Noob question - Why can't we just have one lead to TV and then one lead to Amp?

[Richeh]

I don't know of any TV's that would send HD Audio over the HDMI ARC channel. Have only ever seen Dolby Digital and in some cases (not all) DTS. Just double check on whichever TV you buy.

Thread was entertaining though. I understand why the OP wants to do what he does and am glad a couple of people have supported his way......but its still the opposite of what I would say 98% of users who have an amp/receiver do

Best of luck.

 

[red eye]

Why not? My receiver turns on with my TV, the TV's own speakers are never used because that's the whole point of having decent audio equipment.

this, even my second TVs connected to pc 2.1 setup. Tv speakers sound like Honda civics with fartybox exhaust

 

[NeilF]

OK... Setting up the new amp then, an Onkyo 646 (managed to buy about the last one in the country )

I noticed the following:-

Sky --> HDMI --> TV (Panasonic GT30) --> ARC --> AMP

I can indeed hear the audio from Sky thru the amp, and the TVs volume turns the amp up and down, instead of the TVs... Nice. Note: It reads as PCM on the amp.

HOWEVER, that's with the Sky's HDMI output set to stereo. If I instead set it to "DOLBY D", goodbye sound! It no longer works! So I have to set the Sky box's HDMI output to stereo.

I've got an optical feed from the Sky box to the Amp, and that I can see is giving me Dolby Digital Sound (displayed on the amp).



So I think the ARC from the Panasonic to the Amp is only capable of dishing out stereo?! But from what other people say, maybe more modern TVs can dish out, pass through better formats (than just stereo)?

 

[Psycho Sonny]

OK... Setting up the new amp then, an Onkyo 646 (managed to buy about the last one in the country )

I noticed the following:-

Sky --> HDMI --> TV (Panasonic GT30) --> ARC --> AMP

I can indeed hear the audio from Sky thru the amp, and the TVs volume turns the amp up and down, instead of the TVs... Nice. Note: It reads as PCM on the amp.

HOWEVER, that's with the Sky's HDMI output set to stereo. If I instead set it to "DOLBY D", goodbye sound! It no longer works! So I have to set the Sky box's HDMI output to stereo.

I've got an optical feed from the Sky box to the Amp, and that I can see is giving me Dolby Digital Sound (displayed on the amp).



So I think the ARC from the Panasonic to the Amp is only capable of dishing out stereo?! But from what other people say, maybe more modern TVs can dish out, pass through better formats (than just stereo)?

99% of tv's can only pass through stereo that is why nobody connects to the tv first then the amp

i cannot believe nobody has said this before in the thread. it's why nobody uses the type of setup your suggesting.

tv's aren't built to decode/encode various sound signals, amps however are. it would increase the cost of the tv's by quite a lot and also the DAC doing the encoding/decoding would need to be of a high quality otherwise your going to end up with crap sound. this is why you always go AMP first.

look at the manual of your tv for more info. even high end tv's cannot pass through certain formats. that is why nobody uses that type of setup.

inputs --> AMP --> TV

also AMP's are built in with a pass through function when in standby. so tv will still get audio/video when AMP is off. you don't need your AMP on all the time just when you want to use your seperates.

so it would be ridiculous to set it up any other way.

it helps in these situations if you list your tv so we can look at the manual and show you exactly where it says it can only pass through stereo. but i'm pretty confident most tv's only pass through stereo through optical out. HDMI Arc they may pass more formats but again not all will be supported.

basically connect to amp first. also you won't get any lag if you do this.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

http://www.manualslib.com/manual/246432/Panasonic-Tc-P55gt30.html?page=63#manual

there you go only supports PCM and dolby digital out.

DTS, etc won't work

 

[TheVoice]

i cannot believe nobody has said this before in the thread.

Try reading it then.

 

[NeilF]

http://www.manualslib.com/manual/246432/Panasonic-Tc-P55gt30.html?page=63#manual

there you go only supports PCM and dolby digital out.

