Soldato
And still labour shortages. How bizarre.
Positive stuff Conservatives have achieved whilst in power?
- Thread starter tenofspades
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That's a good list. I thought pandemic was mostly the reason for the increased public spending since Boris came along.
Soldato
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Pretty much, but the concept is a very good idea, folding all different benefits into a single payment should make claims easier to manage and track. As per most government implementations, it's been run and designed by smooth brains.
Labour will probably always get my vote if they commit to building decent social housing, for the masses.
I'd probably even consider voting Lib-Dem if they shifted to a social democrat position, and advocated building millions of homes.
I've personally never understood the arguments not to do it. When asked, the Tories don't seem to have any answer. It's as if they've long since given up trying to support the young, or anyone who needs their own home.
So, I found this:
“It would have been in a Quad meeting, so either Cameron or Osborne. One of them – I honestly can’t remember whom – looked genuinely nonplussed and said, ‘I don’t understand why you keep going on about the need for more social housing – it just creates Labour voters.’ They genuinely saw housing as a petri dish for voters. It was unbelievable,” he said.
From here:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...e-labour-voters-nick-clegg-says-a7223796.html
Despicable if true.
I'd probably even consider voting Lib-Dem if they shifted to a social democrat position, and advocated building millions of homes.
I've personally never understood the arguments not to do it. When asked, the Tories don't seem to have any answer. It's as if they've long since given up trying to support the young, or anyone who needs their own home.
So, I found this:
“It would have been in a Quad meeting, so either Cameron or Osborne. One of them – I honestly can’t remember whom – looked genuinely nonplussed and said, ‘I don’t understand why you keep going on about the need for more social housing – it just creates Labour voters.’ They genuinely saw housing as a petri dish for voters. It was unbelievable,” he said.
From here:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...e-labour-voters-nick-clegg-says-a7223796.html
Despicable if true.
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Without diverging the thread too much, cost is normally the biggest factor. Governments can remove/reduce the red tape that dictates what can be built where / how etc. But with the cost of housing having increased magnitudes over the last few decades, the land itself has also increased. Meaning potential areas that councils would have purchased for building social houses now requires a substantial amount more money. There's then the shortage in building trades who are getting paid decent amounts by private housebuilding companies who aren't likely to go and work for the council for less money - which ultimately requires the council to pay more for it.
There are areas in the country where land is cheap, and plenty of it. But the moment anyone suggests building social housing there, councils and areas are accused of gentrification and shipping off the poor to other areas of the country.
I know building more social housing will help alleviate the property market. It also reduces demand on the rental market which in turn should make it cheaper to rent. I just don't see the UK having the available space to put every social tenant where they want to live.
I think it's a reference to a Labour politician. I cannot find the exact quote but someone like Bevan (but probably not him) said to a Tory on the subject of council housing something like "We'll build you out." (How's that for vague!)
Soldato
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Thatcher said the same. It was the reason behind the right to buy.
Tony Blair introduced academies and you forgot Libya under David Cameron which turned into an unmitigated disaster. Other than the National Living Wage (which wasn't a real living wage), apprenticeships (which Labour also did) and furlough those things were either bad, pointless or flawed in execution.
Also, expecting the Conservatives to actually 'level up' is like relying on the arsonist to put out the fire.
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Caporegime
Kept Jeremy Corbyn out of power.
Man of Honour
I'm fairly certain that Jeremy Corbyn kept Jeremy Corbyn out of power, with some help from the right-wing papers. The Tories mattered little.
Caporegime
It's true that Corbyn deserves most of the credit.
Caporegime
wasn't that massively over budget, took longer than expected and about 5 million people are still on legacy benefits? how is it positive?
same with brexit is it really over? where's all the trade deals? where's the benefits?
leveled up town centres? where? why not add the northern powerhouse on there whilst your at it..
HS2? doesn't even go north anymore..... utter waste of money
half the list is utter straw grasping
Soldato
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Brought the pension bill down by a few billion while showing the world how not to handle a pandemic.
Soldato
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Especialy if you try to compare it to the list of positives about the Blair government that the positives for the Tories list is trying to reflect.
Soldato
I think the only ones I agree with are 'created apprenticeships' and 'started HS2'. There is some controversy around them as not all of those apprenticeships are particularly useful ones (eg some stories of them being an excuse to pay young people less money to do a menial job in some sectors, or of apprenticeships effectively usurping funding that was perviously given to more versatile vocational courses), and HS2 is costing rather a lot and if I were winding back the clock 10 years I'd probably have allocated investment differently. Still, overall they're positives in my book.
Some of the other entries could perhaps have been positives if managed differently, but have ended up as negatives in my books due to the way they were bungled, or side effects (eg universal credit).
Edit: I suppose going further back I think with hindsight increasing university fees was the right thing to do, although at the time I didn't really see the point in gay marriage (purely because to me part of the definition of marriage was that it involved a man and a woman, not because I thought gay people shouldn't have the same rights and be valued equally etc, was possibly informed by my religious beliefs at the time too) I'll acknowledge that allowing same sex couples to call their formal legal unions marriage or civil partnerships seems to have been a very popular move, and the AV referendum was good to have even if I was really disappointed with how the campaigning was done and the result.
Edit2: ending the use of PFI contracts was a good thing imo, although I think it could be argued that any net benefit has probably been overshadowed by other methods of shovelling money into private hands at the expense of the actual public services.
Edit3: despite the pace of change being too slow, and personally being very disappointed that more wasn't done sooner and isn't being done now, they have overseen a significant drop in UK carbon emissions which some policies have supported.
Some of the other entries could perhaps have been positives if managed differently, but have ended up as negatives in my books due to the way they were bungled, or side effects (eg universal credit).
Edit: I suppose going further back I think with hindsight increasing university fees was the right thing to do, although at the time I didn't really see the point in gay marriage (purely because to me part of the definition of marriage was that it involved a man and a woman, not because I thought gay people shouldn't have the same rights and be valued equally etc, was possibly informed by my religious beliefs at the time too) I'll acknowledge that allowing same sex couples to call their formal legal unions marriage or civil partnerships seems to have been a very popular move, and the AV referendum was good to have even if I was really disappointed with how the campaigning was done and the result.
Edit2: ending the use of PFI contracts was a good thing imo, although I think it could be argued that any net benefit has probably been overshadowed by other methods of shovelling money into private hands at the expense of the actual public services.
Edit3: despite the pace of change being too slow, and personally being very disappointed that more wasn't done sooner and isn't being done now, they have overseen a significant drop in UK carbon emissions which some policies have supported.
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Soldato
Introduced a UK wide tax just to help out the English NHS. The other devolved governments have managed to ensure adequate social care provision within their block grants.