Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (June Poll)

[MookJong]

Well I like the fact that Cameron was finally critical of the EU again last night. I think his arguments were a lot more reasoned and he will have won some of the undecided crowd back.

He didn't try and patronise the audience and actually took a realistic position that these organisations are a pain in the **** but they have their advantages.

I thought the audience questions were good, apart from that crazy woman saying black people would see more racism if we left the EU? What was that all about!!!

 

[MookJong]

One argument i hadn't heard before was not being able to send criminals back to europe if we were to leave the eu..

Yes I was not aware of these new rules coming into play. I think this and a few other things sparked my interest. Remain should be making a lot of noise about that fact....of course it admits that there are foreign criminals in the country

 

[balky12]

One thing I am surprised hasn't been picked on is Cameron's hypocritical stance when it comes to power.

He is all for, supposedly, devolution to regions within UK. Scotland, Wales now on its way to having a parliament, even cities with regional powers like Manchester.

With the other hand he is all for the EU and having another level of Government above our very own elected one...

Strikes me as a 'have what you want UK' it won't matter too much anyways...?

 

[Six6siX]

One thing I am surprised hasn't been picked on is Cameron's hypocritical stance when it comes to power.

He is all for, supposedly, devolution to regions within UK. Scotland, Wales now on its way to having a parliament, even cities with regional powers like Manchester.

With the other hand he is all for the EU and having another level of Government above our very own elected one...

Strikes me as a 'have what you want UK' it won't matter too much anyways...?

How is that hypocritical?

It's just a level of regional bureaucracy below that of the national government which in turn is a level below that of the EU government

 

[balky12]

Yes I was not aware of these new rules coming into play. I think this and a few other things sparked my interest. Remain should be making a lot of noise about that fact....of course it admits that there are foreign criminals in the country

Probably because it is a load of rubbish in practice. If someone committed a serious crime in Europe and fled to the UK why would the country of origin not want then sent back to face justice?

If they move to UK then commit and offence then you couldn't send them back anyways, they are a UK resident now?

If said criminal originated from outside EU we can't send them back right now anyways either.

Being out, in theory, would give us tighter border control also.

I think it's such a weak argument that doesn't carry too much weight.

 

[Caged]

How is a desire for devolution of certain powers to specific regions but support of UK membership within the EU hypocritical? They seem like pretty similar concepts to me.

 

[MookJong]

In the end there is no way to win. Clearly we will lose some advantages if we leave and clearly we will have to put up with some EU discomfort if we remain.

It's down to the voter to decide what they want to sacrifice, but there will have to be sacrifice.

 

[balky12]

How is that hypocritical?

It's just a level of regional bureaucracy below that of the national government which in turn is a level below that of the EU government

What? Devolution is giving power away from a centralised government..

Cameron is fighting to give a more centralised government, EU, power? How is that not hypocritical?

Like me telling my children they can make decisions themselves but get approval from grandad first.

 

[MookJong]

If they move to UK then commit and offence then you couldn't send them back anyways, they are a UK resident now?

This is exactly what the policy aims to change, we will be able to deport them. This is something we cannot do for criminals outside the EU.

 

[Trifid]

Farage could have answered the 'racist' question much better by saying he wants a points based system that treats all people equally, regardless of their country of origin.

It seemed to me that the audience was quite savage on Farage and Cameron looked much more prepared then he had previously. Farage definitely lost points on the pharmaceuticals industry question, particularly with the alternate medicines line...

 

[Six6siX]

What? Devolution is giving power away from a centralised government..

Cameron is fighting to give a more centralised government, EU, power? How is that not hypocritical?

Like me telling my children they can make decisions themselves but get approval from grandad first.

No it's not giving it away - it's a form of delegation. The delegating government still retains power in the chain and the delegate still has to conform to the rules set by those higher up in the chain.

It's a commonly used scenario in any business...your CEO/MD doesn't manage individual employees, the organisation has it's power delegated into regional management.

