Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (June Poll)

[balky12]

Only a slightly different topic... Didn't take Sadiq Khan long to do a U-turn on his main policy it would seem.

London fares will be increasing...

 

[Burnsy2023]

Imagine the uproar if leave won and then DC was like, nah **** it, we'll stay thanks.

It wouldn't be David Cameron saying that, it'd be the majority of parliament.

 

[Trifid]

Lord Astor said this yesterday -

Cameron was twice asked to confirm today at PMQ's that whatever the result was it would be binding and he couldn't confirm it, just waffled something about the will of the people.

I wonder how this will play out a bit further into the future. The population saying no to the EU and the UK government not acting on it. Would it keep the EU on a shorter leash? Would it be used to get actual reform of Europe? Or a better side line deal for the UK going forward. Would other countries push for their own referendum?

 

[antijoke]

It wouldn't be David Cameron saying that, it'd be the majority of parliament.

OK Mr. Pedantic, but my point still stands.

 

[robfosters]

It wouldn't be David Cameron saying that, it'd be the majority of parliament.

That couldn't happen, there would be absolute riots, and I would be very disappointed with any remain members on here who supported ignoring the will of the electorate. I can guess who would support it.

 

[Skunkworks]

Anyone from the Leave camp want to try and defend Vote.Leave creating a fake register to vote page?

Only a thicko would fall for that, and I thought you trendy lefty Remainers were all for thick people not vote?

 

[John40]

That couldn't happen, there would be absolute riots, and I would be very disappointed with any remain members on here who supported ignoring the will of the electorate. I can guess who would support it.

I think they would take any threat of trouble as a chance well worth taking.

 

[Tunney]

Only a slightly different topic... Didn't take Sadiq Khan long to do a U-turn on his main policy it would seem.

London fares will be increasing...

Some fares will be increasing. The ones controlled by government and not the mayor of London.

 

[V F]

That couldn't happen, there would be absolute riots, and I would be very disappointed with any remain members on here who supported ignoring the will of the electorate. I can guess who would support it.

One thing I've noticed the most about this election is all the little dictators it has revealed out there.

 

[Cosimo]

Only a slightly different topic... Didn't take Sadiq Khan long to do a U-turn on his main policy it would seem.

London fares will be increasing...

It appears that he forgot to mention that Travelcards, monthly Oyster cards and daily caps are exempt from the freeze. How very convenient.

 

[robfosters]

One thing I've noticed the most about this election is all the little dictators it has revealed out there.

What do you mean by that? I'm anything but a dictator, I think it's imperative that the referendum vote is followed. That is about as far from dictatorial as you can get.

 

[V F]

What do you mean by that? I'm anything but a dictator, I think it's imperative that the referendum vote is followed. That is about as far from dictatorial as you can get.

Both some people in the establishment as well as some of the public. How hostile some of their views are should a leave happen.

 

[Six6siX]

It's a little amusing how those voting leave are getting wound up by that statement.

If the quote by Lord Astor is accurate in describing the due process in case of a leave vote in the referendum, then failure to adhere to this (and actually leave) would be another example of government 'doing what they want' - just as a lot of leave voters claim the EU does.

And guess what, it's this very same government that people voting to leave want to give more power to for decisions regarding the country. Irony much?

 

[V F]

Who is getting wound up?

 

[platypus]

Only a slightly different topic... Didn't take Sadiq Khan long to do a U-turn on his main policy it would seem.

London fares will be increasing...

Already gone back on most of his cycling promises, not that I'm surprised.

 

[Six6siX]

Who is getting wound up?

Imagine the uproar if leave won and then DC was like, nah **** it, we'll stay thanks.

That couldn't happen, there would be absolute riots, and I would be very disappointed with any remain members on here who supported ignoring the will of the electorate. I can guess who would support it.

 

[scorza]

I'm 100% sure that if a Leave vote is returned by the referendum, then the British government will take us out of the EU. Our democracy is mature enough to ensure this happens. The Tories can instigate a vote of no-confidence if Cameron does this - he wouldn't survive. I don't have much time for Corbyn, but I honestly can't see him instructing his MPs to vote against the will of the people, he isn't exactly pro-EU despite what he says. The SNP are there to make mischief in England but apart from them it's not going to be an issue.

My main concern are the suggestions that we've already decided to go into the EEA on leaving the EU without holding a proper debate. I tell you what, let's first make sure we win the Leave vote then we can discuss those eventualities

 

[V F]

Six6siX, you and I must have really different definitions of being wound up.

 

[Cosimo]

Who is getting wound up?

At a guess Brexiters who read this in the Times yesterday:

Pro-Europe MPs will fight a rearguard battle to stop Britain leaving the single market even after a Brexit vote, senior Tories have warned.

Those negotiating Britain’s new relationship with the EU after a Leave vote have been told that they would not be given a “blank cheque” by MPs if they thought the new arrangements were not in the country’s interests.

