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Stopped eating meat a year ago, realisations since

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Combat squirrel, Jun 30, 2019.

  1. Somnambulist

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Jun 17, 2010

    Posts: 9,778

    Location: London

    Ropert Sapolsky talks about this in his famous book Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers - while we all feel pain (evolutionary useful!) share the same basic response stress, humans have a unique ability in the animal kingdom to keep these physiological responses to stress elevated chronically (which leads to all kinds of negative health outcomes of which ulcers are only the most mild) because of the power of our minds to relive past stresses or worry about future ones. For zebras (or any other prey animal), stress is acute: they goes about their business with the other zebras, a couple of minutes of life or death terror ensue when a lion appears, stress kicks in... and then if they escape death and live to see another day, it's not long before markers of stress return to baseline and they're back to doing their thing as if nothing happened.
     
  2. varkanoid

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Dec 31, 2007

    Posts: 9,141

    Location: The TARDIS, Wakefield, UK

    Okay I was thinking about this the other day and its all fine if people want to do this and we might have meat grown in a lab not from a cow etc. However thinking about the far future what would happen to the animals. So the planet stops eating meat. What do we do with the animals ? What happens when there are too many cows in the world and they start eating the veg meant for the humans ? Do we have wild cows ? Same with chickens what happens to them ? We would have to use some kind of population control and as killing them is out of the question we would have to create some scientific birth control to stop animals become too many but then this is doing something unnatural ? Eggs ? would we still eat them ? I am looking at this in really basic simplistic terms but has anyone actually thought yeah dont kill the animals but what happens with them ? Its okay saying I`m going to eat no meat but is that not a selfish attitude to adopt as you are not actually thinking about what happens to that animal you are not eating.

    So just to put things into perspective and say something really silly if one McDonalds restaurant uses meat from one cow per day thats 365 cows per year then times that by the number of McDonalds restaurants then think of all the other outlets that use meat. That's a heck of a lot of animals without even thinking of Sheep ! We would be outnumbered as a human race by the animals ? :) Just throwing it out there with my 50 years old brain looking at it as a 7 year old. It was just something my son said the other day when he had seen on the news an item about Vegetarians.
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2020
  3. One More Solo

    Capodecina

    Joined: Dec 29, 2004

    Posts: 15,546

    Location: Manchester

    Errr, the existing animals get eaten and farmers breed fewer animals to meet demand? It's not like the last farm animals will be released into the wild and naturally breed prolifically.
     
  4. Mercenary Keyboard Warrior

    Capodecina

    Joined: Aug 4, 2007

    Posts: 10,153

    Location: Wilds of suffolk

    You didnt think very hard did you.

    How long do you think a cow lives, or a chicken. Especially one bred specifically for food.

    Or do you think the farmers don't actually deliberately control the birth cycle of these things?

    If we all, I mean like 99% of the population gave up meat tomorrow your vision of packs of cows set free as they have no use etc may bear out.
    The reality is that even if we gave up over 3 years the natural supply and demand effect would mean, less and less calves would be needed, less and less chickens would be incubated

    I think even farmers ;) may notice that demand is going down and down and would stop needlessly producing more calves, chicks etc than they can realistically sell
    They would start turning over grazing land to arrable, where the land is of use for that of course

    What would likely happen eventually, say if we banned meat completely, is small populations of these animals would be maintained in zoos, a few wild chickens in woods etc.
     
  5. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,888

    What are you smoking mate?

    Im just flabbergasted if Im honest. Do people honestly think the only animals in the world are the ones that we eat? Do people not understand farming?

    Does someone like varkanoid think that to get meat into the shops or McDonalds, someone goes out into the wild to hunt a cow or a pig?

    This is actually worse than Sexygreyfox asking his daughter about what she thinks about having no more animals in the world if people stopped eating meat.

    What if people stopped drinking water, would we all drown because there is too much water?
     
