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The Conservative Party: Where do we go from here?

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Gigabit, Jun 10, 2017.

  1. JeditOjanen

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 7, 2011

    Posts: 3,965

    You're talking about walking out of May's meeting with opposition leaders? That wasn't an own goal, it was Vince Cable playing as the 12th man for the Tories.

    1) The meeting could not have been about significant business because Umunna and Soubry were there; as they are not party leaders, they don't have the necessary clearances.

    2) Apparently Chuka was not actually invited and just tagged along with Soubry. He was allowed in because of …

    3) The meeting wasn't a discussion. May just brought all the senior opposition figures in so she could rant at them for not supporting her deal.

    Incidentally, it's reported that Cable also walked out. Not a good look for the leader of the party that says it wants Brexit stopped, which is probably why he forgot to mention it while he was attacking Corbyn and defending May as she went full Downfall meme. As ever, scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds.
     
  2. doodah

    Capodecina

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 19,250

    Location: London

    @JeditOjanen fair enough :). My initial gripe with Corbyn were the optics regardless of unsavoury the conditions night have been. And whilst I have tried to give Corbyn a chance, seemingly scoring own goals seems to be trait of his.
     
  3. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 30,663

    Location: Co Durham

    Cable walked out cause May told them all the people had voted for pain and that is what she is going to deliver. No point staying.
     
  4. stockhausen

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 30, 2006

    Posts: 9,194

    Chris Davies, the Tory MP for Brecon and Radnorshire has pleaded guilty to making an "honest mistake" when submitting expenses claims for furniture and pictures for his constituency office in 2016. This appears to have involved manually creating two invoices for £450 and £250.

    How exactly does one honestly create "false or misleading" invoices by mistake?

    Hopefully Mr Davies will have the good manners to resign forthwith.

    Your future is unsafe in Tory hands.
     
  5. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,078

    And yet while trying to make this all about Corbyn as usual cable forgot to say it was a pointless meeting anyway. Its like he forgot what working with the Tories is really like.
    Maybe if Corbyn hadnt walked out there might have been more noise about how utterly pointless the meeting was, a bit like how the EU must feel everytime they see Mays name come up on their phone screens. Its amazing loads of stories about Corbyn walking but nothing about how pointless the meeting was. Its just so childish.
     
  6. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,078

    Well this is embarrassing!

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/mar/22/tory-mp-christopher-davies-admits-expenses-fraud
    Man of good character yet tried to put forward "false or misleading information for an allowance claim using an invoice he knew to be false or misleading" No! Thats not the actions of a man of good character, just someone that might not have been caught before.

    Do we think he will step down or at the very minimum lose the Tory whip until they need him for an important vote?
    All at it.
     
  7. chrcoluk

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 27, 2015

    Posts: 3,068

    If anyone makes this a billboard the tories are screwed with may as leader.

    Picture of may with a quote, "They voted for pain, and I will deliver it".
     
  8. JeditOjanen

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 7, 2011

    Posts: 3,965

    No, if Corbyn had stayed more people would be taking the meeting seriously and Cable would have made a post criticising him for listening to May.
     
  9. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,254

    Location: Plymouth

    I don't believe Corbyn had any intention of staying. The really cynical part of me suspects that if the independent group hadn't been there, he'd have used that as his reason to flounce out just the same. (this is the same cynical part that also believes that may just invited them there to tell them they had to vote for the plan).

    Even at this late stage, all the party leaders are still playing at political points scoring rather than than actually trying to find a way forward. I genuinely believe we need our mps to stop following the wreckers at the top of their respective parties and take control, and I have written to my mp to express such a view. He's a dishonest corbyn sychopant who doesn't care at all about the people he represents, so I doubt it will do any good, but at least I have tried.
     
  10. Faustus

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 20, 2007

    Posts: 5,314

    I said ‘abused’ I didn’t say everyone is a liar and a cheat. More Labour hyperbole.
     
  11. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 30,663

    Location: Co Durham

    Irrelevant. All systems will get abused. There are always people in this country who will. But you are just deflecting and dismissing the fact that the 5th largest economy in the world has rising food bank issues, rising homeless, schools closing one day a week as just “people abusing the system, move on,nothing to see here”. Poor attitude to take and seems to be most of what the Tory party believes so they ignore the problem.
     
  12. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,078

    Haha, yes you are right.
    Theres a suprise.
     
  13. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,254

    Location: Plymouth

    I love the way you selectively quote to avoid having to tackle a difficult point...

    Can you provide evidence that Corbyn has acted in good faith on brexit?
     
  14. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,078

    Its not a difficult point at all. Your post just sounded like another paranoid ramble as usual when it comes to Labour.
     
  15. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,254

    Location: Plymouth

    My post clearly stated I didn't believe either party leader was actually trying to solve the crisis, and that they were both a major problem.

    Do you disagree with that assessment, and on the basis on what actions?
     
  16. robgmun

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 30, 2006

    Posts: 14,280

    First thing you've said that i agree with
     
  17. chrcoluk

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 27, 2015

    Posts: 3,068

    The one bit I perhaps agree on is both parties are trying to avoid moving first on revocation article 50, as they dont want to be labelled as the party that ignored the referendum result. If labour move first then you can bet next election tories will attack them relentlessly on it, and vice versa as well.

    However in this respect Labour are clearly been not as bad, they are now talking about a peoples vote as an option, whilst May is obsessed with brexit been carried out. The tories consideration of putting all these new options up for a vote I feel is coming from the ministers working under her not May herself who seems to have completely lost it.
     
  18. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,254

    Location: Plymouth

    I'm not sure you are really comparing like with like by comparing May with labour. The comparison should be may with corbyn, and the Tories with labour.
     
  19. Faustus

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 20, 2007

    Posts: 5,314

    Schools are pretty bad at managing budgets despite record investment over the last 15 years. Just look where a large proportion of your council tax goes.

    House ownership is not a 'right' neither is it a given that councils should be funding house building off the backs of local taxpayers.

    By saying all systems get abused is to give the practice tacit approval.
     
  20. Faustus

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 20, 2007

    Posts: 5,314

    Though even more unsafe in Labour hands.