* 4K Player Thread *

Captain · 13 Mar 2017 at 18:21

Just watching the first episode now of PE2 and wow, it looks stunning.

Captain · 13 Mar 2017 at 18:23

hyperseven said:
How do you take advantage of 4K

What's the point in buying old films just converted to a 4k resolution? I'm only buying films shot in 4k.

People buy all their fav films on DVD and then again on bluray, same won't be said about 4k as it's not worth it.

VincentHanna · 13 Mar 2017 at 18:31

I tend to agree, but HDR is better than the resolution bump IMO so that does change things slightly.

I'd still rather everything was true 4k of course.

hyperseven · 13 Mar 2017 at 18:34

Clov!s said:
Not bad but none of those take advantage of 4K

Lucy ?

Captain · 13 Mar 2017 at 18:35

hyperseven said:
Lucy ?

Dire film even though it may look good

jpaul · 13 Mar 2017 at 19:37

VincentHanna said:
Apparently that movie looks awful.

Billy Lynn looked ok in the local cinema at 24fps, but do not have a laser cinema, and even then i believe no where in the uk can show it at 120fps original,

story is good - deer hunter'esque and the action sequences and fireworks may look good in hdr.

but: in the land of the blind the one eyed man is king - where do you go for a 4k movie with good acting/story ...
as is being discussed

theone8181 · 14 Mar 2017 at 07:41

I noticed groundhog day is in 4k on netflix now, how does that work. Have they remastered it and added in extra pixels?

Vertigo · 14 Mar 2017 at 08:02

theone8181 said:
I noticed groundhog day is in 4k on netflix now, how does that work. Have they remastered it and added in extra pixels?

Maybe it was shot on film and has just been remastered in 4K?

Somewhat ironically, it may well be older titles which benefit more from 4K as the original film stock can simply be rescanned at 4K, although you do have to deal with film grain issues.

This is similar to what happened with the advent of HD where older TV series, shot on film, could be remastered in HD whilst more recent material, shot on video, was limited in resolution.
This is why they were able to re-do Star Trek: TNG in HD, as all the live action was shot on film, although they had to re-do all the effects from scratch as they were done on SD video. The later Trek series were shot entirely on video and so can't be remastered in HD.

peahead · 14 Mar 2017 at 09:48

theone8181 said:
I noticed groundhog day is in 4k on netflix now, how does that work. Have they remastered it and added in extra pixels?

ground hog day was filmed in 35mm which normally contains enough picture information to be output at 4k. http://realorfake4k.com/my-product/groundhog-day/

jonessa · 14 Mar 2017 at 10:58

peahead said:
ground hog day was filmed in 35mm which normally contains enough picture information to be output at 4k. http://realorfake4k.com/my-product/groundhog-day/

I watched in on Netflix (HD) on Sunday. Looks fine in HD

-my point being why pay £20 for it in 4k?

FrankJH · 14 Mar 2017 at 13:10

jonessa said:
I watched in on Netflix (HD) on Sunday. Looks fine in HD

-my point being why pay £20 for it in 4k?

But thats to your eyes, on your equipment in your lighting conditions

On a higher resolution /quality / larger screen to someone else in a different room (who may not even have a decent internet connection) Amazon /Netflix etc may not look as good and so the only option is a physical format.

While you are buying a disc - it also depends on personal choice about going forward if you want to pay £10 for a bluray of x film or pay £15-£20 for 4k & (std) Bluray

Then there are other practicalities like as majority of 4k owners currently are probably movie fans, why hunt through 2 or 3 different interfaces online when you can go through one (plex or whichever is your taste) with all your favourite films there?

jpaul · 14 Mar 2017 at 13:46

just putting the other point of view
maybe he could have also watched the 4k netflix version

Presumably, the business model for undertaking the 4k transfer, is for the streaming market, as opposed to physical media, which is just a convenient bye-prouduct.

FrankJH said:
Then there are other practicalities like as majority of 4k owners currently are probably movie fans, why hunt through 2 or 3 different interfaces online when you can go through one (plex or whichever is your taste) with all your favourite films there?

this will increasingly be the rub, (not sure whether the original thread remit included streaming 4K players as well as hard media), but inability of movie fans to rip the 4k disc, for in house distribution, will imhop be an increasing inconvenience.
I thought netflix were soon offering an offline capability, maybe not yet 4k, so you have the option of having Groundhog-4k (averaging 15Mb/s) in your local library, for a limited duration.

( I think I should start a thread about blu-rays you have purchased, but not got around to unwrapping, but ground-hog day, for me, is a more once/twice in a lifetime second viewing not yet on my bucket list; but, yes, ymmv)

FrankJH · 14 Mar 2017 at 14:11

jpaul said:
Presumably, the business model for undertaking the 4k transfer, is for the streaming market, as opposed to physical media, which is just a convenient bye-prouduct.

Vice versa as a lot of the world doesnt have the infrastructure yet for 4k streaming to be realistic from what I understand.

Hollywood from what I have heard in the past actually rescans everything (major) periodically for backup purposes and for everyday use and only uses the origianl film (as we are predominantly still talking about things shot on film) very infrequently.

I doubt most would know the difference if Netflix etc put up HD streams as UHD and labelled them as non- HDR versions , it would make little difference I would suspect

jpaul said:
this will increasingly be the rub, (not sure whether the original thread remit included streaming 4K players as well as hard media), but inability of movie fans to rip the 4k disc, for in house distribution, will imhop be an increasing inconvenience.
I thought netflix were soon offering an offline capability, maybe not yet 4k, so you have the option of having Groundhog-4k (averaging 15Mb/s) in your local library, for a limited duration.

