Noob question - Why can't we just have one lead to TV and then one lead to Amp?

pepp77 said:
And that is why amps have passthrough modes, so you set it up the same way for amp sound or TV sound. Amp on you get amp sound, amp off you get TV sound.
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Let's pretend we have a TV which can do the following:-
- Pass through any sound format fed to it.
- Convert any sound format to stereo (for its own speakers).

With such a setup, you'd simply feed all devices to the TV, and pass a single HDMI (ARC) lead to the amp.

Pros:-
- The TV would most likely auto switch more logically than an amp would. ie: Switch a device on, and teh TV would change to it automatically.
- You'd automatically get stereo sound from the TV.
- Turn the amp on, and you instead get full sound from the amp.
- As the amp only has one input (from the TV) related to all visual sources, it would rarely need its channel changed.
- Change input device (source) on the TV remote, the sound follows suit. (ie: The amps remote might actually be unused).

Cons:-
- A lot of HDMI leads to the TV instead of the amp.


The above seems a better solution to what we have now. For example at the moment:-
- Turning on devices does not auto switch the channel on the TV to it.
- Turning on devices does not auto switch the channel on the Amp.
- You need to use the amp's remote to change source. Or buy a programmable remote to overcome this.


Now, I understand the first solution isn't possible because of cost/complexity implications... But it doesn't mean it wouldn't offer a better solution :)


From my understanding of the pass through mode on my 646 - tell me if I'm wrong - it's set to a specific source. ie: If I turn on device 1 and that is set to pass throught... Great, that goes to the TV! But if I turn on device 2? I'd need to take manual control of the amp etc. With the initial proposal, that wouldn't be in issue.

In my OP I had hoped my wiring/setup might have been made easier by such an ARC solution... Clearly it's not possible though, so I'll just make do with wiring through the amp and the couple of minor querks that means :) No biggy :)
 
Now, I understand the first solution isn't possible because of cost/complexity implications... But it doesn't mean it wouldn't offer a better solution

you're also forgetting that the said tv will be bigger and bulkier, min 6 port in hdmi board, sound processing board larger psu, means to get rid of the extra heat generated.
Hardly a selling point 'come buy our new big fat tv'.
 
lude1962 said:
Now, I understand the first solution isn't possible because of cost/complexity implications... But it doesn't mean it wouldn't offer a better solution

you're also forgetting that the said tv will be bigger and bulkier, min 6 port in hdmi board, sound processing board larger psu, means to get rid of the extra heat generated.
Hardly a selling point 'come buy our new big fat tv'.
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Maybe :)

In my case I have enough inputs on my old GT30 for more than my needs (Bluray, Sky, Mediaplayer). I'd suggest for most people 4-5 HMDI inputs is more than enough.

As for bulky processing... I'd suggest an audio decoding chip is a few quid most likely. Consider what a rasberry pi can do. I expect the major cost is maybe licensing etc? And there's probably stupid copyright protection laws that seem to deem pushing DTS etc out of your TV as not permitted? Or something like that :)

ps: But I can see the appeal of one HDMI lead going to a TV instead of 3-4...
 
Answer to this thread is :

1) If your TV has an ARC channel, connect your bluray to the TV, and TV to the amp. Audio from the bluray will get sent to the amp via the TV if it's turned on.

2) If your amp has pass through, connect your bluray to your amp, and TV to the amp. If the amp is off the bluray audio/video will pass through to the TV.

Why is this a 3 page thread? :P
 
mid_gen said:
Answer to this thread is :

1) If your TV has an ARC channel, connect your bluray to the TV, and TV to the amp. Audio from the bluray will get sent to the amp via the TV if it's turned on.

2) If your amp has pass through, connect your bluray to your amp, and TV to the amp. If the amp is off the bluray audio/video will pass through to the TV.