DTS, etc won't work

Yes, that makes sense...

And hopefully as/when I buy a new TV over the next 6-12 months it will work akin to how some other users have reported, where obvious non-Stereo output it piped out/handled by the TV...

 

[NeilF]

i cannot believe nobody has said this before in the thread. it's why nobody uses the type of setup your suggesting.

tv's aren't built to decode/encode various sound signals, amps however are. it would increase the cost of the tv's by quite a lot and also the DAC doing the encoding/decoding would need to be of a high quality otherwise your going to end up with crap sound. this is why you always go AMP first.

That has been the majority view on the thread, although a couple of members have suggested their TVs happily pass through/process more exotic formats that stereo... ie: Dobly can get passed through the TV to the Amp. Hence me reporting back on my failure..

also AMP's are built in with a pass through function when in standby. so tv will still get audio/video when AMP is off. you don't need your AMP on all the time just when you want to use your seperates.

Which is what I've set mine to do.... It passed though in my case the bluray player...

aso it would be ridiculous to set it up any other way

Can't agree with that...

In my head, in a cost/complexity is no object, all devices ----> TV --- ARC ----> AMP is the most straight forward & friendly. ie: What ever you're watching on the TV, is what your AMP is fed.... and your AMP never has to change channel (except for non-HDMI related feeds). But I can understand this not being the case given costs for said processing/functionality etc.

 

[Bluecube]

Your amp may not have to change channel but you'll have to change your TV input depending on whether you're watching Sky, a DVD, console, etc. You've bought a decent and capable amp so really you should use it as it should be used in order to get all the benefits of having a surround sound amp.

 

[lude1962]

Can't agree with that...

In my head, in a cost/complexity is no object, all devices ----> TV --- ARC ----> AMP is the most straight forward & friendly. ie: What ever you're watching on the TV, is what your AMP is fed.... and your AMP never has to change channel (except for non-HDMI related feeds). But I can understand this not being the case given costs for said processing/functionality etc.

Say you have BR , sky/freesat, xbox, htpc, pc, fire tv, thats 6 devices all with a hdmi going to the tv, so 7 hdmi cables connected to the tv (not very eye friendly). At the end of the day the tv is just a monitor.

Why didn't you buy an avr with a night mode?

 

[NeilF]

Say you have BR , sky/freesat, xbox, htpc, pc, fire tv, thats 6 devices all with a hdmi going to the tv, so 7 hdmi cables connected to the tv (not very eye friendly). At the end of the day the tv is just a monitor.

Understood... But still

Why didn't you buy an avr with a night mode?

I don't know... Why am I interested in a night mode?

 

[Psycho Sonny]

modern tv's won't pass through everything even top of the range ones. google the manual of any tv you are thinking of buying and have a read through it. manufacturers are trying to cut costs and increase margins there is no need for them to add in this functionality at all. tv's aren't built for this purpose, they are built to show a picture and use built in speakers.

having 6 HDMI leads going into a tv would also be crazy as others have suggested. have 6 go into an AVR and then 1 into the TV. it's the cleanest setup. especially when more and more people are wall mounting imagine having 6 cables dangling from a tv it's madness.

if you have a decent AVR you can also take advantage of it's fancy upscaling features, it can also control both audio and video. whereas if you send to the tv first and your using some processing your risking causing lag with the sound which your unable to fix because the tv is being fed first.

 

[NeilF]

I have discovered one little downside...

My preferred use for the amp is, it needs to be manually turned on for it to be used. ie: While we're watching TV/Sky etc most of the time, I'm more than happy with the TV speakers, so don't want the amp on.

So I have:-
Sky HDMI --> TV HDMI 1
Sky Optical --> Amp

Bluray HDMI --> Amp
Media Player --> Amp

Amp --> TV HDMI 2



So if I turn the Sky box on, the TV auto switches... Nice...