Fewer than 200 of parliament’s 650 MPs support the Brexit campaign, giving Remain supporters an overwhelming cross-party majority. Some pro-Remain ministers believe that votes in the Commons could be used to put pressure on the government to keep Britain inside the single market.

It is being seen as a “reverse Maastricht” — a reference to the way Eurosceptics attempted to stop the government signing up to the EU’s Maastricht treaty in the 1990s.

The pound hit a three-week low against the dollar yesterday as some opinion polls swung towards Leave, leading to jitters in the City. A poll for The Times gave Remain a one-point lead today, on 43 per cent, but the Brexit campaign was judged to be more honest and positive.


Staying in the single market would mean that Britain would not be hit with trade barriers but it would also have to accept the EU’s free-movement rules and a series of EU regulations. Such a move could prove controversial, because Vote Leave is promising that voting for Brexit would allow Britain to “take back control of our border”.

It would also leave MPs open to charges from Brexit supporters that they were ignoring a democratic referendum vote to leave the EU — something they have said they would not do.

There will have to be dozens of votes in the Commons to disentangle Britain from the EU, however, giving MPs a chance to shape the means of exit.

Stephen Kinnock, Labour MP for Aberavon, yesterday became the first MP publicly to discuss the possibility of holding a parliamentary vote designed to limit the Brexit negotiations after a Leave vote. He denied that he was suggesting that parliament should not respect the will of the people.

“MPs will be presented with a very difficult choice in the event of a Leave vote, because we have no idea what a post-Brexit UK looks like, and the referendum will not provide a specific mandate in terms of which Brexit model has the support of the electorate,” he said.

He claimed to be “posing the question” as to what MPs could do if the option on the table was to leave the single market, which he said would have a catastrophic impact on the economy.

Parliament could be called to vote on a key consequence of Brexit within days of a vote to leave the EU. David Cameron has said that he will start the formal mechanism for leaving the EU “immediately”, but the constitutional position is not clear. Michael Gove, the justice secretary, has said that the two-year formal talks would be delayed to allow initial negotiations with Brussels over Britain’s future.

Senior government officials have also warned that it could take 250 pieces of legislation at Westminster to take back competencies that have been ceded to Brussels over decades of EU membership. MPs who opposed leaving would have plenty of opportunity to wage a long war of attrition.

Some Tories suspect that opposition parties such as the SNP would also attempt to hold votes to divide the Conservatives. One senior Tory said: “It’s a serious issue. I don’t think it will be a blank cheque for Leave. MPs will take seriously that people have voted to leave the EU but not at all costs. If the government of the day can’t negotiate a satisfactory deal that business is happy with and is in British interests then I don’t think it is incumbent on parliament to give them a free hand.

“The Scottish National Party or others could well play politics on this and see if they can cause a rebellion. It is also unrealistic to assume that this renegotiation will happen in a vacuum.”

Brexit campaigners reacted angrily to the idea of a delay. Liam Fox, the former Tory defence secretary, said: “It is unthinkable that when given a clear instruction politicians should have the arrogance to try to ignore the democratic will of the people.”

Matthew Elliott, the chief executive of Vote Leave, said: “If we vote leave, it will be very clear that people have voted to take back control of our border.”

A Downing Street source said the idea of parliamentary votes over single market membership was no more than hypothetical speculation. The source added: “We are focused on making the case that we’re stronger, safer and better off in the EU. We will respect the outcome of the referendum.”

Other senior Tories believe that holding such a vote would be “total fantasy” because EU leaders would be under no obligation to let the UK stay in the single market. “It assumes that we would have the power to demand to join something that we had just left,” one former minister backing Remain said. “We wouldn’t, so this is completely bonkers. If you leave the EU, you leave the EU.”

Analysis
It is in both sides’ interests to present the EU referendum as a choice for the British people, with MPs having no more power than any other voter (Francis Elliott writes). In fact, parliament will be central to shaping the relationship that the UK has with the EU from the moment that the result is clear.

David Cameron has said that he will trigger the formal mechanism to leave the EU “immediately” in the event of a Brexit vote.

However, it is not clear that he has the constitutional authority to invoke the Article 50 process without at least cabinet approval and possibly a full parliamentary vote.

After the formal two-year talks have been triggered, Westminster will be closely involved in the negotiations as MPs demand a say over key issues such as the trading relationship.

The real potential for parliamentary warfare comes as the UK starts to take back powers it has ceded to Brussels. One senior government figure recently warned that it could take a decade of legislative activity to cope with the return of policies on financial services, agriculture, health and safety and employment.

One suggestion is that it would take at least 25 separate bills in ten Queen’s Speeches to fully adjust to Brexit, many of them highly controversial.

It is true only in the narrowest sense that MPs have the same power as any one else to determine Britain’s future. In fact, in the event of a Brexit vote, it will be up to them to decide what sort of future comes next.

You can imagine what mess there will be on leaving.

 

[Judgeneo]

Quotes

Thats not getting wound up at the establishment, thats getting angry at the suggestion of purposely ignoring the will of the people in a national referendum