Why is this a 3 page thread? :P
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(1) Alas, if I try that it won't work. I tried that with Sky, and the TV will only accept stereo audio. If I instead pass in Dolby Digital, I get no audio from the TV. Someone commented earlier my TV only pushes out stereo down ARC - Although when I looked I'm sure it mentioned DD to!? But anyway there's problem :)

(2) This is what I've done. But it introduces problems which my proposed "what if ARC was wonderful solution" would solve:-
  • If you switch on the bluray, the TV does not autoswitch to that source. Whereas with the HDMI leads plugged drectly into the TV, it does.
  • If you have other devices such as a media streamer, you have no choice but to turn the amp on, change source, and use the amp speakers. ie: With the "what if ARC was wonderful solution", you'd just turn the steamer on, most likely the TV would auto switch to it, you'd get stereo sound through the TV, unless you turned the amp on.

;)
 
NeilFawcett said:
Let's pretend we have a TV which can do the following:-
- Pass through any sound format fed to it.
- Convert any sound format to stereo (for its own speakers).

With such a setup, you'd simply feed all devices to the TV, and pass a single HDMI (ARC) lead to the amp.

Pros:-
- The TV would most likely auto switch more logically than an amp would. ie: Switch a device on, and teh TV would change to it automatically.
- You'd automatically get stereo sound from the TV.
- Turn the amp on, and you instead get full sound from the amp.
- As the amp only has one input (from the TV) related to all visual sources, it would rarely need its channel changed.
- Change input device (source) on the TV remote, the sound follows suit. (ie: The amps remote might actually be unused).

Cons:-
- A lot of HDMI leads to the TV instead of the amp.


The above seems a better solution to what we have now. For example at the moment:-
- Turning on devices does not auto switch the channel on the TV to it.
- Turning on devices does not auto switch the channel on the Amp.
- You need to use the amp's remote to change source. Or buy a programmable remote to overcome this.


Now, I understand the first solution isn't possible because of cost/complexity implications... But it doesn't mean it wouldn't offer a better solution :)


From my understanding of the pass through mode on my 646 - tell me if I'm wrong - it's set to a specific source. ie: If I turn on device 1 and that is set to pass throught... Great, that goes to the TV! But if I turn on device 2? I'd need to take manual control of the amp etc. With the initial proposal, that wouldn't be in issue.

In my OP I had hoped my wiring/setup might have been made easier by such an ARC solution... Clearly it's not possible though, so I'll just make do with wiring through the amp and the couple of minor querks that means :) No biggy :)
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But if youve got a half decent amp, you only need to leave the tv on the same hdmi channel as you select the input on the amp. I know the ps4 has the option to switch to its particular input on the amp if i want it enabled. My setup involves picking up the sky remote, pressing tv then power (this turns on tv and amp and flicks to sky input), then pressing the sky button which turns on the sky box its hardly difficult or involves much button pressing.
 
theone8181 said:
But if youve got a half decent amp, you only need to leave the tv on the same hdmi channel as you select the input on the amp. I know the ps4 has the option to switch to its particular input on the amp if i want it enabled. My setup involves picking up the sky remote, pressing tv then power (this turns on tv and amp and flicks to sky input), then pressing the sky button which turns on the sky box its hardly difficult or involves much button pressing.
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Well, this maybe complicated by the fact that I do not want the amp on most of the time. As I've previously mentioned, I only want the amp on for "events". eg: Watching a film on the bluray or media streamer. I don't want it on while just watching TV or Sky generally.

So I have my wiring as follows:-
Sky HDMI --> TV HDMI 1
Sky Optical --> Amp

Bluray HDMI --> Amp
Media Player HDMI --> Amp

Amp --> TV HDMI 2 (ARC)​

So if I turn Sky on! Bingo! My TV auto changes to it (HDMI 1). But if I turn the bluray on, or turn the amp on, the TV does not change to it (HDMI 2). I have to manually intervene. Which is a shame. I didn't used to have to do this with the HDMI leads straight into the TV :)

The amp is quite happy passing through the bluray to the TV in stand by mode (with stereo audio too!). Which is great! It's just that I have to manually change to HDMI2 on the TV (now) so as to view the bluray/amp feed.

