lack or respect for the ref.

rotters

rotters

rotters

Soldato
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why oh why cant footballers behave in front of the ref? ****** and blinding all the time one guy in the game tonight (england v Germany) said your Fing having a joke you waste of space. now i come from a rugby back ground and would have never thought of speaking to a ref ever like that in fact everyone i play with has always just said yes "sir" when asked a question. why oh why is it so different in football. can hardly say that rugby isnt a physical or emotional game now can you?

im slightly disgusted in the way modern day athletes on the football pitch act.
rotters
 
I listened to radio five live's 606 phone in last Saturday/Sunday and this topic was brought up. One guy made a very valid point, that in all rugby games you have these 6ft5 20st guys looking down at a referee half their size, but they have the upmost respect for them and rarely speak out of turn or swear. That level of authority needs to be restored in football, but that can't happen until the level of refereeing in the country improves and harsher punishments are brought in to keep players in line.

I think being a referee in today's footballing climate is a tough job and it should be made easier with technology. But there is a real reluctance to evolve this technology into a form that would bring instant decisions with little stoppage time.
 
I absolutely despise it too. I long for the day when the ref just lines up 8 Man U or Chelsea players (or whichever team ;) ) and just books 8 of them for crowding and abusing the ref. I think only the captain should be allowed to talk to the ref.

Paul
 
tbh im quite glad of the repsonces i though i might get a little flamed. it just does really annoy me. and the captain and the guy who did the fowl should be the only ones your right.



rotters
 
Wasn't sure about posting this as i didn't want to offend anyone but i think the class difference between football and rugby makes a difference; 99% of footballers come from very poor backgrounds where this sort of language may be more common.
 
Jofujofu said:
I absolutely despise it too. I long for the day when the ref just lines up 8 Man U or Chelsea players (or whichever team ;) ) and just books 8 of them for crowding and abusing the ref. I think only the captain should be allowed to talk to the ref.

Paul
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Funnily enough I'm reading Roy Keane's autobiography again, he talks about how they treated Andy D'Urso once:

Next up, Middlesbrough. Another dangerous game if the attitude wasn't right from the off. It wasn't. Our heads were still in Rio. Headlag! Nil-nil and hanging on, Jaap Stam gave away a penalty. In fact, Jaap got a touch on the ball as Juninho dribbled past him. Referee Andy D'Urso got it wrong. We ran at him pleading. He backed off, we kept coming. The photographs of this now notorious incident are shocking. The psycho in the middle with veins bulging in his head is me. Later, I would joke that if Mr D'Urso had stopped running - backwards - we'd have stopped chasing. It's not a joke. I know we were wrong, I the worst offender.

Now I believe that, although he made a human error, Andy D'Urso should never have been subjected to our venom. It was our fault the score was 0-0. That was why I raged, against our own crippling complacency, which was now compounded by the ref's mistake. Mr D'Urso was just a whipping boy and that is completely out of order. That's the rational explanation. Unfortunately, you don't contest games in a reasonable frame of mind. At the level Manchester United must compete at football is savage, cruel, relentlessly punishing. There are no free lunches - and there was no soft landing after Brazil. This we learned the hard way. Fortunately, Juninho's penalty was saved by Mark Bosnich. Becks scored the winner three minutes from time.

After that game we woke up, only losing one of our last seventeen League matches. In that sole defeat, 0-3 at Newcastle, I was sent off for receiving two yellow cards, one for dissent, the second for a foul I didn't commit. In a way, justice for Andy D'Urso. Fair enough.
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With the D'Urso incident in mind i certainly think intimidation plays a big part as to why its done. Refs have previously said that this doesn't affect them but im of no doubt that it does; thinking back to '05 where we had a clear penalty not given vs Chelsea around 10 mins before half time and our players surrounded the ref in a similar style to the D'Urso incident and up until half-time we got every decision our way, Sunday was possibly another incident of this.
 
Players are under huge pressure and all it takes is for one poor decision by a referee for them to explode. I think there would be less hassling the referee if the quality of refereeing was higher in the first place. That said, I don't like it when players swear needlessly at the referee, it serves no purpose at all. Rooney springs to mind, Terry too. There's just no need for it.
 
Referee's don't help themselves though.

We've had referee's try and act the 'Big I Am', notably Poll and Winter, though I'd certainly say a lot more are guilty of this too. The problem being they don't give reasonable explanation, instead opting to wave players away without actually informing them or conversing with them.

One referee not guilty of ever playing the 'Big I Am' is Howard Webb, who also just happens to be the best referee in the Premiership. By a mile.
 
Completely agree with Nokkon, for me though Steve Bennett is by far the worst; had he not been a ref he would have been a traffic warden.
 
Raise the money to refs to what players one and they wont need to retire early and write articles for football, refs should have every game recorded and players should be banned for "heat of the moment" comments.

The saying play to referrers whistle went out the window in the 80s
 
Steve Bennett is already a millionaire through his building company. I doubt money would have an effect on his judgement...oh but there was that one time last year when Abramovich give him a nice big wad of cash for contract work....
 
Linoge said:
Steve Bennett is already a millionaire through his building company. I doubt money would have an effect on his judgement...oh but there was that one time last year when Abramovich give him a nice big wad of cash for contract work....
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Your thinking about Rob Styles who done Abramovich's driveway for him.
 
