Old skool RPGs - Really that good or just nostalgia?

[psychas]

fallout 2 , deus ex are probably best one and baldurs gate , i dont think we will top them any time soon, as graphics requires lots of people to work on these days and storys gets pushed a side.

 

[davewhite04]

I love RPGs, which is why I'm so keen to try and discover more about the ones I missed. If, like me, you read a lot on the web about gaming, you'll know that there's a huge amount of praise for these old RPGs and that many gamers claim they are still the best representation of the genre, despite being 10 years old. However, having tried a few of the popular ones myself I'm left wondering what all the fuss is about and so naturally I'm left thinking that maybe it's just all nostalgia. I know there are a few people that have picked up old games for the first time recently and instantly liked them, but I think these are rare cases.

Personally, I think you talk a lot of sense and have genuinely tried to get into BG.

However you efforts mirror mine until I got in the mood(Was bored of all my current games) and spent quite a bit of time on BG II, then something clicked and it was fantastic, all the classics of today(mass effect, kotor, fallout 3 etc.) seemed very shallow in comparison, don't ask me why, I think I've more than covered it.

I haven't give up on current RPGs however, and will be playing Fallout: Vegas.

 

[strumpusplunket]

Maybe it also depends how far your gaming experience in general goes? I myself missed BGI and II first time around, along with most other RPGs of that period due to not having a PC at the time. However, even though I didn't get a proper PC until 2001 or so, I had started out obsessing over Might and Magic, Dragonlance Adventures, Dungeon Master and Eye of the Beholder on my old Amiga.

So for me, when I went back to try BG earlier this year, it was a bit like coming home. It just instantly felt great, and I was hooked despite the dated visuals. However, if you've had no experience at all of CRPGs of that era, I can kind of get how it would be hard to get into them.

I mean, when we played them first time around it wasn't like there was anything else to raise our expectations for graphics, sound, and gameplay features. I thought nothing of mapping out vast areas of Might and Magic II on graph paper, but only because that's the way it was. I wouldn't expect anyone raised on modern games to see that as anything but an almighty chore!

So for me, I didn't have nostalgia specifically for BG, and I loved it anyway. But I did have nostalgia for (or at least prior experience of) that era of gaming and the way CRPGs used to be. I think it's easy to confuse those two factors.

 

[Richdog]

Are the older RPGs really that good that their gameplay outweighs the graphics and presentation of the modern games, or is all this old skool lovin' just nostalgia and the people recommending these games do so based purely on distant fond memories?

I guess it all boils down to the simple fact that I can't see how someone can sit there playing a game like Baldur's Gate when there's games like Oblivion and Dragon Age.

Should people playing these games for the first time be expected to look past such things and try to enjoy the game's finer features? Or is the ugly truth that if you didn't play these games when they were current then you just won't enjoy them?

Given that post and your comments about graphics over gameplay, it's probably pointless to eplain to you why they were so great. However, imagine playing a book you really love, and you will come somewhere close to understanding what it was all about.

 

[HangTime]

It sounds to me like your disregarding the upper tier of a genre or a specific game without a) giving it a chance b) not playing the game.

No not disregarding it at all, I've got the BG/Icewind Dale games but just haven't got round to playing them yet. Doesn't mean I will never play them but I have a huge back catalogue to work through, as I mentioned I play a lot of older games so one day I may get the time. Impression I get is that you need to dedicate a lot of hours to those sort of games.

Yes maybe I could have given PT a bit more of a chance (same for Neverwinter Nights, I genuinely did give up on that too quickly as the UI wasn't that bad) but the point we are making is that some older RPGs don't really do themselves any favours in terms of encouraging players to give them a chance.

Did you used the widescreen mod at all? Like BG, the GUI doesn't scale very well, and from what I understand if you set the res to high it becomes a bit unusable. But, I'm just basing my experience on BG mods, Torment is one I still need to play and will do soon.

No I didn't have a widescreen monitor at the time but I did use some kind of mod for higher resolution I think. May have been better GUI wise if I'd just played in 640x480 or whatever.

Just out of pure curiosity, why do you set the graphics so low?

Visibility, it's a very fast paced game so you can't afford to get distracted or confused.

 

[dmxdex2020]

The current RPGS like oblivion fallout 3 and dragon age out of the box i cannot stand. All modded up they are a different and more fun game all together.

 

[Narj]

I thought NWN was awesome tbh. I even used to run a persistent world of my own... Sooo many late nights coding and building, it ruined my social life...

 

[Porcelina]

I think it is a point well made that the GUI of Planescape: Torment has not aged well. In fact it was the worst aspect of the game to begin with, and it is clear that the development and advances in that area have made games just more fun to play.

I think it is easy to forgive this for PS:T if you played it back in the day and you were not used to having better. It almost becomes a bit of a charming oddity of the game. However you can see that Black Isle were not really happy with it as they put a lot of thought and effort into improving this aspect of the game as they developed and assisted in developing Icewind Dale and Baldur's Gate.

 

[Porcelina]

Haven't played BG yet but for me Planescape Torment was a good example of usability being compromised, the UI just seemed a bit small and nothing gripped me about the start of the game enough to warrant keeping playing, maybe a bit more guidance might have helped.

Again just to reiterate we aren't saying "If it doesn't look like a DX12 tech demo I ain't playing", I play plenty of old games that look 'awful' in the eyes of some. For example the main game I play is Quakeworld which was released in 1996 and even then I have the graphics turned down below default levels so if anything it looks closer to Doom. Games like Deus Ex seem fine to me even though if you showed it to a gamer brought up on the current generation of consoles they would probably laugh in your face. I'd say probably at least 40% of the games I start playing are over a year old (and many much more than 1 year old).

I think it is a point well made that the GUI of Planescape: Torment has not aged well. In fact it was the worst aspect of the game to begin with, and it is clear that the development and advances in that area have made games just more fun to play.

I think it is easy to forgive this for PS:T if you played it back in the day and you were not used to having better. It almost becomes a bit of a charming oddity of the game. However you can see that Black Isle were not really happy with it as they put a lot of thought and effort into improving this aspect of the game as they developed and assisted in developing Icewind Dale and Baldur's Gate.

 

[Sycho]

Is Risen any good? thinking of buying it....i loved Oblivion/ME 1+2/The Witcher/Dragon Age.

 

[Ravenger]

Risen is ok. It's much less hand-holdy than the other RPGs you mentioned. Voice acting is poor, and the journal for tracking quests is a bit confusing - I've got stuck numerous times and it's difficult sometimes to work out what to do next.

Definitely worth getting if you like 3rd person RPG's though.

 

[simpletom]

Just playing Fallout 2 at the moment. I missed it first time around and, well, it is okay. The interface is hideous, it needs a fan patch to address a myriad of bugs and it obviously does not translate well to modern systems.

I will continue with it though.

 

[strumpusplunket]

Is Risen any good? thinking of buying it....i loved Oblivion/ME 1+2/The Witcher/Dragon Age.

As Ravenger says, it's okay. Pretty open, but much less so and with a much smaller and less interesting world than Piranha Bytes earlier games. Melee combat has been improved a bit, but magic I found much less satisfying than their earlier ones.

Whilst I would recommend Risen for a decent open first-person RPG experience, I'd argue that Gothic 3 with the Ultimate Community Patch applied is a far superior game in absolutely every way. Bigger, more open, deeper, better levelling options and variety, and with a more engaging story-world.

Gothic 3 plus UCP is IMHO the best first-person/over-the-shoulder sword-and-sorcery RPG since Morrowind (yes, I am arguing that it's better than Oblivion...!)