1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Poll: Scottish independence vote

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Biohazard, Sep 23, 2013.

?

Scottish independence, yes or no?

  1. I'm Scottish and in favour of independence

    137 vote(s)
    10.9%
  2. I'm Scottish and against independence

    167 vote(s)
    13.3%
  3. I'm from another part of UK and in favour of Scottish independence

    273 vote(s)
    21.7%
  4. I'm from another part of UK and against Scottish independence

    682 vote(s)
    54.2%
  1. Stretch

    Capodecina

    Joined: Feb 14, 2004

    Posts: 11,616

    Location: Peoples Republic of Histonia, Cambridge

    Political posturing aside, do you think it's unreasonable for rUK to turn down the oportunity of a formal currency and banking union post independance?
     
  2. grumpysculler

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 23, 2009

    Posts: 1,195

    I don't think Westminster is really engaging in tit-for-tat. The message was delivered badly, but was correct.

    A currency union is something that needs to be negotiated between two states and should not be part of the division of the UK. The separation negotiations should be limited to the assets and debt - once they are concluded, there could be a discussion on treaties and unions.

    The SNP are trying to use an asset/liability to force an international union or treaty. Back politics in my book. They seem to think it is some kind of "nuclear option" that will force negotiations their way. In reality, they are the weaker party and all of the nuclear options lie with Westminster. I doubt they will ever come out, but the SNP need to learn how to act like a grown up government and deal with international relations properly.

    edit: I think it is fair to offer political concessions as part of the asset division, but not to demand them. Ireland and the NI border spring to mind.
     
  3. SPG

    Soldato

    Joined: Jul 28, 2010

    Posts: 5,782

    So if they do leave can we kick them out the five nations and get a decent team in ?

    Just sayin...
     
  4. kitch9

    Soldato

    Joined: Aug 13, 2008

    Posts: 6,474

    If their banking system collapses whilst using someone else's currency it would be catastrophic, it's not like the BoE will turn on the money printers for them, we'll just hoover up all the fiscal refugees coming over the border.
     
  5. Werewolf

    Commissario

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 27,963

    Location: Panting like a fiend

    Ah but the banking system would be the fault of the English, and the reason for it collapsing would be because the nasty toffs at Westminster disliked the Scottish banks taking their business.
     
  6. aardvark

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Jan 2, 2005

    Posts: 7,929

    Location: leeds

    and salmonds lot are STILL saying they will go for a currency union!
    - they just don't understand - it isn't going to happen. its frightening that they dont have a plan B - and these people think they are capable of running a separate country - incredible.
     
  7. grumpysculler

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 23, 2009

    Posts: 1,195

    How many nations?

    Any other option is likely to lose most of the Yes vote aside from the core nationalists.
     
  8. Werewolf

    Commissario

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 27,963

    Location: Panting like a fiend

    To be fair I think the currency union with the rUK is plan B or C, they were going to jump straight into the Euro until it went wrong.
     
  9. kitch9

    Soldato

    Joined: Aug 13, 2008

    Posts: 6,474

    They haven't got a plan A, they never had. They just have delusional thoughts of what they think should happen and they are telling everyone that's how it will be.
     
  10. El Capitano

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 2,577

  11. Castiel

    Capo Crimine

    Joined: Jun 26, 2010

    Posts: 63,651

    If we follow that argument logically, that would work both ways, with the rUK giving 8% of those public assets in the rUK but receiving 92% of those public assets in Scotland. (This would logically include Oil and Gas infrastructure and investment contributions etc)...that would be an own goal of epic proportions...
     
  12. PlacidCasual

    Soldato

    Joined: May 13, 2003

    Posts: 6,166

    If Scotland did vote for independence and did have genuine legal claim as described in that article and chose to press it's claim it would poison negotiations with the rUK beyond all hope. Any hope of EU membership whilst the rUK was a member would evaporate you would imagine rUK public opinion would be absolutely dead against doing an independentScotland any favours. I hope that is just bluster and not a realistic plan for the SNP.
     
  13. El Capitano

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 2,577

    Indeed, that's why I interpreted it as a claim they own everything north of the border along with a proportion of everything south, but I can't believe they'd seriously put that proposition forward.
     
  14. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 22,761

    These people do not think they are capable, which is why it is unlikely that even if a Yes vote was the future, Salmond and co are probably on the way out.
     
  15. Raumarik

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 14, 2003

    Posts: 13,725

    StriderX you're RSI link isn't working mate, still love that 404 error page though :)
     
  16. grumpysculler

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 23, 2009

    Posts: 1,195

    I think we're up to something like the fifth currency plan in 15 years. A sovereign currency preceded euro ambitions.

    It makes it hard to take their currency position seriously - why on earth would anybody want a currency union with a government that can't decide what it wants.

    They only gave up on the Euro because it crashed an burned. Now they want to launch Euro mk2? What next - Darien 2? Sounds like an excellent way to put Scotland on the global stage.

    I wouldn't put it past them. Swinney in particular is building a long line of strawmen in an attempt to make it look like Scotland would be negotiating with the stronger hand post-Yes.
     
  17. Trifid

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Feb 18, 2006

    Posts: 8,216

    It's because they want all the advantages of the currency union without any of the responsibility (that would fall on the rUK because they couldn't afford to bail the rest out). Just like they want all the advantages of the UK without paying for them.
     
  18. IceWind

    Hitman

    Joined: Aug 8, 2008

    Posts: 666

    IF scottish independence goes through Il be using the fact I was born in Manchester to move south.... its a total joke
     
  19. grumpysculler

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 23, 2009

    Posts: 1,195

    No, it's because it's the only option the electorate would consider voting for.

    Euro hardly has many fans any more. Independent Scottish currency is too unknown and the Panama Plan would be a failure long term. A new, but pegged, currency would put Scotland under when Soros decides he fancies another Black Wednesday. So that leaves a currency union. It's a fiction, but any other option would alienate voters.

    Speaking of voters - the referendum franchise is set for a legal challenge: http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto...e1385137.ece?CMP=OTH-gnws-standard-2014_03_08
     
  20. kitch9

    Soldato

    Joined: Aug 13, 2008

    Posts: 6,474

    I don't understand how that could even begin to be considered legal in the first place.