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The Conservative Party: Where do we go from here?

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Gigabit, Jun 10, 2017.

  1. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 20,677

    It’s choosing their leader it’s choosing our global representative. **** sakes stop trying to pick holes in this.

    Moaned for years about Junker and co and when it comes to exalted perfect tories, it’s different?
     
  2. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 30,598

    Location: Welling, London

    That’s not your choice on whether you want that person though. It’s the party that leads the country, and they were chosen only a couple of years ago for a five year term.
     
  3. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 30,598

    Location: Welling, London

    You’re just throwing a strop because you don’t want Boris leading the country. Well, wait until the next election and vote him out.
     
  4. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 20,677

    He can’t lead ****, he has a majority of 1 with the dup.

    I am not scared, I’m just bored of this pantomime you think is making Britain great.

    In October parliament will take control again to ask for a three year extension to have the GE.
     
  5. cheesyboy

    Capodecina

    Joined: Dec 7, 2012

    Posts: 11,757

    Location: Gloucestershire

    I think the huge difference a particular leader makes to their party's policy (imagine the difference between, say, Ken Clarke and Mark Francois leading the Tories) illustrates quite well the weakness of our system, where you can only vote for the party.

    Our democracy doesn't make room for the general public to have their say on the leader but, frankly, it should.
     
  6. JRS

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jun 6, 2004

    Posts: 14,006

    Location: Burton-on-Trent

    So what would you be saying if they were to somehow screw up and elect a full-bore Remainer as leader, who proceeded to build enough consensus in Parliament to revoke Article 50? 'Oh well, I'll just vote for someone different at the next election'? Or would you be, quite rightly, a bit annoyed that the party you voted into power to carry out the glorious revolution of Brexit had reversed course all of a sudden and want a say in whether or not that party should carry on before it was too late? ;)
     
  7. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 12,751

    Location: Hertfordshire

    Under what circumstances could we have a GE now?
     
  8. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 30,598

    Location: Welling, London

    Of course I’d be annoyed, but I wouldn’t be throwing tantrums about not getting a chance to choose the leader. If I cared that much, I’d join the party so I get a vote.
     
  9. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 30,598

    Location: Welling, London

    If it’s called by the new PM or there’s a no confidence vote on the government.
     
  10. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 30,598

    Location: Welling, London

    I don’t see why some of you are so keen on a GE anyway if Boris is the PM. Never underestimate the popularity of Boris with the less cerebrally gifted public. It could backfire on remainers quite badly.

    Farage could get involved and shift his BP voters to the Tories. Then you would be in trouble.
     
  11. JRS

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jun 6, 2004

    Posts: 14,006

    Location: Burton-on-Trent

    Again, no-one is throwing a tantrum about not getting to choose the leader of the Conservative party. All they are saying is that a change in leader means that the party they voted in/that got voted in at the last GE has undergone a radical change, and it might be nice to have a say in whether or not they continue in the job having changed so much.
     
  12. Mercenary Keyboard Warrior

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Aug 4, 2007

    Posts: 9,311

    Location: Wilds of suffolk

    Sort of like voting for May and ending up with Boris you mean? ;)

    Not that I rated May particularly highly, but in relative terms...
     
  13. VincentHanna

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 30, 2013

    Posts: 18,849

    Who is throwing a tantrum?
     
  14. Mason-

    Soldato

    Joined: Jun 18, 2010

    Posts: 5,239

    Location: Essex

    Fixed that for you.
     
  15. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 30,598

    Location: Welling, London

    You do get a say, at the next GE.
     
  16. Mercenary Keyboard Warrior

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Aug 4, 2007

    Posts: 9,311

    Location: Wilds of suffolk

    I think rob is right on this.
    The rules are quite clear you elect your MP, if that MP is aligned with a party and they have enough sway to form a government then that party can do what they want with the executive positions.

    Nothing says that the party leader has to be PM, its just assumed.

    The question on whether the most powerful role in the UK should be able to be switched with no come back by the public is a different question.
    Even if you voted directly for the PM if logical rules were in place it would be like the US which has a succession list anyway.
     
  17. VincentHanna

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 30, 2013

    Posts: 18,849

    And like I said, normally that is fine.

    But normally that person isn't in charge of breaking your country away from your biggest trading partner of 40 years.
     
  18. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 30,598

    Location: Welling, London

    Refer to my post 6671. A GE with Boris in charge is a risky business.
     
  19. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 20,677

    Yes, but you indirectly vote for a PM when you vote for a party.

    This wasn’t the case with brown, which the tories moaned about for months. The next PM will bluntly unelected, the party members are irrelevant.
     
  20. Mason-

    Soldato

    Joined: Jun 18, 2010

    Posts: 5,239

    Location: Essex

    In regards to GE.

    If Boris becomes PM, or any other Tory hopeful for that matter. They will need to get the confidence of the house or the queen won't let them form a government. A handful of Tory MPs have already said they would resign the whip if Boris became PM. On top of this the new leader would have to renogotiate the agreement with the DUP for a majority. What this actually means is, it is very likely that Corbyn could call a no confidence vote and we will have a general election with the new Tory leader.

    Or the new Tory leader will realise all of this and call a GE asap.

    In short: if Boris becomes leader there will be a new GE.