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The Brexit Party

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Mr Badger, May 8, 2019.

  1. inogen

    Mobster

    Joined: Jul 19, 2009

    Posts: 3,539

    It's much, much deeper than any "project fear" dismissal. It's actual non-compute that people don't understand that we'd be better off leaving. It's so obvious when people "get it".

    That's why a lot of them aren't interested in discussion about it. It's like you're asking them to consider incoherent flights of fancy. People just shut down.

    Besides, whatever facts and figures you bring up to say what a bad idea it is, they're not relevant to the reason why they voted leave. And/or, it's a price worth paying and you don't understand that then you just don't get it. It's a matter of opinion not fact if something is a price worth paying afterall.

    Then there's the icing on top that the referendum result gave it a democratic mandate and the bureaucrats won't enact it. That's very galvanising.

    My MiL for instance thinks that the economy shrinking by 10% is a price worth paying as things will be better in the long run. But also thinks that the government should carry on spending £745m a year so she doesn't have to buy a TV licence (even though she could easily afford one) and thinks the two things are completely independent issues. Like the economy shrinking will not bring with it very hard choices over public spending and I'm sorry, but free TV licences for old ladies with cash on the hip isn't one.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019
  2. efish

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 11, 2014

    Posts: 1,321

    That's right. Our elections have been pretty terrible in terms of facts. Labor and conservative decision to run with project fear in the Scottish Independence ref and the repeat that fail in Brexit ref. Terrible decision. Our democracy far poorer as a result.

    What the Brexit party is doing now, different political perspective, no difference message wise, high emotion content and fact free.

    The fact our political lords and masters (1) seek to dumb down and run the show based on emotion and a fear of fellow Britain's does not make it right in one case because I agree and wrong in the other because I don't.

    Its just wrong and indicates our politicians are political hacks with no vision and no real idea of what to do.

    (1) Farage included, he has been a professional politician picking up a large pay check with generousness expense account for decades, with the standard millionaire backers the political classes use to pay for a media platform to move up the establishment food chain.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019
  3. garnett

    Mobster

    Joined: Mar 25, 2008

    Posts: 4,469

    Yes, yes. People you don't like should leave. Reinforcing even more Brexiteer stereotypes.

    Don't blame the messenger.

    You're angry. We get it.

    You've been made to look a fool. We get it.

    Bit don't get angry at the people who are pointing it out. Get angry at the conmen who pulled the wool over your eyes.
     
  4. BowdonUK

    Mobster

    Joined: Jan 17, 2016

    Posts: 2,598

    Richard Tice won his case against SNP MEP Alyn Smith.

    SNP MEP Alyn Smith apologises to Brexit Party after legal threat
    https://www.heraldscotland.com/news...pologises-to-brexit-party-after-legal-threat/

    The apology;

     
  5. JRS

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jun 6, 2004

    Posts: 13,977

    Location: Burton-on-Trent

  6. garnett

    Mobster

    Joined: Mar 25, 2008

    Posts: 4,469

    Lol.

    So Tice didn't dare complain about being called a law-breaker shyster funded by dark money...

    Why wouldn't he want that to be considered by a court?
     
  7. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: May 15, 2007

    Posts: 11,643

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    So, I was looking something else up on the court listings for work, and key presto, look who popped up:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...d-chancery-hearings-and-register-2014-to-date

    It is a long list, so I'd recommend searching for "Arron" as in Arron Banks, the person who's under investigation by the National Crime Agency and who has links to Nigel Farage, self-styled fishermen's friend but actual fisheries commission meeting absentee.

    It actually relates to this earlier ruling: https://www.rossmartin.co.uk/sme-tax-news/3760-no-iht-exemption-for-donations-to-ukip

    Essentially, gifts / donations to UK political parties are normally exempt from inheritance tax. As many on here will know, Arron Banks donated enormous sums of money to UKIP when Nigel Farage was leader. So much money, in fact, that he was asked to evidence the sources of this money. That investigation is ongoing, despite Arron Banks and Nigel Farage being fairly certain that it was unlikely to have come from Russia.

    The ruling was that these donations could not be exempted from inheritance tax, as the qualifying criteria in law were:
    • Two members of the party were elected to the House of Commons, or
    • One member of the party was elected to the House of Commons and not less than 150,000 votes were given to candidates who were members of that party.
    The delicious irony is that Arron Banks claimed that his human rights were being breached under article 14 of the European Court of Human Rights. Lovely :)

    I thought it would be relevant to this thread, firstly due to the close relationship between Arron Banks, UKIP and Nigel Farage, and secondly because the Brexit Party would not qualify as a political party for the purposes of exemption from inheritance tax. Certainly a related matter, but then again I imagine that not many of the anonymous and mysterious donors to the Brexit Party were motivated by future inheritance tax exemptions.
     