  6. McGray

    Mobster

    Joined: Dec 8, 2008

    Posts: 4,554

    Amazing lol.
     
  7. D.P.

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 30,419

    WTF did i just read.

    please tell me that is a troll post.
     
  8. varkanoid

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Dec 31, 2007

    Posts: 9,141

    Location: The TARDIS, Wakefield, UK

    Seriously think about it. Cows are farmed right. Cows are bred, some for milk, some for meat. So we stop eating meat, what happens to the cows we used to eat ? Other animals we dont eat are part of a food chain, a spider eats a fly, a bird, snake or frog eats a spider. There is a natural journey to the food chain if you dont include man destroying habitats etc. Who eats a cow ? We do. So we stop eating cows, they live. Hence more Cows alive than now.

    Your last statement just shows how you do not understand what I am talking about because you cant destroy water. It exists in one form or another. How do you destroy water ? A cow, once you eat its meat, its gone. Granted some of it comes out the other end but its gone. So if the Cow has not gone, what happens to that cow, and all the others we no longer eat. They live longer so therefore they consume more. Fact is the world stops eating meat there will be a heck of a lot more cows in the world! You can't just stop "making cows" unless you do something to prevent breeding but then you would get some moral brigade saying its cruel.

    Let me give you something else to think about. What would happen if we decided to stop eating chocolate, just like that no one eats chocolate anymore but the manufacturers dont stop making it. We end up with loads of chocolate no one eats. Same if we dont eat meat. Just think about it. Tell me what would happen to all the cows we eat if we dont eat meat ?

    This is what I am talking about if you read about certain peoples views they think we should all stop eating meat tomorrow. So this is what set me off thinking the above what would happen if we did this. Hence the thought on cows. Just one of those things you think of like "what would happen if we stopped doing x tomorrow".

    It was only a whimsical thought can no one have creative thought in this world anymore is there no more daydreamers. Lighten up people ! :) and D.P I think you need to read up on what a Troll actually means.
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2020
  9. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,888

    You do understand about wild animals right? The wild devon ponies and wild horses for instance?

    We breed animals for slaughter to eat. They are not wild animals. We dont keep males and females together they are brought together to breed.
    That is not a natural breeding cycle. We would simply stop breeding them and probably stop looking after them.

    I mean if we stopped suddenly then yes there would be billions of animals walking around.

    Most of the animals around are breed for food stock. We would simple stop breeding them. It would also depend why we stopped as a planet. If we stopped to cut green house gas or to save vegetation or reclaim the land for building houses then they would all probably just get slaughtered rather than allowed to live out their natural life. If we stopped because they all suddenly started talking or something crazy like people started to think it was wrong to kill them for food then that would be a different story.

    What scenario are you thinking here?
     
  10. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 32,183

    Location: Welling, London

    I would be for sure.

    I love meat, but I love animals. I couldn’t bring myself to kill one unless there was literally nothing else to eat and it was pure survival.

    Does that make me a hypocrite?
     
  11. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 32,183

    Location: Welling, London

    Sorry, quoted myself to edit the post accidentally
     
  12. efish

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 11, 2014

    Posts: 1,466

    Animals breed for fur are perhaps a better example. As radical animal liberation groups have taken the position that the exploitation of animals for fur should end today rather than tomorrow.

    It started debate here with many vegetarians disagreeing with such radical positions.

    Issues and impact of the sudden release of farmed animals into the eco system is already known through these cases and the need for caution is also understood.

    Guardian, Activists free 8000 mink


    History dictates science would need to be applied to any changes to the enviroment here. The survival of farm bread animals would be problematic, most would die I would imagine, but whatever it would be a serious alteration to the enviroment and would require careful management.






     
  13. neoboy

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 16, 2004

    Posts: 11,812

    Location: UK

    People aren't going to stop eating meat overnight so really just going to be a case of market responding to supply and demand forces.

    Releasing animals en masse would be very silly, as is demonstrated by above articles.