Imo its just a matter of time before someone develops a method of ripping UHD's (they are after all less secure than regular BR's, but the storage space required will triple / quadruple at the user end - and that wont be cheap anytime soon

Its just a case of when a UHD computer drive becomes available for consumers, the software will surely follow shortly after

TALON1973 · 14 Mar 2017 at 17:56

Just watched the 1st episode of pe2 . Were some of those shots cgi as some it looked abit to good in 4k ??? First time watching it.

VincentHanna · 14 Mar 2017 at 20:04

jpaul said:
Billy Lynn looked ok in the local cinema at 24fps, but do not have a laser cinema, and even then i believe no where in the uk can show it at 120fps original,

story is good - deer hunter'esque and the action sequences and fireworks may look good in hdr.

but: in the land of the blind the one eyed man is king - where do you go for a 4k movie with good acting/story ...
as is being discussed

Billy Lynn’s Long Halftime Walk was filmed digitally using the Sony CineAlta F65 camera at 120 frames per second (fps), in 3D with 4K resolution and finished using a 4K Digital Intermediate (DI), and which formed the basis for this Ultra HD Blu-ray release. The film is presented as widescreen 1.85:1 aspect ratio at 60 fps, uses 10-bit video depth, a Wider Colour Gamut (WCG) and High Dynamic Range (HDR) and is encoded using the HEVC (H.265) codec. We reviewed the Region free US Ultra HD Blu-ray release of Billy Lynn’s Long Halftime Walk on a Panasonic 65DX902B Ultra HD 4K TV with a Samsung UBD-K8500 Ultra HD Blu-ray player.

At a native resolution of 4K and at 60p (a first for the format) this is certainly a unique viewing experience. The image on show is nothing short of remarkable, as it should be, this being the pinnacle of current home cinema technology, with everything gelling together to form something truly special. Detail is out of this world, nothing is lost, everything is pin sharp from the tears streaming down Billy’s face in the halftime show, to the dust on his desert fatigues during the battle scenes; to say it’s like being there is no hyperbole – the way Lee moves his camera, the framing of the shots, the POV indications, you are there involved, immersed and engaged with the picture. Every skin defect is visible, every stitch in clothing is there, the grass of the playing field, the scaffolding of the stadium, the cracks in the walls, the bark of the trees, the dents in the vehicles there is simply nothing that is left for the imagination.

The higher dynamic range comes into play to add further realism to the image, blacks add the depth, whites bring it to the fore, the wider colour space allows every natural range to be visible, from the greens of the dress uniforms to the blues of the cheerleaders' tops. The spectacular halftime show (which is seen from the perspective of the participants) is stunning, the fireworks pierce the blackness with no hint of wash, bleed, separation or smear; the lights are crisp and penetrating and those illuminated appear stark. Then we come to the frame rate which adds another sense of realism to the movement that, again, places you next to those on screen; the camera flows and the motion of those on screen is real, and in every respect this is a stunning experience.

But.

So here’s where we enter preference. Everything above is true; you have never seen anything quite like it – it is a unique visual experience. And I simply did not like it. It was too real, too visually stimulating; there was that ‘it looks like video’ nagging element, and the way Lee frames at times seemed comical, such as face on to the character as they talk to the screen; the whole thing, to me, was distracting – it doesn’t look like film. And that is the crux of the matter as far as I am concerned; I failed to engage with the story because I couldn’t get past the image. The 1080p Blu-ray, included in the set, has a reference image, through and through, as whilst it doesn’t have any of the bells and whistles above, what it does have is that film like experience enabling me to forget the visuals and engage with the story.

There is no denying that the 4K UHD image as presented is a stunning visual feast, and it truly deserves to be seen for what can be achieved; however whether or not, as an individual, you can connect with it emotionally to draw you into the story, that is another question.

https://www.avforums.com/review/billy-lynns-long-halftime-walk-4k-ultra-hd-blu-ray-review.13443

jpaul · 14 Mar 2017 at 21:01

That sounds enticing

- I was disappointed I could not find a utube trailer/teaser in at least 60fps

Talon1973 that theory was put to bed in the dedicated OC area 51 thread

Captain · 14 Mar 2017 at 22:08

I see rogue one has come up on pre-order for bluray but no UHD version yet.

peahead · 14 Mar 2017 at 23:27

Clov!s said:
I see rogue one has come up on pre-order for bluray but no UHD version yet.

Disney have not announced support for 4K UHD yet

i read rumours about them wanting to support Dolby vision with there releases but again this may be just a rumour. we can only hope they announce something this year.

hyperseven · 15 Mar 2017 at 02:06

FrankJH said:
Vice versa as a lot of the world doesnt have the infrastructure yet for 4k streaming to be realistic from what I understand.

Hollywood from what I have heard in the past actually rescans everything (major) periodically for backup purposes and for everyday use and only uses the origianl film (as we are predominantly still talking about things shot on film) very infrequently.

I doubt most would know the difference if Netflix etc put up HD streams as UHD and labelled them as non- HDR versions , it would make little difference I would suspect

Imo its just a matter of time before someone develops a method of ripping UHD's (they are after all less secure than regular BR's, but the storage space required will triple / quadruple at the user end - and that wont be cheap anytime soon

Its just a case of when a UHD computer drive becomes available for consumers, the software will surely follow shortly after

How can they be less secure, the protection used has not been broken.

FrankJH · 15 Mar 2017 at 14:39

hyperseven said:
How can they be less secure, the protection used has not been broken.

No region settings for starters (compared to BR and DVD etc)

Believe it or not these same conversations have been had when those other physical formats came out too, and then suddenly (as I stated above) as soon as computer drives were readily available for that format suddenly the protection was broken relatively quickly

*** 4K Player Thread ***

* 4K Player Thread *