Tado and wired thermostat - need to bridge the wired thermostat.

[413x]

My step up

Old boiler with HW tank
Wired thermostat
Wired programmer unit


I first got tado and just replaced the old stat with a tado stat.
Added trvs
Left 'CH' permanently on so tado could control this.
HW was controlled by the old unit on a timer



Now I wanted to add HW control to tado. So got the thing that replaces the programmer unit.

However, tado tell me that this won't work.

The only way for it to work is bridge the thermostat wires (effectively always on) and have the new program unit fire up the boiler for heating control.

The tado CS person said that the 'zone valve' will be always open. And that this may be an issue.


Anyone help on this?

I understand what I would be doing. But no idea if this valve being open is bad for the whole system

 

[Adam_151]

Have you got a link for what exactly you have?

I'm struggling to understand the situation here, if a zone valve is always open then that heating cirucit will always be heating when the boiler is running, the opposite of what you would want when you are fitting kit to give you greater control and efficency I would have though.

Need the PDF manual of what you've bought and details on you existing system (is it a Y plan or S plan) pictures of both the wiring and the plumbing set up would be usful here. I'm sure it can be made to work in a sensible way just need a bit more info

 

[413x]

It's a y-plan setup I figured out.

I don't think it is a situation, I think the the tado CS person over complicated it.

It seems quite a common issue with smart heating when retro fitting an old system.
Standard seems to be to bridge the hard wired thermostat to create an 'always on' closed circuit

Then replace the control unit with the smart unit. The new smart unit does the job of the thermostat and the control unit in one.

Had a smart thermostat and smart control unit and they couldn't work together (in tados case).

I'm probably using incorrect terminology..
The thermostat on left and control unit on right is what I replaced.

 

[Nikumba]

I have that controller and just replaced it.

I bought the kit from Tado with hot water control, followed the App and installed the thermostat and with my boiler, all I had to do was change the jumper in the back of the tado controller and clip onto the existing back plate with no issues.

Hot water and heating show up fine in the app, I did not add anything extra into the thermostat wiring, red and yellow went into two of the terminals earth and blue went into the park fittings

 

[413x]

I have that controller and just replaced it.

I bought the kit from Tado with hot water control, followed the App and installed the thermostat and with my boiler, all I had to do was change the jumper in the back of the tado controller and clip onto the existing back plate with no issues.

Hot water and heating show up fine in the app, I did not add anything extra into the thermostat wiring, red and yellow went into two of the terminals earth and blue went into the park fittings

You didn't have to change the back plate of the existing Control unit??

 

[Nikumba]

You didn't have to change the back plate of the existing Control unit??

No following the install instructions on the app, with the control unit I had to turn the yellow jumper to position 2 and put it back on the existing backplate and worked off the bat.

 

[413x]

No following the install instructions on the app, with the control unit I had to turn the yellow jumper to position 2 and put it back on the existing backplate and worked off the bat.

Ah yeah I had to rewire. Which was a right pain. But the app was good. Just didn't realise I had to disconnect the wired stat

 

[Nikumba]

Ah yeah I had to rewire. Which was a right pain. But the app was good. Just didn't realise I had to disconnect the wired stat

Disconnect the tado on? I still have mine wired in

 

[413x]

Disconnect the tado on? I still have mine wired in

Yes. I couldn't have the tado thermostat and the the hot water kit wired in. It meant the trvs wouldn't control the on/off of the boiler. So had to move the stat to wireless.

 

[NeilF]

It's a y-plan setup I figured out.

I don't think it is a situation, I think the the tado CS person over complicated it.

It seems quite a common issue with smart heating when retro fitting an old system.
Standard seems to be to bridge the hard wired thermostat to create an 'always on' closed circuit

Then replace the control unit with the smart unit. The new smart unit does the job of the thermostat and the control unit in one.

Had a smart thermostat and smart control unit and they couldn't work together (in tados case).

I'm probably using incorrect terminology..
The thermostat on left and control unit on right is what I replaced.

This is pretty much EXACTLY my setup, with the existing thermostat controlling the heating by just a pair of wires connected to the boiler or controller? Note: I have a British Gas UP2 controller, which I believe is basically the same as that!

So, as regards replacing it with a Tado unit:-
- would I just plug the Tado thermostat into the pair of wires of the existing thermostat? Or would those old wires become redundant?
- and as for plugging the Tado controller into the boiler, would I just connect it to the wiring in place of the existing controller? Or would I need to wire it into the boiler itself? Eeek!

 

[413x]

This is pretty much EXACTLY my setup, with the existing thermostat controlling the heating by just a pair of wires connected to the boiler or controller? Note: I have a British Gas UP2 controller, which I believe is basically the same as that!

