Rangers!!! Oh dear!

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23 Oct 2002
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Dundee
Isn't it great to watch the fallen Glasgow giant suffer what the rest of the SPL have been suffering for years!!!(Bar Celtic)

Now that the money is not readily available they see what it's like for the rest of us.

Great to see United turn the corner because of them!!!
 
What are you on about? Rangers are in the midst of a French revolution, lead by the massive moonbeam that is Paul LeGuen. They are clearly going to win the UEFA cup. Crisis? What crisis? There is no need for any cracked badges yet....


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oh god how did that get in there I am not good with computers
 
sneakyd said:
Great to see United turn the corner because of them!!!

I wouldn't be quite so quick to decide that the Arabs are safe but I'd like to see Levein do well, he had some quite impressive results at Hearts while cutting the wage bill.

I did say before that I doubted Le Guen would be booted quite so soon into the season but I would never have expected them to lose to the Saints by two goals either. Now it looks like the UEFA cup is about all that can save Rangers from having one of their most dismal seasons in years. :)
 
In all my years I've never seen Rangers is such a terrible state. This, at a time, when the fans thought they were going to have huge success with PLG. Another time they've fallen for Murray spin.
 
Le Guen is an easy target for the fans and granted he should shoulder some of the blame but it's the 11 guys on the pitch that need reamed....Pre Season i thought Rangers would push Celtic to the edge of the season......How wrong i seem to be!

However....

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;) :D
 
Possibly the best thing about this mess is that Le Guen was the last roll of the dice. Murray has no options now... Rangers are skint, Murray is skint, and the fans are now, slowly ( the only way the know how ) coming round to the idea that its been lies all along.

Some of the signings have been utterly woeful and the old hands are no longer up to the job. This is hopefully the beginning of payback for the terrible late eighties early ninties when Rangers ruled the land.
 
I'm just glad due to the fact that the Old Firm weakened the other SPL teams by offering overinflated wages to put them on the bench (Dundee FC an example of 3 or 4 players going for less than £300k). That ripped the heart out of the team then they ended up relegated.

I am an arab, the religious nonsense doesn't bother me in the slightest as I'm on the east coast and have nothing to do with it.

Paul Le Guen is a fantastic coach, he obviously didn't expect that the team are going to lie down like they do when they lose a goal. They need a Terry Hurlock figure to sort them out. The centre halves are awful though.

Where would they be without Charlie Adam though??
 
dafloppyone said:
ahhh the delusions of celtic fans.....
dont worry...irrespective of how bad this season is...there IS money.

lol...im glad to see the rose tinted specs are still firmly in place over at Mordor. Longer le goon and murray are left in place the better as far as im concerned.

Excuses have already been made for no reinforcements in january.
 
rmuir said:
lol...im glad to see the rose tinted specs are still firmly in place over at Mordor. Longer le goon and murray are left in place the better as far as im concerned.

Excuses have already been made for no reinforcements in january.

What excuses?

There is money available. Unless you know otherwise of course?

If Le Guen changes his tactics then we will get better. We played 4-4-2 against Hearts early in the season and easily outplayed them.
 
Fire 1 said:
What excuses?

There is money available. Unless you know otherwise of course?

If Le Guen changes his tactics then we will get better. We played 4-4-2 against Hearts early in the season and easily outplayed them.

Le Goon has already been widely quoted as saying there will be no signings in January.

If the 4-4-2 system is so magnificently effective, why not play it?

In march The Mint was bandying around figures in the region of £40million plus as the warchest available to fund le revolution. A little less than that was available, hence the quality of the signings.

Even the large majority of Rangers fans are now questioning the money, the board, the manager and the players.
 
Adam shakes Ibrox pillars with warning of bankruptcy


Glenn gibbons Chief football writer

THERE are licensed premises in Glasgow where the regular patrons will consider the recent deeds and utterances of the former Rangers director, Hugh Adam, to be nothing less than acts of treason.

This should be regarded as a natural, almost understandable, reaction from immovably devoted supporters of the Ibrox club to the decision by Adam to unload his 59,000 shares in Rangers on the basis that they were heading towards worthlessness, thanks to the unsatisfactory business methods of the chairman, David Murray.

Almost certainly viewed as an even more heinous offence would be Adam’s claim that Celtic are run much more competently and that investment in the Parkhead club would be a much sounder proposition for anyone wishing to purchase shares in a football institution.

It would be tempting for many to dismiss Adam’s action as merely a gratuitous attack on Murray by a disillusioned, 76-year-old ex-employee carrying a grudge. But Adam has been a candid critic of the way Rangers have operated for years, ever willing to voice his unease - indeed, his incomprehension - at losses he has always insisted were unsustainable.

He also has impressive credentials, having been chairman and managing director of Rangers Development and Rangers Pools since 1971, raising the millions which built the modern Ibrox. Adam’s efforts brought the club around £18million, about £60million at today’s values.

To say that his final severance with Ibrox, after three separate terms as a director amounting to about 15 years of service, was done in a fury would be inaccurate, but in conversation this week it became evident that his decision is underpinned by unmistakable disgust.

Not given to sensationalism, this essentially conservative disciple of prudent forward planning and low-risk business principles did, however, cause something of a shock by observing almost matter-of-factly that, if Rangers continue on their present track, their ultimate destination will be bankruptcy.

"That’s the logical conclusion to a strategy that incurs serious loss year on year," said Adam. "In the past five years - and it’s all there in the last annual report - Rangers have lost £80million.

"Now, the banks are well known for being a bit more tolerant of companies whose core business is a popular pursuit like football. But there is a limit to how far backwards they can bend to accommodate you.