 

[Mr Jack]

Doesn't farage claim 12% of our exports go to the EU. Data I found suggest over a quarter. 11billion of 42b per month

No, he didn't. He said exports to Europe made up about 12% of our economy. Remember that most UK trade is internal.

 

[balky12]

No it's not giving it away - it's a form of delegation. The delegating government still retains power in the chain and the delegate still has to conform to the rules set by those higher up in the chain.

It's a commonly used scenario in any business...your CEO/MD doesn't manage individual employees, the organisation has it's power delegated into regional management.

A better explanation than mine and I see where you are coming from however I'm not entirely convinced. The delegation bit I get. But do we need another level of Government above ours? It's one thing to delegate power downwards when things get too much for you to handle. But to submit power upwards when nothing was ever there historically (pre European Parliament) seems a bit much.

 

[Simon]

No, he didn't. He said exports to Europe made up about 12% of our economy. Remember that most UK trade is internal.

Ok thanks. So what is this point related to. Are we going to be able to better if we lose this by going elsewhere ? Seems like an irrelevant stat really

 

[Trifid]

Ok thanks. So what is this point related to. Are we going to be able to better if we lose this by going elsewhere ? Seems like an irrelevant stat really

The notion of losing it all is nonsense. The question is how much would it be dented? And would business recover this loss through other ventures supported by new trade deals. The answer is probably it depends on what is in Mr Burns mystery box posted earlier and nobody knows. And then, is this worth it? Does the EU really affect you? It strikes me, that this referendum has done a fair bit of damage to the EUs reputation and short term loss in business confidence.

 

[RaohNS]

That black woman (only way to describe her unless someone noted her name) was odious. Rolling her eyes before he had even said anything then just kept interrupting. How can you have debate with that level of "I will ask you a question I want answered but don't give a stuff what you answer"

From watching about 30mins of Farage he seemed pretty good, but again I was right in earlier comments that the audience would begin baiting him and his credibility because there is very little as can be argued against him really

 

[Mr Jack]

Ok thanks. So what is this point related to. Are we going to be able to better if we lose this by going elsewhere ? Seems like an irrelevant stat really

He's attempting to diminish the importance of exports and thus the impact that leaving the single market will have.

 

[Six6siX]

A better explanation than mine and I see where you are coming from however I'm not entirely convinced. The delegation bit I get. But do we need another level of Government above ours? It's one thing to delegate power downwards when things get too much for you to handle. But to submit power upwards when nothing was ever there historically (pre European Parliament) seems a bit much.

That is the ultimate question! Historically it was never necessary but we live in a different time now - considerably different in many aspects and that warrants a more centralised approach with respect to trade, movement of people, security, regulation and economy on a global scale. Yes, you might be giving up control over certain things but it's not as if we don't have a say in any of it. For the sake of being part of the bigger picture and the benefits it brings to the table, I believe that is a minor inconvenience.

 

[Tunney]

Meanwhile in UKIP land, one of their MEPs isn't happy about the way that the BBC handled the Farage/Cameron programme last night.

 

[Tefal]

Meanwhile in UKIP land, one of their MEPs isn't happy about the way that the BBC handled the Farage/Cameron programme last night.

Imriel Morgan has been revealed as the shouty offensive black woman on the ITV show who has worked for the Huffington Post and is a professional diversity blogger. Shouldn't ITV had made that clear rather than pretend she was just passing the studio when asked to submit a question.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3630039/PM-Farage-battle-Brexit-primetime-referendum-special-Cameron-won-t-debate-EU-head-head.html

Scroll down for her picture.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/imriel-morgan/


@ImiMorgan
"Freelance Content Marketer, Growth Hacker, Diversity Advocate, Co-Founder @ShoutOutLdn, Co-host @MelaninMille. 'I don't argue to convert, I argue to be heard.'"

Doesn't work then either.