*** The official 2018 MacBook Pro thread (it has six cores and everything!) ***

[UberTiger]

Great WSJ article here on the state of the keyboards with a fun interactive touch to drive home the problem

https://www.wsj.com/graphics/apple-...-problem/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app

 

[ElliotHand]

Great WSJ article here on the state of the keyboards with a fun interactive touch to drive home the problem

https://www.wsj.com/graphics/apple-...-problem/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app

Seconded, great article.

 

[Phemo]

I took my MBP into the Apple store on Monday because of my dodgy keyboard. The E key was the biggest problem and I could easily replicate double presses if I pushed a certain part of it, but I'm sure I've had issues with space, I and O keys too but to a much lesser extent. The guy in the store took the key off and I believe he just put the same one back on and the problem seemed to go away...for a couple of hours. Went back today and I've now left it with them for a complete top case replacement.

The issue is that now I just can't decide whether or not to keep the thing and run the (very likely) risk of it playing up again and this time being out of warranty or to just sell it on while it's got a brand new top case and still has some warranty left.

 

[dirtybeatfreak]

I took my MBP into the Apple store on Monday because of my dodgy keyboard. The E key was the biggest problem and I could easily replicate double presses if I pushed a certain part of it, but I'm sure I've had issues with space, I and O keys too but to a much lesser extent. The guy in the store took the key off and I believe he just put the same one back on and the problem seemed to go away...for a couple of hours. Went back today and I've now left it with them for a complete top case replacement.

The issue is that now I just can't decide whether or not to keep the thing and run the (very likely) risk of it playing up again and this time being out of warranty or to just sell it on while it's got a brand new top case and still has some warranty left.

The keyboard would have been replaced under Apples repair extension program, which covers your machine 4 years from purchase.

 

[Phemo]

Well that's the problem, the 4 year keyboard service program doesn't apply to the 2018 models so as of mid August I'm taking a gamble by keeping the thing. The work I've booked it in for today was of course free as it is still within its 1 year warranty but the repair authorisation says it would be £401.50 if it wasn't in warranty.

Hopefully they will include the 2018 models in the keyboard service program too, but knowing my luck they probably won't

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Where did you buy it from? All this one year warranty talk is nonsense you are protected under consumer law for up to 6 years from where you bought it from.

I think there is a lot of evidence that the fault existed when you bought it because the design is flawed so a claim under consumer law should be very easy.

 

[dirtybeatfreak]

Well that's the problem, the 4 year keyboard service program doesn't apply to the 2018 models so as of mid August I'm taking a gamble by keeping the thing. The work I've booked it in for today was of course free as it is still within its 1 year warranty but the repair authorisation says it would be £401.50 if it wasn't in warranty.

Hopefully they will include the 2018 models in the keyboard service program too, but knowing my luck they probably won't

This is true!, even though this whole thread is about the 2018 model I had omitted that fact lol. b0rn2sk8 is correct, if it's due to a fault then you could also claim on consumer law.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

It assumes the retailer hasn’t gone bust since you bought it

 

[dirtybeatfreak]

It assumes the retailer hasn’t gone bust since you bought it

He would still have 2 years from purchase as Apple will honour it themselves up to 2, after that period will they make you go back to original retailer so yea, if they went bust you'd be screwed heh.

 

[MacRS4]

Well, mine's been replaced even after them insisting there was nothing wrong with it in terms of throttling - there absolutely was. Under load it would settle at about 1.9-2Ghz. Which is daft.

Anyway, new one doesn't seem to drop below clock speed....and yet apparently there were 'no changes made to the design'. Struggling to believe them tbh.

 

[Phemo]

I got mine from an Apple store directly so no worries about them going bust just yet I guess my main concern is that even with extended warranty, do I potentially want to be having to get my laptop in for a top case replacement every few months? My 2013 MBP is still going strong over 5 years later. I can't say I'm confident that my 2018 MBP will still be holding up perfectly well in 5 years.

 

[dirtybeatfreak]

I got mine from an Apple store directly so no worries about them going bust just yet I guess my main concern is that even with extended warranty, do I potentially want to be having to get my laptop in for a top case replacement every few months? My 2013 MBP is still going strong over 5 years later. I can't say I'm confident that my 2018 MBP will still be holding up perfectly well in 5 years.

Well the 2018 was supposed to fix the issues you have been having. Don't think we have had many 2018s at all in for similar keyboard issues, so I think you should be ok. Hopefully, you just had bad luck. Apples are still the best build quality over all by far imo, especially when you see some of the other brands :O (looking at you HP)

 

[Phemo]

I'm still in two minds but we'll see. I got the call today saying my MBP was ready to pick up and I must admit, it is great to have it back. I haven't even bothered trying to use it for a few weeks now but I have definitely missed it. Was also pleasantly surprised to discover I've got a brand new battery with 0 charge cycles logged so that was a nice little bonus. I know the battery is stuck to the top case but I wasn't sure if they'd re-use the old battery with new adhesive tabs or if I'd get a refurbed top case with a used battery, but it's all brand spankers. Think my old battery only had about 100 charge cycles on it at the most so it wasn't like it had been used and abused, but a new one is nice all the same.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

I'm still in two minds but we'll see. I got the call today saying my MBP was ready to pick up and I must admit, it is great to have it back. I haven't even bothered trying to use it for a few weeks now but I have definitely missed it. Was also pleasantly surprised to discover I've got a brand new battery with 0 charge cycles logged so that was a nice little bonus. I know the battery is stuck to the top case but I wasn't sure if they'd re-use the old battery with new adhesive tabs or if I'd get a refurbed top case with a used battery, but it's all brand spankers. Think my old battery only had about 100 charge cycles on it at the most so it wasn't like it had been used and abused, but a new one is nice all the same.

