Plug-in solar / Balcony solar / DIY solar
- Thread starter SkyTerran
- Start date
Considering either a normal install or whack a couple of panels up, feed it through a wall to a solar generator/battery of some description then inverter into the wall. They can't come up with these new rules quick enough!
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I jumped the gun and have been working on building my ‘plug in’ solar system.
APststems EZHI inverter
16kw ecoworthy battery
4x450w trinasolar panels (going on the garden fence for now)
Setup has been working as arbitrage for the past 10 days, working very well - the biggest limitation is how much I can charge over night,1200w charging means I can only put 7.2kw in (swapping to EDF for another hour -up to 8.4kw over night) It’s enough to get me through a day with very little peak rate usage… in the winter with the heatpump though I may come unstuck!
Finishing getting the panels up tomorrow so that’ll be interesting!
APststems EZHI inverter
16kw ecoworthy battery
4x450w trinasolar panels (going on the garden fence for now)
Setup has been working as arbitrage for the past 10 days, working very well - the biggest limitation is how much I can charge over night,1200w charging means I can only put 7.2kw in (swapping to EDF for another hour -up to 8.4kw over night) It’s enough to get me through a day with very little peak rate usage… in the winter with the heatpump though I may come unstuck!
Finishing getting the panels up tomorrow so that’ll be interesting!
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I’ll try’n find some good hosting for some pics.
On another note - I have just generated my first kW!
Very, it’s the classic 80/20
80% of the benefit for 20% of the cost.
I just wish it could charge harder - I think I might be able to bus-bar another 1.2kW charger direct into the battery and use a smart relay to turn it on…. But that feels a little - jank.
80% of the benefit for 20% of the cost.
I just wish it could charge harder - I think I might be able to bus-bar another 1.2kW charger direct into the battery and use a smart relay to turn it on…. But that feels a little - jank.
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Very intreasting on how this will go on with prices and such, running a few servers and just general house usage a small amount of solar on fence could be a big saving potential. It depends on time to repayment.
That DGI 2000 with the grid tie in also seems intresting.
That DGI 2000 with the grid tie in also seems intresting.
That is a bit disappointing IMO as an output this late in the game. Basically saying "here's a list of stuff that might go wrong".
I don't disagree with the points they're raising, but if that's all that they can agree on after this much time I am unimpressed.
The question is what kind of safety mechanisms / certifications are needed to minimise those risks. Let's face it, whatever they decide they'll end up undercut by chinese mfrs selling on Ali and the like anyway. Figuring out some lightweight baseline safety spec should be the priority.
Bi-directional RCBOs are about the only thing which could be mandated but that would require an electrician to fit them at the consumer unit - which in turn might need replacing if its old, as might the wiring itself, etc etc.
I reckon there's going to be a lot of wiring-related fires. However you could argue those would eventually have happened anyway (insulation degradation on ancient installs) and this has only accelerated the process.
Genie is out of the bottle and I wouldn't want to be a DNO....
When it comes to wiring if it's only 800W in either direction then panels surely won't add anything that a heater/kettle/washing machine etc wouldn't already?
Just got my smart meter switch booked in but still undecided on getting a full install, 11+yrs payback is too high for me so DIY can't come soon enough.
Just got my smart meter switch booked in but still undecided on getting a full install, 11+yrs payback is too high for me so DIY can't come soon enough.
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The risk is if you have a source of power behind the rcbo etc the you can have that power on top of the power pulled from the rcbo. The rcbo are specced around the cables in the circuit to protect them from overheating - however, they are already overspecced for safety so adding 800w is very unlikely to cause an issue. If however you stacked 15 of them and several electric heaters you would melt the wires even if the consumer unit tripped.
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Soldato
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I think there is some merit to safety concerns. This could be overcome by clear guidance on what a suitable electrical system looks like, and providing good advice when it isn't so that people know what they should do to get their electrics to a better standard. That way some people may be more likely to get their electrics upgraded rather than taking a riskier route.
For me, it's two pieces.
One, what assurance does the device itself need? For example, it's pretty important that the inverter isn't pushing current to the socket when it's unplugged from the wall. It should be possible to figure out what those requirements are, and what the certification process for the devices is going to be.
Two, what are insurance companies going to have to tolerate. We can't have a situation where every home insurance company puts a different requirement on it, or you're creating an absolute mess of an industry. Whether that's saying that you can have them if your electrics were installed after a certain date, or it can be earlier but an electrician needs to sign off on it... I don't know enough about electrics to have an opinion on what those requirements are.
My point is that there's probably something between free-for-all and mandatory bi-directional RCBOs (I'll defer to your knowledge there) that gives people enough confidence to install them without as you say, simply burning down all of the unsuitable properties.
Thats all well and good, but the idea with these kits is cheap and simple plug in. If you then need an electrician that adds significantly to the cost of the setup. Most people have no idea what a suitable electrical system looks like, even the pros are disagreeing on the actual risks here.
The inverters already adhere to the necessary standards for this, the first video posted above is a good overview of why this isn't a problem:
Compared to 2kw+ granny chargers for EVs being on for very long periods of time, the paltry 800w limits that seem to be what governments are settling on and the fact they only provide that for shorter periods seems fine to me.
I think the bi-directional RCBO is the more salient point, I see those are often supplied with the kits and this is where we expose the real issue.. cost.. I had 3 quotes, all over £300 to simply install a door bell transformer in my CU.. I've had numerous people in work pay £450+ for effectively EICRs before using a granny charger and LOL quotes for adding an external EV socket, to a point it was cheaper to get a 7.4kw charger installed..
The answer might be the gov't step in and ensure reasonably cost services are available.. £75 for an RCBO swap might be tempting.. £300.. probably not.. but as we know people will find thousands of excuses about why it has to be so expensive and put so many barriers in place, especially around 'safety' that it'll never happen.. the very thing they say they fear is the very thing they'll be creating..
Obviously prices are regional and market dependant, I have a sparky 2 doors down (he fitted my doorbell transformer for free) who almost brags about the cost of stuff and how he now only works 9:30-14:30 and can't spend the money he's making currently.. I don't blame him, market rates are market rates.. but it's not compatible with the notion of cheap balcony solar..
I'm all for balcony solar, it's a great idea that could help a lot in the grand scheme of things..