So, as regards replacing it with a Tado unit:-
- would I just plug the Tado thermostat into the pair of wires of the existing thermostat? Or would those old wires become redundant?
- and as for plugging the Tado controller into the boiler, would I just connect it to the wiring in place of the existing controller? Or would I need to wire it into the boiler itself? Eeek!

What tado are you getting?
I got the one with hot water control.

What I had to do was replace the control unit (but with a display) with the tado hot water control and remove the thermostat (bit with a knob) and bridge the wires. I then tucked the bridged wires into the tado wireless thermostat. There's a gap in it you can do this


Took me a couple of calls to tado to get sorted as I didn't have the tado hot water control originally. I had a thermostat only. This confused things when I added hot water control.
But they can do stuff on thier end remotely. Got to say I've used support 3 times and it's been excellent. Never waited more than an hour for a response.

Camera is making tado lights look pink. They are white.

Old wires from stat bridged and behind the buldge


This is what it now looks like



This is the hot water control that needs wiring to the old control unit


Yes. The wall looks tatty in the utility!
This was annoying as wires were short!


After all that I now have this set up

 

[NeilF]

Thanks for that. Your account is perfect, and seems to match what I'd understood from others. So to confirm, for me to fit:-
1) Where the current thermostat is (in the hall) with two wires - Those wires are simply joined togethor as the controller at the boiler will now be switching the heating circuit, not a thermostat in the hall.
2) The Tado Thermostat will (for me at least) just sit where the old one did, with no wires to it, and running off batteries.
3) Most importantly, the Tado Controller will simply directly replace the British Gas controller, using the same wire(s). ie: NO NEW wires are needed to the boiler, and the boiler isn't messed around with at all.

^ Because if this is all the installation involves (as well as the hub being wired in somewhere of course), that sound like something even I can manage

A couple more questions if you don't mind?
1) Is Tado smart in the sense if you set your temperature to be 20 degrees at 8am, it turns on the heating earlier because it knows it'll take say 30 mins to get to 20 degrees from the 17 it is now? My current Netatmo even uses the outdoor temp to adjust the pre-emptive start time. So on really cold days, it will start heating earlier than less cold ones. Does Tado do anything like this?
2) Have you found the Tado radiator valves reliable? I know some companies units seem to struggle turning the valves?
3) As regards looking at graph/stats, my current Netatmo is fabulous in that I simply turn my phone sidewise and the app shows a graph with indoor temp, when heating has been on/off, and outdoor temp. And this graph and be pinched/expanded to be over hours or years. Are the Tado graphs/stats that accessible?

ps: The reason I'm considering moving from my Netatmo to Tado is to also control hot water (Netatmo only does heating). To add smart valves on a number of radiators - Netatmo's valve controllers get mixed reviews.

 

[413x]

Yes.
To 1,2,3.
The old thermostat is basically set to always on by bridging. And the replacement controller does everything.

There is an early start feature but apparently its designed for under floor heating. So I do the pre heat manually. I'll set my study to come on 30 mins before I go in for work for example. I found the auto feature turns on far too early.


The valves are great. Main reason I got it was best reviews for valves. Took a good month to figure out optimal offsets etc. But for us with a detached house where sun makes a huge difference to indoor temp it's the stand out for sure.

There are bar graphs for months and years. And line graphs for days.
They don't pinch and zoom so that would be a downgrade for sure.


Of the smart home stuff I have
-cameras
-heating
-a few lights
-speakers

The heating is the best by far.
Although I wouldn't like to give up my hen camera and doorbell

 

[NeilF]

Yes.
To 1,2,3.
The old thermostat is basically set to always on by bridging. And the replacement controller does everything.

There is an early start feature but apparently its designed for under floor heating. So I do the pre heat manually. I'll set my study to come on 30 mins before I go in for work for example. I found the auto feature turns on far too early.


The valves are great. Main reason I got it was best reviews for valves. Took a good month to figure out optimal offsets etc. But for us with a detached house where sun makes a huge difference to indoor temp it's the stand out for sure.

There are bar graphs for months and years. And line graphs for days.
They don't pinch and zoom so that would be a downgrade for sure.


Of the smart home stuff I have
-cameras
-heating
-a few lights
-speakers

The heating is the best by far.
Although I wouldn't like to give up my hen camera and doorbell

OK! And one final point.

A lot of people seem to say the valves are noisey, and in bedrooms risk waking them up?

I must also admit, the notion that one Tado valve demanding more heat in that room, resulting in the boiler coming, to heat not just that room, but the 3-4 other radiators in the house without smart values concerns me (with my setup).

EDIT: Seems you can define a Valve as "Independent" which means it will not command the boiler to turn on/off. Good