at the moment: there are far to many people thinking they have the right to have all their fingers in all the pies and expect no consequences Just because it's the "Internet"

I'm no saying sopa is the way to go, but your little titbit on Denmark control just shows how OTT or narrow minded some Internet users are and don't understand the bigger picture

Or you could just let adults makes decisions for themselves and take responsibility for anything illegal or otherwise.

Censorship is fine if it's for the right reasons? Good grief.

 

[iamtheoneneo]

Or you could just let adults makes decisions for themselves and take responsibility for anything illegal or otherwise.

Censorship is fine if it's for the right reasons? Good grief.

It's got nothing to do with letting adults make decisions themselves. We live in a world governed by laws and people have to accept those laws.the Internet for a long time has been getting away with a lot of activities that people would scoff at if it didn't happen around their comfort desks.

Like I said I don't know if sopa is the way forward but clearly the people at the top want something to be done and at present is is the only way they see a solution.
And just because your fav YouTube mini celeb hates on all this doesn't mean it's fundamentally wrong, their just worried that they will no longer be able to a make a living by sitting on their ass.

And censorship? Again your getting a bit ott about it...blocking sites bc they are doing something illegally is not censorship it's protecting the laws on which a country is governed, it doesn't matter if you don't agree with that the law is the law and if you don't like it , either move elsewhere or suck it up.

You talk about adults but seemingly you forget the millions of minors that use the Internet on a daily basis in this scenario, And adults barely take responsibility for their internet actions now let alone minors

 

[Naff8000]

It's got nothing to do with letting adults make decisions themselves. We live in a world governed by laws and people have to accept those laws.the Internet for a long time has been getting away with a lot of activities that people would scoff at if it didn't happen around their comfort desks.

Like I said I don't know if sopa is the way forward but clearly the people at the top want something to be done and at present is is the only way they see a solution.
And just because your fav YouTube mini celeb hates on all this doesn't mean it's fundamentally wrong, their just worried that they will no longer be able to a make a living by sitting on their ass.

Haha God you are blind.