If the amp could be told (while in stand by) to switch automatically to the appropriate input (eg: sky, bluray, media streamer) in some order of priority (if they're on) then I could in theory pass everything though the amp to the TV. But I believe (I'd love it if I'm wrong!), I can only define a default (single) source for the amp's pass through.
 
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I still dont understand why you dont want the amp on. what you are suggesting instead is to leave the amp off and instead of having everything plug in to the amp (which will almost always be in the same cabinet/vicinity as the other components), you want to run multiple feeds to the tv instead and have that hooked up to the amp.

Very few people are going to want to do that. People who have their tvs mounted on a wall, for example - are they going to want to run 1 hdmi cable or 6x of them?

What's the issues with just leaving the amp on? it all works, it doesnt need a load of stuff plugged in to the tv. I dont get it?
 
james.miller said:
I still dont understand why you dont want the amp on. what you are suggesting instead is to leave the amp off and instead of having everything plug in to the amp (which will almost always be in the same cabinet/vicinity as the other components), you want to run multiple feeds to the tv instead and have that hooked up to the amp.

Very few people are going to want to do that. People who have their tvs mounted on a wall, for example - are they going to want to run 1 hdmi cable or 6x of them?

What's the issues with just leaving the amp on? it all works, it doesnt need a load of stuff plugged in to the tv. I dont get it?
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Because I don't want too... I don't want a device sitting in my cabinet needlessly being used for Sky news, Spongebob Square Pants and Celebrity Four In A Bed Bakeoff... :)

I turn my amp on literally once a week (or less)... And that works fine for me :)
 
NeilFawcett said:
Because I don't want too... I don't want a device sitting in my cabinet needlessly being used for Sky news, Spongebob Square Pants and Celebrity Four In A Bed Bakeoff... :)

I turn my amp on literally once a week (or less)... And that works fine for me :)
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I dont want to.


is that literally it? you're not doing it for heat or power consumption or anything else? you just dont want to?

Bizzare. I use mine for everything but then it's properly set up and calibrated. press a button on the remote and bamp, amp switchs on, right source is selected, tv comes on, auto switches to the amp input. it just works. easy peasy, no fuss. I cannot imagine any scenario where i'd want to make it more difficult and clunky.

NeilFawcett said:
JanxSpirit said:
Then consider replacing your AV amplifier with one that has a volume control so that 600W isn't always compulsory.
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I see what you did there... Humour yes?
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Well you might take it as sarcasm but it's a valid point. you said you dont need 600w, well your amp wont be pushing 600watts. nowhere near it. not even 1/4 of it. Probably not a 1/6th of it.
 
*ignore* I misread the manual... I thought it implied it could auto switch source in stand by for pass through. It can't. It's hardcode to a specific source only :( Oh well... Minor niggle.
 
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james.miller said:
You're not doing it for heat or power consumption or anything else? you just dont want to?
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Those are two good reasons :)

As I said, I'm not fussed about the amp'd sound 99% of the time the TV is being used, so why have it on - It is in an enclosed AV unit so heat is a concern TBH! Be horrid (IMHO) to have the amp sitting there in use for 10hrs, when in truth it's just not needed! Same for the speakers & woofer too.
 
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Can't everyone have a setup that suits thier particular needs instead of insisting it's wrong because it's not exactly the same as thier own!

Just saying! :p
 
bemaniac said:
Just do an optical from the tv to amp. I have 4 sources and 1 cable to amp only.
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Not sure that will gain me anything?

eg: With the Skybox plugged into the TV, I have to set it to stereo audio down HDMI. If I set it to Dolby Digital, then the TV plays no audio...

So I'll have to stick with an optical from the Sky box to the amp, and if I really want to listen to Sky in surround - which is very rarely - I'll simply achieve it that way :)



+ TBH, I'm not quite sure what the purpose of the optical connection is on the TV... ie: What purpose it's actually meant to serve/when!? The manual does not imply it's meant to be used with HDMI related inputs to pass audio out.
 
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