The Rangers Saga and Fallout Thread

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lordfletch said:
theres also the police investigation into whytes conduct at rangers,if whytes found guilty of fraud ,then this changes everything.( im aware of the time scale and how complex fraud trials are) maybe the spl should wait until it knows the outcome of the police investigation ?
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No. The Whyte issue is only the tip of the iceberg. Glasgow Rangers were sold to him for £1 for a reason.

Whyte is, in many ways, not that important as daft as that may seem!
 
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No. The Whyte issue is only the tip of the iceberg. Glasgow Rangers were sold to him for £1 for a reason.

Whyte is, in many ways, not that important as daft as that may seem!
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you do realise if hes found guilty of fraud this does change everything, that the sanctions which rangers face now have nothing to do with any murray run ebt tax scheme?
 
Thing is the fans are complaining about Rangers getting into any division next year. They thought Rangers would be wiped out but we are not and that's upsetting quite a few fans.

They touted 3rd Div thinking it would upset us. It doesn't :p.

No some fans are posting in FB and other outlets that they want a 1 year league suspension.

Us the people who lost our team have asked for nothing and have accepted with humility to be pumped into div 3.

Now the chairman listening to their fans baying for blood are stuck in a difficult position. Ger's fans will now be getting the blame for this as well.

Personally I don't think the loss of cash will be anywhere near as bad as all that. I'm sure that some of the smaller div 3 teams can opt to play their home games in bigger stadiums, some cup gates have allowed teams to survive for 5 years on that one game alone.

The div 3 solution would be great for scottish football.
 
The thing is this isn't a punishment. A new club is setup and any new club should be measured equally for SFA membership. If this was another team there is no way anyone would seek a biased resolve.

The media and Rangers fans need to stop touting its a punishment. Even getting into Division 3 is a favour to Sevco whatever as there are no three years of accounts.

Certain people in the game seriously need to resign with dignity. The media laughed and criticised lesser developed countries for widescale football corruption but ours is just as messy.

I hope UEFA say something about the state of our game.
 
jas72 said:
Us the people who lost our team have asked for nothing and have accepted with humility to be pumped into div 3.
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No you haven't. You seems fairly reasoned but in the media it has been the opposite. Look at the likes of Sandy Jardine and the threats and insults being thrown around at the rest of Scottish Football as Rangers fans look for people to blame.

I genuinely feel sorry for the proper fans of Rangers who have had the rug ripped from under them but as each one in turn talks about the death of Scottish Football if Rangers are not allowed back and the way McCoist has behaved in the media, my sympathy wanes.

Look at Ally - "I'm disappointed in the players leaving, they owe the fans to be honest" - really Ally? Did Sir David Murray not owe the fans honesty when he was ****ing the club away? Did Craig Whyte not owe the fans honesty when he bought the club despite having less ready cash than I have? Did every single recipient of an EBT not owe the fans some honesty when they knew they were receiving their wages in the most dodgy possible fashion short of a brown envelope? How about every single creditor including the guy who made Davie Weirs farewell trophy and the newsagent who supplied Rangers with papers, do they not deserve some honesty about where their invoices have gone???
 
rafster said:
The thing is this isn't a punishment. A new club is setup and any new club should be measured equally for SFA membership. If this was another team there is no way anyone would seek a biased resolve.

The media and Rangers fans need to stop touting its a punishment. Even getting into Division 3 is a favour to Sevco whatever as there are no three years of accounts.

Certain people in the game seriously need to resign with dignity. The media laughed and criticised lesser developed countries for widescale football corruption but ours is just as messy.

I hope UEFA say something about the state of our game.
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It would appear that the SPL and their clubs see it as s punishment for them now looking at the rushed out plans for div 1. Let us go to div 3 if it punishes you so be it at least your fans will be happy wont they???

As for part 2 SFL have already said accounts are not required its at their discretion.
 
McMav said:
It would appear that the SPL and their clubs see it as s punishment for them now looking at the rushed out plans for div 1. Let us go to div 3 if it punishes you so be it at least your fans will be happy wont they???
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Yes, at least justice will be done. This should NEVER be about the impact on Scottish Football it should be about what is the the right punishment.
 
lordfletch said:
ogilvie is anything but a fool ,whats this corruption you accuse cambell ogilvie of ? (im sure his lawyers would like to know the answer to this as well ;))
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You don't know that he was on the Rangers board during the height of the EBT usage and even benefitted from it himself for like £100k?
 