It’s great that Apple just replace the entire top case including the batteries when it’s under warranty but...

The products are designed to be hard to repair and there just isn’t a need for the entire top case to be replaced for a keyboard repair. Almost every other laptop that isn’t a problem, even equivalent thin models. The overuse of adhesive in modern electronics is poor engineering IMO.

Out of warranty repairs for minor problems like a key not working become obnoxiously expensive. It’s ‘encourages’ people to upgrade instead of repairing a minor issue on a capable machine.

It’s an absolute disgrace when it comes to the environment, which is something Apple is pretends to be a leader in. Let’s be honest all of those components will be shredded to keep them out of the hands of the 3rd party repair supply chain. Products in 2019 should be designed with repair ability in mind especially with climate change becoming ever pressing problem.

The lack of parts for DIY repairs and 3rd party repair services is just anti consumer. But then on top of that Apple go out of their way to make this impossible by actively targeting the sector with litigation and using their locked down eco system to keep out 3rd party parts and official parts from dismantled products.

One day I do hope the Regulators step in on this anti consumer practice and puts a stop to it and all the other companies that try to replicate this.

 

[Phemo]

Completely agree, It's insane really. It's great for me at the moment in that I got a new battery and various other parts, but it's not so good for Apple in terms of cost of parts under warranty and not good for users repairing their own kit further down the line. There's just no need.

 

[dirtybeatfreak]

It’s great that Apple just replace the entire top case including the batteries when it’s under warranty but...

The products are designed to be hard to repair and there just isn’t a need for the entire top case to be replaced for a keyboard repair. Almost every other laptop that isn’t a problem, even equivalent thin models. The overuse of adhesive in modern electronics is poor engineering IMO.

Out of warranty repairs for minor problems like a key not working become obnoxiously expensive. It’s ‘encourages’ people to upgrade instead of repairing a minor issue on a capable machine.

It’s an absolute disgrace when it comes to the environment, which is something Apple is pretends to be a leader in. Let’s be honest all of those components will be shredded to keep them out of the hands of the 3rd party repair supply chain. Products in 2019 should be designed with repair ability in mind especially with climate change becoming ever pressing problem.

The lack of parts for DIY repairs and 3rd party repair services is just anti consumer. But then on top of that Apple go out of their way to make this impossible by actively targeting the sector with litigation and using their locked down eco system to keep out 3rd party parts and official parts from dismantled products.

One day I do hope the Regulators step in on this anti consumer practice and puts a stop to it and all the other companies that try to replicate this.

Pretty much spot on, except for the shredding of parts (at least most of them). They get sent back to Apple, parts that can be are re-used/fixed and used for what they call exchange parts.

One thing I will say in their defence, is that they are excellent at putting stuff right for free if it could in anyway be something they have caused, even out of warranty (for example the faulty keys).That is of course, provided it's a current model

 

[b0rn2sk8]

One thing I will say in their defence, is that they are excellent at putting stuff right for free if it could in anyway be something they have caused, even out of warranty (for example the faulty keys).That is of course, provided it's a current model

Perhaps if they made a better engineered product (with keyboards that don't stop working if they leave a clean room) they wouldn't be required to replace it for free under consumer law in the EU/UK.

It cracks me up when companies try to make a point about repairing/replacing something under 'goodwill'. No, its not goodwill, its the law and you are required to do it without me making a scene or me having to quote the relevant legislation at you...

Case and point to what I was saying above about their anti-consumer practices.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/apple-can-t...-moms-to-recover-lost-iphone-photos-1.5079639

TLDR

Apple actively removes posts from their support forum which suggest people seek 3rd party logic board repair for a water damaged device for the purposes of enabling data recovery. They promote posts that tell people its not possible instead. What can you do if you can't repair it? Buy a new one, what should you do to protect yourself against it happening in the future? Buy an iCloud subscription, I wonder who benefits from those....

Don't get me wrong they make some good products and I have owed a lot of them but in 2019 we are stuck between having our data mined to the extreme with constant tracking to sell adverts to us by Google and Apple with their anti consumer practices.

We are between a rock and a hard place but right now and I have only stayed with Apple because at least I will know when and where I will be 'bent over' and for how much, I also value my data. It's only a matter of time before there is a huge breach at Google and we know Facebook has had a 'difficult time' as of late.

 

[ChrisD.]

Does the 15" and the addition of extra cores and a GPU make a big difference? I'm using an external monitor as well as the in built one, I've got various apps open such as Chrome, Royal TSX, Insomnia, Outlook, Excel, Apple Mail, S4B, Atom, VMware Fusion (one VM), about 30-40 browser tabs and Tunnelblock for my VPN.

Animations and switching between screens especially with VMware Fusion running Win 10 I get a lot of slow down in terms of animation and the speed of the VM is pretty crap (got Powershell ISE open only). If I run Powershell ISE in Unity it's even worse. Current Mac is a 2017 13" with a dual core i7 and 16GB of RAM. Don't get me wrong the machine overall is not slow, just certain animations are as is the VM (2 vCPU/4GB RAM).

Actually I've just noticed RAM usage is north of 14GB.

 

[MacRS4]

I find the performance of Fusion compared to Parallels somewhat lacking, even more so with Fusion 11. Initial releases of it were a mess.

Now, I wouldn't say I see an awful lot of performance difference between my i7 2017 16Gb unit, and my i9 32Gb unit running 1 or 2 VMs tbh. What I do get from the i9 is that I can run my entire demo suit of 7/8 VMs...and I couldn't do that on the i7. So it scales OUT better.

 

[ChrisD.]

I get Fusion for free so I don't really want to pay for Parallels, plus it integrates nicely into my VMware homelab. Is your i7 a 2 core or 4 core? I'm hovering between 40-60% CPU usage.