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The Labour Party: Where do we go from here?

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by q974739, Nov 25, 2015.

  1. RatmanGB

    Gangster

    Joined: Jan 12, 2010

    Posts: 133

    Trying to make sense of Labour's position in view of Corbyn's and Chakrabarti's latest comments. Is it that Labour now supports a referendum on a deal, but that the other option might not be remain? And that even if it was, Labour might campaign for Leave?
     
  2. JeditOjanen

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 7, 2011

    Posts: 4,182

    Labour wouldn't really be campaigning for Leave or Remain in a confirmatory referendum. They'll be providing a contract with all details known, spelling out the pros and cons, and asking the people if they want to sign it.
     
  3. RedvGreen

    Mobster

    Joined: Dec 2, 2009

    Posts: 3,590

    Location: Midlands

    What with the epic wordplay given by Corbyn, this wouldn't surprise me in the slightest for it to be...

    "We will campaign for a People's Vote!!!"

    Labour Peoples Vote...
    Option 1 = No Deal
    Option 2 = TM Deal
     
  4. do_ron_ron

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Oct 23, 2002

    Posts: 8,761

    Two of Labour's MSP's in Scotland quit the front bench. The Brexit spokesman

    The Justice spokesman resigned said

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-48435192

    Scotland used to be a Labour fiefdom gaining more than half the available MPs(usually between 40-50MPs). The last two they got a high of seven. The difference between Govt and opposition.
     
  5. Pudney

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 6, 2005

    Posts: 5,213

    Location: Essex

    That's not really true though is it? If it were, the SNP and Labour could be in coalition right now (total 42 Scottish MPs). It's a wider problem than Scotland.
     
  6. do_ron_ron

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Oct 23, 2002

    Posts: 8,761

    Labour has seven Scottish MPs now, before they got between 40 and 50 MPs. Add that number to Labour's current total and they have the majority, hence Govt. Simple arithmetic.
     
  7. Pudney

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 6, 2005

    Posts: 5,213

    Location: Essex

    Ok, Labour currently has 262 MPs. SNP has 35. If you add ALL of the SNP's MPs to Labour (giving 42 Scottish MPs, which is within your 40 to 50 range) then Labour would have 297 MPs. This is less than the Tories who have 317 and no majority. That is simple arithmetic. If you gave the Labour the maximum of your 50 range and assume these seats were won from the Tories, this would still leave Labour with fewer seats (305 v 309). Again, simple arithmetic.
     
  8. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 19,212

    Labour hasn’t ever won an election because of Scotland.

    Labour needs to win in England and stop being **** with pitiful excuses. Their party will collapse fully in the next GE in Scotland by the looks of it, most of the seats are thin margins, they should abandon the north.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2019
  9. do_ron_ron

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Oct 23, 2002

    Posts: 8,761

    *embarrassed* I double counted.
     
  10. SPG

    Soldato

    Joined: Jul 28, 2010

    Posts: 5,339

    Soft brexit ........ so pointless leaving then. All the rules to follow yet no voice on the rules.

    Well done for giving votes to idiot farage and the lib dems.

    Maybe i am out of touch :)
     
  11. Pudney

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 6, 2005

    Posts: 5,213

    Location: Essex

    Haha, no worries. I did wonder if I was misunderstanding your post and kept rereading it! :D
     
  12. JeditOjanen

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 7, 2011

    Posts: 4,182

    Abandoning the North is why ScotLab collapsed in the first place.
     
  13. SPG

    Soldato

    Joined: Jul 28, 2010

    Posts: 5,339

    They didn't abandon it, they took it for granted, which is far far worse :)
     
  14. Freddie1980

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 25, 2009

    Posts: 6,723

    Location: Billericay, UK

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-48472977

    Remind me how long was it between Allister Campbell saying he was going to vote for the Liberal Democrats and then finding out he had been expelled? Two weeks? Yet in anther anti Semitism row it took nearly 6 months to suspend Peter Willsman.

    I swear every time the Tories do something stupid Labour seems to want to match them at every turn. No wonder both these parties are getting a drubbing in the polls.[/quote]
     
  15. VincentHanna

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 30, 2013

    Posts: 18,219

  16. Freddie1980

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 25, 2009

    Posts: 6,723

    Location: Billericay, UK

    It still doesn't excuse them for how long it's taking them to get throw all the other claims that have been bought against labour members. When your party is faced accusations that's bigoted/racist/anti-Semitic etc the fast track approach to expelling Campbell doesn't exactly help matters. I guess that given Campbell is a face of 'new labour' there are a number of individuals who couldn't wait to stick the boot in and kick his kind out of the party.
     
  17. bobuk

    Gangster

    Joined: Jan 25, 2009

    Posts: 301

    I presume that if Labour has a confirmatory vote on the final deal without a remain option on the the table, then if the deal is rejected it only leaves a no deal left ?
     
  18. chrcoluk

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 27, 2015

    Posts: 3,493

    Interestingly my sister (her partner is hard tory so imagine the influence he has), told me a few days ago she would vote labour if they were not supporting brexit, instead she will vote lib dem again.

    Her partner says in next GE he is abstaining as wont support left wing, but thinks the tories are a joke right now.

    But I think labour are losing votes with their current stance. Vince Cable taking maximum advantage of it.
     
  19. GAC

    Mobster

    Joined: Dec 11, 2004

    Posts: 3,774

    so with the lib dems and the conservatives having a change of leader i wonder if the penny will finally drop at labour hq and they have a change as well.

    i know living in a dream land, but you'd have thought by now with how much support labours losing through its leaders inability to give any sort of answer other than twaddle about the party membership having discussions over brexit the party would finally say enough's enough and its time to get a leader who will actually try and lead.
     
  20. BowdonUK

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 17, 2016

    Posts: 2,268

    I see the Labour candidate for the Peterborough by-election, Lisa Forbes, is already in trouble for liking a tweet about 'Zionist Slave Masters'. So thats Labour out of contendership, unless she has a solid personal connection on the ground.