If I turn the bluray on... It doesn't auto switch. Instead I need to change the TV to HDMI 2, where I then get stereo sound automatically through the amp (in standby mode) to the TV! Nice! If I turn the amp on, the tv volume automatically turns off, and I get full audio though the amp. And the TV volume even controls the amp then. More nice!

So the only thing I've lost is the auto switching to the bluray when it's turned on. I'm not sure if this is a limitation or something I can setup? Ideally I'd like it (as used to happen) if I turned the sky or bluray on, the TV autoswitched... No longer happens with the bluray now.

It's of course no biggy to have to manually switch the TVs source to HDMI2 to watch a bluray, but it's a shame for the kids to have to faff about, where it used to be automatic

I've had a play, and cant overcome it.. I'll have another play I guess another day... Worse case, it's a minor annoyance

 

[Bluecube]

None of my devices plugged into the amp will cause the TV to autoswitch to the HDMI from the amp. I'm sure it can be done but I've never been able to figure out how.

 

[TheVoice]

I still don't understand the logic of faffing with all this when seemingly you're using the crap TV speakers most of the time anyway. The amp should just turn on with the TV so you get good audio all the time. I fail to see why what you're watching at the time matters.

 

[NeilF]

I still don't understand the logic of faffing with all this when seemingly you're using the crap TV speakers most of the time anyway. The amp should just turn on with the TV so you get good audio all the time.

I don't understand why some people holiday in Blackpool. I don't understand why some people enjoy bird watching. I don't get jazz at all... But I understand some people do


Most of the time, myself, kids and partner just want to turn on the TV and watch it in the simplest way possible. We're not worried about 600W of sound.

And given the kids are often watching it, why bother with the amp just for Sponge Bob? Or for the news? Or for celebrity custard pie bake off?


In short, the amp is not required 99% of the time, so I simply don't want - to use the words of a wise man's words - to faff about with it

I fail to see why what you're watching at the time matters.

The largest viewing time is Sky. Let's say 95%. The next biggest is probably DVDs/blurays on the bluray player, often with the kids.

So in an ideal world - and what was happening when the bluray was HDMI'd staight into the TV - is you'd turn on the bluray player and the TV would automatically switch to it. And whwn you turned off the bluray, the TV would autoswitch back to Sky.

Under the new setup (see #93), alas this doesn't happen anymore. No biggy... Just a shame...


The beauty of the new system is that the sound from the bluray goes to the tv in stereo automatically (through the idle amp)... And if you simply turn the amp on, it then automatically takes over and you get nice surround sound with the TV volume controlling the amp. Turn the amp off again, and back to stereo TV sound. That's lovely!

Anyway, I'm not overly fussed as the idea is to get a new 4K TV 50-55" in the next 6-12 months or so... So I'll revisit all this then

 

[Puzzled]

I still don't understand the logic of faffing with all this when seemingly you're using the crap TV speakers most of the time anyway. The amp should just turn on with the TV so you get good audio all the time. I fail to see why what you're watching at the time matters.

I'm with the OP on this, for more normal TV viewing I don't want to faff about with the amp.

Plus maybe mine is setup wrong but I've never heard a surround sound package that sounds "normal" for standard TV. Say watching the news for example, it just sounds odd.

Movies, Gaming, Music - those are the things I got the amp for. Normal day to day TV is just fine through the telly speakers.

It's a shame TV's can't just do a straight pass-through for audio without all the licensing requirements as that would expand on connectivity for me.

 

[pepp77]

And that is why amps have passthrough modes, so you set it up the same way for amp sound or TV sound. Amp on you get amp sound, amp off you get TV sound.

 

[james.miller]

Surround packages shouldn't sound odd full stop. Yeah they might doing your trying to listen to the news with thx cinema processing or something, but that's what stereo sound is for. If a surround sound package sounds odd, there's a setting somewhere that isn't correct. Or it's just a rubbish package.

 

[bledd]

This thread is like ice skating uphill