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Linoge said:
Funnily enough I'm reading Roy Keane's autobiography again, he talks about how they treated Andy D'Urso once:
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Funnily enough, thats the incident I always think of when I think of ref's being harrassed :)

You mentioned Rooney in a post above also. He's an absolute disgrace. No kid should look up to him. For his football ability, yes. For everything else? I can't think of much to be honest. He really is a disgrace on the pitch.

I agree the quality of ref's should be better, but I can't help but feel sorry for them when the TV coverage highlights every single tiny little mistake they make. They must be under so much pressure. I also understand the pressure the players are under, everyone wants to win. But sometimes there is no excuse for their behaviour.

@rotters: I'm not a massive rugby fan, but football could learn a lot from rugby, and it wouldn't take much to put it in the game. I don't think you'll get many people disagreeing with your original post.

Paul
 
Jofujofu said:
I agree the quality of ref's should be better, but I can't help but feel sorry for them when the TV coverage highlights every single tiny little mistake they make. They must be under so much pressure. I also understand the pressure the players are under, everyone wants to win. But sometimes there is no excuse for their behaviour.
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It's justified. Any professional is put under the spotlight and should own up to errors or have someone criticise them for faults. Players get it, why shouldn't referees?
 
NokkonWud said:
It's justified. Any professional is put under the spotlight and should own up to errors or have someone criticise them for faults. Players get it, why shouldn't referees?
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if its justified why dont rugby players explode when a ref makes a mistake. i have never witnessed "ganging" up on a rugby ref for a mistake.

and the pressures to succeed are just the same.

rotters
 
Rugby Union officials have some advatages over Footy Refs that make their job easier to control the game, I feel.

Firstly the culture of Rugby Union which has only been profesional for 12 years hasn't quite slipped into the win at all costs mindset yet (although we are seeing a gradual increase in the amount of back chat being thrown at a ref by certain players)

Secondly the sanctions a referee is allowed to use for innapropriate behaviour give him more 'effective' power, these begin with the 'Walk 10' where if the referee is unhappy with comments that have been made after the award of a free kick or penalty the infringement is moved 10 metres closer to the offending team. A yellow card and 10 minutes in the bin can also be used (although very rare in this case) for foul and abusive language. Penalties can be reversed (which I've seen in a Gloucester-Northampton match a few years ago when a Northampton player tried to get a Gloucester player sent to the bin for killing the ball on a Northampton attack in the Glaws 22). Players can also be cited after a match for abuse of match officials either directly or through the media. What ever sanction a referee chooses to use in most cases either lead to a direct scoring opportunity, field position which gives the possibility of a scoring opportunity, the loss of field position when attacking or the chance of going down one man for 10 minutes which can be worth between 3-10 points in Elite standard games. In Rugby terms these are extremely important as it takes a lot of work to get up the field.

Thirdly the use of Television footage in deciding the validity of a Try if the referee is unsure takes a little pressure off him and his Touch Judges when needing to make some of the 'Difficult' decisions, although this isn't fool proof as in the last few years TMOs have made a few blunders.


rotters, don't think there's no swearing at the ref from the players in Rugby, when you're at a match that's selling Reflink it can be very enlightening ;)
 
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TheMightyTen said:
Rugby Union officials have some advatages over Footy Refs that make their job easier to control the game, I feel.

Firstly the culture of Rugby Union which has only been profesional for 12 years hasn't quite slipped into the win at all costs mindset yet (although we are seeing a gradual increase in the amount of back chat being thrown at a ref by certain players)

Secondly the sanctions a referee is allowed to use for innapropriate behaviour give him more 'effective' power, these begin with the 'Walk 10' where if the referee is unhappy with comments that have been made after the award of a free kick or penalty the infringement is moved 10 metres closer to the offending team. A yellow card and 10 minutes in the bin can also be used (although very rare in this case) for foul and abusive language. Penalties can be reversed (which I've seen in a Gloucester-Northampton match a few years ago when a Northampton player tried to get a Gloucester player sent to the bin for killing the ball on a Northampton attack in the Glaws 22). Players can also be cited after a match for abuse of match officials either directly or through the media. What ever sanction a referee chooses to use in most cases either lead to a direct scoring opportunity, field position which gives the possibility of a scoring opportunity, the loss of field position when attacking or the chance of going down one man for 10 minutes which can be worth between 3-10 points in Elite standard games. In Rugby terms these are extremely important as it takes a lot of work to get up the field.

Thirdly the use of Television footage in deciding the validity of a Try if the referee is unsure takes a little pressure off him and his Touch Judges when needing to make some of the 'Difficult' decisions, although this isn't fool proof as in the last few years TMOs have made a few blunders.


rotters, don't think there's no swearing at the ref from the players in Rugby, when you're at a match that's selling Reflink it can be very enlightening ;)
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I'd agree with all that, although in general the swearing you see when players are speaking to referees is more of the form:

'He was on the wrong side of the ******* ruck'

Than the string of profanities shouted directly at the referee you often see in football.

One other big advantage rugby has is the large number of natural breaks in play. You often see players absolutely fuming when the whistle goes for a penalty, knock-on etc, but the referee just sends them all away and then calls the captain and relevant players over. I think those few seconds players have to wait before speaking to the referee allows plenty of them to cool down a bit.
 
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