McMav said:
It would appear that the SPL and their clubs see it as s punishment for them now looking at the rushed out plans for div 1. Let us go to div 3 if it punishes you so be it at least your fans will be happy wont they???

As for part 2 SFL have already said accounts are not required its at their discretion.
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Rangers in the 3rd should be the right "punishment" since it's a newco, the board members (it seems SPL, SFL and SFA) who came up with this idea are just trying to save the SPL finances since their original plan has been screwed up by liquidation.

However, given that it's likely to fail and the latest is they can't even decide what vote Ranger's need, it makes their position even more untenable.

Hopefully most of this sorted by the end of the week so we can get on with the Rangers application to the 3rd division and start free from oldco punishment.
 
Moza said:
You don't know that he was on the Rangers board during the height of the EBT usage and even benefitted from it himself for like £100k?
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rafster said:
The thing is this isn't a punishment. A new club is setup and any new club should be measured equally for SFA membership. If this was another team there is no way anyone would seek a biased resolve.

The media and Rangers fans need to stop touting its a punishment. Even getting into Division 3 is a favour to Sevco whatever as there are no three years of accounts.

Certain people in the game seriously need to resign with dignity. The media laughed and criticised lesser developed countries for widescale football corruption but ours is just as messy.

I hope UEFA say something about the state of our game.
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UEFA lecturing us on "sporting integrity" now,pot calling the kettle black ?

You don't know that he was on the Rangers board during the height of the EBT usage and even benefitted from it himself for like £100k?
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yes i know and i must have missed the bit about him doing anything illegal , care to give a link where it says cambell ogilvie broke the law ?


Ron Scott – The Voice of Experience – Sunday Post - July1 2012

"The way the Scottish football authorities have allowed the Rangers scenario to unravel is nothing short of disgraceful.

The whole sorry episode should have been nipped in the bud.

Instead we're now in the situation where it's not just the survival ofRanges that's at stake, but the Scottish game itself.

As the fans and clubs become hysterical about how the Light Blues should be punished, it's worth remembering the Ibrox club has done nothing unlawful.

Employment Benefit Trusts are legal. That's why HMRC wants to close this particular loophole.
Informed sources suggest, at worst, Rangers will receive fine, and there appears no danger of having to pay back-tax on the system Sir David Murray implemented.

The SFA then decided to impose severe sanctions on Rangers after awakening to the fact that Craig Whyte was not a fit and proper person to own the club.
Yet the independent Ibrox board set up to look into Whyte while he was still negotiating with Murray decided themselves that [he] wasn't fit and proper to own the club.
They told the SFA that at least fifteen months ago,but the powers-that-be decided in their wisdom to take no action at that time.
Now the situation is like a runaway train full of explosives that's about to be derailed and blow up the whole of Scottish football.
Let's face the obvious here. Not even Celtc will be able to sustain their present level for long without Rangers.
So if they end up having to make cuts, how is the rest of Scottish football going to survive?
There are already whispers that other SPL clubs will be forced into administration.
There is even talk of part-time football at the highest level, never mind the First Division.
It's all very well to bleat on about sporting integrity. But why risk the entire future of Scottish football especially when the facts clearly show Rangers have done nothing wrong.
At the end of the day, the main villan of the piece remains Whyte, with Murray a close second.
It's totally wrong to run the risk of losing Rangers altogether and sending down the entire game with them.
It is especially wrong when the facts show there is absolutely no need for the authoeities to treat Rangers the way they appear hell-bent on doing."
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While EBT's are legal it's how they were used that is under investigation. HMRC believe they have enough proof that EBT's were set up as part of a salary package and as such tax & NI would be due on them. Even if they were a trust fund upon which funds were loaned out this is a benefit in kind and should have been declared and once again tax would have been due on that.

I don't understand what he means about there is no need for the authorities to treat Rangers the way they are, as it seems they are bending every rule they can to get them back into the league.

A very puzzling article to say the least.
 
Moza said:
You don't see any conflict of interest here?! :eek:
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if im honest i dont understand why your post wasnt removed,a mod posts right below you so its obviously been seen,the accusation you made here is quite heavy duty and if theres evidence of campbell ogilvies (alleged) corruption then i would also like to see it.
 
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