  8. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 20,557

    Imagine being such wonderful patriots that they'd want to skip out on paying the British taxpayer their due?

    But you know that's alright apparently.
     
  9. efish

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 11, 2014

    Posts: 1,321

    In fairness Nigel was probable unaware of any issues when he read the ££££££££££££££££££££££££££££ on the original cheque from his corporate overlord.
    After all when has receiving large piles of ££££££££££££ from multi- millionaires ever been an issue in British politics?

    Its just an everyday thing that everyday men of the people do.
     
  10. BowdonUK

    Mobster

    Joined: Jan 17, 2016

    Posts: 2,598

    Paul Crowther, the Farage milkshake thrower convicted of common assault and criminal damage (now has a criminal record). Handed a 12 month community order, including 150 hours unpaid work. Had to pay Farage £350, and lost his job at Sky.

    Paul Crowther: Man who threw milkshake at Nigel Farage spared jail after admitting common assault
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...lt-brexit-party-newcastle-court-a8963321.html
     
  11. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 12,716

    Location: Hertfordshire

    Fascist state.
     
  12. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: May 15, 2007

    Posts: 11,643

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    With the new EU parliament session soon to begin, there'll be some new MEPs beginning to settle in now and learn the ropes.

    We've already seen one Brexit Party member struggle to identify a car brand and fail to follow simple instructions on how to vote. Let's hope he doesn't lean on Nigel Farage and his unenviable record of being the 736th most productive MEP, and the UK's MEP with the lowest attendance record.

    http://www.mepranking.eu/8/mep.php?id=4525#mep

    This is of course the same Nigel Farage that was tired of the UK not making progress with US trade talks, and so said that he was going to put together his own team of industrialists and dealmakers.

    Nothing has happened since.

    That might be because he's busy elsewhere, doing anything other than what he was elected and is paid to do. He's recently come out to say that he's going to help Trump campaign in 2020.

    Before then, of course, he demanded a seat at the EU negotiating table. A couple of problems seems to have emerged that have stalled this initiative: 1) there aren't any negotiations going on, and 2) his European Parliament attendance record suggests that he has significant difficulties in finding the EU. His rhetoric would suggest that it is often a lot closer than he'd like, but as to where it is exactly...
     
  13. DarkHorizon472

    Mobster

    Joined: May 16, 2007

    Posts: 3,077

  14. BowdonUK

    Mobster

    Joined: Jan 17, 2016

    Posts: 2,598

    It was always going to be new ground, this subscribers instead of members idea Farage apparently copied from Dutch politician, Geert Wilders. I don't really see the point of being a subscriber. It's like they want all the money but don't want to give anything back in return. I assume you don't get any printed party material i.e. newspaper/magazine, or invited to be included in framing the party policies. It seems you literally get nothing other than having £25 removed from your wallet.

    It would be interesting to see what other political parties allow you to sign up using paypal. It's one thing to use paypal for merchandise purchases. But every senior political party admin should know that all monies should be logged and tracable back, especially when you're part of a radical party as you know extra checks will be done.

    Nigel Farage's Brexit Party ordered to check EVERY £25 donation for foreign cash
    https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/nigel-farages-brexit-party-told-16536061
     
  15. efish

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 11, 2014

    Posts: 1,321

    Five star was a major influence in regard to 'member lead movement'

    source

    Part opinion part fact. Don't have to believe every word but you can see why regulation and law is having to play catch up here.

    Politics is altering in the age of big data.
     
  16. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: May 15, 2007

    Posts: 11,643

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    But don't worry - the same people organising the party think they're fit organise trade delegations, negotiate with the EU and other political organisations.

    In both serious and more light-hearted ways, I've repeatedly raised questions in this thread to Brexit Party supporters as to the propriety of Nigel Farage to hold representative public office. It is quite telling that there's been a reluctance to address any points raised head on and refute them.

    A little like the recent YouGov in the Conservative Party thread, it appears that the outcome is everything, no matter if the means of achieving it are unsavoury, or even illegal.
     
  17. efish

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 11, 2014

    Posts: 1,321


    Charles Mackay, Memoirs of Extraordinary Popular Delusions
     
  18. GIBURROWS

    Mobster

    Joined: Jan 13, 2010

    Posts: 2,860

    Location: The 'Shire'

    Good, I'm not a fan of Farage but you can't assault someone just because you don't like them or their opinions.
     
  19. krooton

    Caporegime

    Joined: May 9, 2004

    Posts: 25,196

    Location: Leafy outskirts of London

    Gofundme campaign covered the bill and then some, haha, but agree with you, stooping to their level does no one any good.
     
  20. ron3003

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Oct 25, 2006

    Posts: 1,500

    Location: Skegness

    Should make some of the morons that chipped in carry out some of the unpaid work maybe?