"David Murray has always had an amazing persuasiveness when it comes to getting people to put money into his businesses, but the signs are that those sources have dried up.

"The £40million worth of shares that ENIC (English National Investment Company) bought a few years ago are now worth about £15million, with no evidence to suggest that they will recover. The money itself, that which was actually invested, was lost some time ago.

"Now the latest investor, Dave King from South Africa, will know that his £20million shareholding is worth around half, or even less, of what it was when he bought. No proper businessman will want to buy into that kind of loss."

ADAM sold 12,000 of his 59,000 shares last year and the balance of 47,000 just recently. For the latter, he got £1.15 each; three years ago, they were valued at £3.45. He is convinced Rangers cannot trade their way out of trouble, unless they gain access to a league that will attract higher-bracket income from TV. He was in favour of the proposed Atlantic League, involving the Old Firm and clubs from Holland, Portugal and other countries, but is extremely sceptical of their chances of joining the English Premiership.

He is adamant that Rangers do not have the customer base to improve their financial standing through merchandising. "Rangers’ so-called global appeal is a myth," he said. "When I was there, we did an exercise which involved asking 50,000 fans on the database to recommend a friend or a relative abroad.

"A big response was expected - some were even talking about getting 100,000 names - because everybody in Scotland seems to know somebody abroad.

"We got back 2,800 names and three-quarters of them didn’t know they had been nominated. It’s no surprise that Celtic are officially the best-supported football club in North America, with more official clubs than anybody else. The difference is the Irish connection.

"Many Irish people may support Manchester United, Liverpool or whoever, but they all - every one of them - have an affection for Celtic. And, of course, Celtic also have a great Scottish following.

"The difference is that, while the Irish all have an allegiance to Parkhead, there are millions of Scots who not only don’t support Rangers, but actively dislike them.

"Despite the claims of international appeal, Rangers are, essentially, a West of Scotland club. They talk of supporters’ buses leaving from all parts of Scotland, but if you look closely, you’ll see there aren’t many from each area and they are not all full.

"This doesn’t mean that even Celtic will earn fortunes from emigrant supporters. There may be more of them than Rangers fans, but it doesn’t mount to the kind of income necessary to fund their ambitions. But Celtic have been, since Fergus McCann’s arrival, much the better-run club.

"Fergus was the most unjustly maligned man in the history of the game, when you consider that he took the club from bankruptcy into the mainstream and built that stadium along the way.

‘NOW, the Celtic board have more financial heavyweights than Rangers, with people like Brian Quinn, Dermot Desmond and Sir Patrick Sheehy.

"It’s only in the last couple of years that Celtic have sustained losses, but over the five-year period they break even. But Brian Quinn and his board are taking steps to warn people that they are not in the business of heading towards bankruptcy.

"For their pains - for doing their job properly - they get crucified in the media, accused of penny-pinching. I don’t understand it.

"They are determined to keep Celtic properly managed, while Rangers, with Murray, is a one-party state and the man in power has an allergy to any form of personal criticism. But he’s not a businessman in the long-term sense of planning and prudence, he’s more of an impresario.

"But what has been happening is unfair on shareholders, and they’re being short-changed.

"It’s a nonsense, too, to say that Rangers’ shareholders are all supporters who aren’t interested in dividends or profits.

"That’s okay for the man with 50 shares, framed and hung on his wall. The number of shareholders in that category would amount to a minuscule percentage of the equity.

"But I’m 76 and haven’t had a dividend in years, so what’s the point of me keeping shares until they dwindle to nothing? And I’m certain the people at ENIC won’t be too pleased with their investment."
 
Looks like Le Goon's days are numbered. David Murray today assured the press and the public that the manager had the full backing of the board - we all know what that means ;)

Stan :)
 
Bigstan said:
Looks like Le Goon's days are numbered. David Murray today assured the press and the public that the manager had the full backing of the board - we all know what that means ;)

Stan :)

Yep, it means about as much as the Hearts manager going off on 'stress' leave ;) Most papers I have read seem to suggest that Le Guen has until Christmas sort of time, which seems to be a fairly decent amount of time to prove himself, he is a good manager but whether he is right for Rangers is another question entirely. :)
 
dafloppyone said:
lol @article....
rangers are under 5mil debt on official records

What is funny about the article?

As for the debt, I'll take your word for it, I'm not interested enough to look it up.

Although since the article I posted was written, they have sold off their shops and kit manufacturing, had another share issue and Murray has taken on/moved £50 million of the clubs debt under one of his other companies. He is still a very rich man obviously but I doubt he wants to keep spending more of his own money on players with little or no return.
 
rmuir said:
If the 4-4-2 system is so magnificently effective, why not play it?

Its up to PLG.


davestar_delux said:
What is funny about the article?

As for the debt, I'll take your word for it, I'm not interested enough to look it up.

Although since the article I posted was written, they have sold off their shops and kit manufacturing, had another share issue and Murray has taken on/moved £50 million of the clubs debt under one of his other companies. He is still a very rich man obviously but I doubt he wants to keep spending more of his own money on players with little or no return.

When was that atricle wriiten? As it sounds like it is a few years ago.


Murray is known to show loyalaty to his mamgers. Unlike most of todays chairmen who get rid of the manager after a few bad results. Murray will give the PLG time to sort it out.
 
Fire 1 said:
Its up to PLG.



so you've got to question the thinking of a manger who is aware of system that works, yet won't play it? no?

Anyroad, The teddy bears beat Dunfermline 2 - 0 today so everythings fine now. The corner has been turned etc etc :p
 
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