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The Conservative Party: Where do we go from here?

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Gigabit, Jun 10, 2017.

  1. chrcoluk

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 27, 2015

    Posts: 3,140

    It has record high levels of food bank usage (poverty), and human rights issues.

    Which is how you describing socialist regimes.

    Granted I dont even know what countries are currently socialist and how they faring, but I dont think the current direction has worked personally.

    As I said before tho in the labour thread, if a country has been socialist for a long time it wouldnt surprise me it has issues, I think extreme left or extreme right are both bad, I expect the best is rotating between left and right wing governments every 5-10 years.
     
  2. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,396

    Location: Plymouth

    The only countries currently practicing democratic socialism are places like Venezeula. (it is important not to confuse democratic socialism and social democracy, because although they sound similar, they are very very different. Countries like the nordic countries etc practice social democracy).
     
  3. stockhausen

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 30, 2006

    Posts: 9,254

    She seems to have achieved the impossible - to look even more stupid and incompetent than "Call me Dave".
     
  4. doodah

    Capodecina

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 19,395

    Location: London

    Last night would have been a perfect opportunity for an opposition leader to make some ground on a terrible night for the PM, but no - he insisted on scoring an own goal.

    I think May has run out of despicable things to do....
     
  5. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,166

    But Labour are not offering a Venezuelan type socialist country/government as you very well know. If it helps you deflect from the crisis, not only for the general public but also public services and the rest of the country then that is on you but it is conspiracy theory mental gymnastics to even pretend Labour would turn the UK into Venezuela. Dresperate stuff from you again Dolph. How you can look back at the last 9 years and try and make Labour the bad guys is beyond rational thought.
    I think you will find the papers disagree and have gone full May/Tories are a disgrace. What did the meeting accomplish last night and what difference would Corbyn being there have done? Absolutely nothing just listen to the speech she gave last night. Nothing has changed!
    Every day she is an MP is a day she will do more despicable things. Im sure today will be no different.
     
  6. doodah

    Capodecina

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 19,395

    Location: London

    The optics look like a 70 year old man throwing a tantrum though. And he's hardly setting himself apart from a rigid looking May.
     
  7. VincentHanna

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 30, 2013

    Posts: 17,428

    There would probably be more criticism of him if she had something of substance to say.
     
  8. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,396

    Location: Plymouth

    Forced nationalisation with parliament deciding the amount of compensation due (if any) as per labour's last manifesto is democratic socialism. There are not many examples of democratic socialism in action, but if you have an alternative one, please present it.

    If you believe that somehow corbyn democratic socialism will be different from every other attempt to implement it, then you are like the Brexiteers who think that no deal will be a land of milk and honey...
     
  9. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,166

    To be honest your description is more in line with brexiters crazy talk.
     
  10. Faustus

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 20, 2007

    Posts: 5,314

    Why buy your food when you can plead poverty and get it for nowt. That seems to be the latest wheeze for many folk. Been plenty of evidence now that the system is being abused.
     
  11. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 30,696

    Location: Co Durham

    1922 committee have demand May resigns allegedly
     
  12. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,166

    Oh dear.
     
  13. satchef1

    Mobster

    Joined: Apr 17, 2009

    Posts: 3,825

    Didn't work last time.

    Won't work this time.

    It's just a shame they jumped the gun before Christmas, as I think we're now at a point where she could lose a vote for leadership of the Tory Party.
     
  14. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,166

    Who might replace her is slightly more worrying than the thought of a no deal brexit and Im not even talking Corbyn.
     
  15. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 18,038

    Ahh yes the usual Tory ***** that everyone is a liar and thief, disgraceful.

    This country is dying because of this inability to empathise, hope you’re enjoying others suffering. :)
     
  16. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 30,696

    Location: Co Durham

    He doesn’t care so long as there is more money for his triple locked pension,
     
  17. TheOracle

    Capodecina

    Joined: Sep 30, 2005

    Posts: 10,824

    This is proably the wake up call the country needed. I was watching a show on Netflix a while back, set in the Victorian age and westminster was exactly the same!!!!

    come on, get with the times. Act a bit more professional.
     
  18. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,396

    Location: Plymouth

    This is my fear. I don't see any likely winner of a tory leadership election to be better for the country, nor do I see corbyn as a better choice. There are some alternative choices in the labour party that would work, but I don't see corbyn stepping down, nor do I necessarily see the party membership voting to bring the party back to its senses.

    Fundamentally, the problem is that neither party memberships, who ultimately choose both party leader and party policy, are in any way representative of the country at large. Pointing out that I don't see a better outcome right now if we changed the prime minister is not, in any way, a defence of the current prime minister, she is awful, useless and incompetent, but that doesn't mean there aren't worse options on both sides.
     
  19. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 30,696

    Location: Co Durham

    As they said on the radio this morning, in any other EU country the Tories and Labour parties wouldnt exist as they do now.

    The ERG would be the National Front in France or the AFD in Germany. Its only in this country and the way our democracy is set up that we get so many smaller groups clubbing together under one banner, Tory or Labour.
     
  20. JeditOjanen

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 7, 2011

    Posts: 4,051

    You're talking about walking out of May's meeting with opposition leaders? That wasn't an own goal, it was Vince Cable playing as the 12th man for the Tories.

    1) The meeting could not have been about significant business because Umunna and Soubry were there; as they are not party leaders, they don't have the necessary clearances.

    2) Apparently Chuka was not actually invited and just tagged along with Soubry. He was allowed in because of …

    3) The meeting wasn't a discussion. May just brought all the senior opposition figures in so she could rant at them for not supporting her deal.

    Incidentally, it's reported that Cable also walked out. Not a good look for the leader of the party that says it wants Brexit stopped, which is probably why he forgot to mention it while he was attacking Corbyn and defending May as she went full Downfall meme. As ever, scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds.