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The thread which sometimes talks about RDNA2

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They are making cards which are better than the last cards yes. The point is the "MSRP" is dishonest if it is only used for a small batch of cards to claim value points in reviews.

It's like a wonky version of planned sales where items are clearly available on a shelf long enough at "overprice" so that a company can claim "75% off" next week.

In this case it would be reference cards being loss leaders sold at "underprice" so reviews can write it down then next week manufacturers are allowed to sell cards at "realistic price".

Actually there is a term for that which could fit.

Lets yoink a snippet from an encyclopedia page... on bait and switch



Funnily enough...



But this isn't the United States and that scenario is illegal here yet it matches so that's curious.

So Turing was overpriced for its entire life cycle to make ~$750--$800 cards look good?

My guess is that Nvidia was either unable to innovate in a manner that allowed Turing to be reasonably priced and profitable or, they just scalped their own cards and thought people would buy it if they said "ray tracing" enough. With no competition at the high end, we consumers could only take it or leave it.

Now there's competition and this generation is faster, dollar for dollar.

Even leaving out Turing, the price performance trajectory is back in line this generation. And while "back in line" is a far cry from a bargain, it's not some huge rip off.
 
Soldato
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Not a single word you said the first time or the second time was actually about what I wrote.

I humoured it the first time but you're still writing randomly about competition.

Just don't quote me if you want to randomly talk about something else.
 
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After all the grief OCUK got regarding the Nvidia 30x0 launch, queues, holding money for goods they don't have, etc, is it any wonder they are not going to do that again?

It's also possible the initial batch of AMD card are small, and it's all going to be AIB cards in a few weeks. AMD looking after their partners, while Nvidia has never been shy about throwing theirs under the bus.

I mean literally every other store in the world will charge you when shipping said item so OCUK could you know actually move to a non ridiculous method of taking preorders, but they could have e-mailed what was pretty much say 1000 people and say you were XXX in the list of orders that failed, if you reply you'll be placed in that order (minus any non replies) and get first crack at the new cards in a week from now. Number of people who would be upset by that 2 maybe and they can just not reply or reply and say do a refund.

It's also worth noting that OCUK have gotten **** for taking money early for preorders for like the past decade and they still did it for the Nvidia cards so why not the AMD ones. In the Nvidia case they had no clue when stuff was coming in while they are actively saying they have cards of every brand available to order in a week. If there were more reference cards coming I can't see why now after multiple launches that people got angry over taking money early this would be the time to stop.
 
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Infinity cache is scaled for a 4K resolution, as optimal balance, but what that means is that it's more than optimal at lower resolutions so it will perform better because it's overspec'ed for those, and of course high frequency is great exactly in less shaders heavy scenarios like lower res. Combined with the fact that Ampere is compute-heavy and draws a lot of its power from the numerous shader cores (which are very difficult to properly utilise outside of 1 scenario where it happens automatically - increasing resolution) & higher memory bandwidth which itself also faces a threshold problem - meaning that once you have enough of it it doesn't do much just having more or at least runs into severe diminishing returns, it means that Ampere will shine at exactly 4K (and above) and heavy ray-tracing, and RDNA 2 will shine at 1440p & 1080p.


They're not, that's the point. I'm not talking about the guy with bots or 50 tabs open spending 4-5 hrs a day trying to snag an FE, I'm talking about a normal buying setup. Maybe in 6 months they will be near the same price, but right now it's a 'get whatever is in stock and near MSRP' situation, and even today on launch day the AMD cards have clearly had a better showing throughout the world than Ampere. I looked around and I saw 3080s go for way over MSRP on launch day, and continuing to right now (in many countries). Meanwhile the AMD cards were still over MSRP but by a lot less. That's very, very important.

Thanks for that post.
 
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So.

Smart Access Memory.

Nvidia quickly ran into a lab to see if it's technically possible for them then next messaged every tech site to spread the news that it's just resizeable BAR and they can totally enable it too.

Here's Herkleman answering questions on SAM and competitors:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaxnvRUeqkg&feature=youtu.be&t=2088

AMD won't be blocking Nvidia or Intel from giving it a go, possibly even being supportive however it "requires more than just flipping a toggle in the bios" and "more than just a driver update" to get performance gains out of it.

Which I suppose may be an indirect answer to why SAM isn't available on every AMD product, it would require extra work x every different batch of components.
 
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Lets not forget how much better the efficency of RX 6000 series is when compared to Ampere.When paired with an AMD cpu/motherboard using SAM.



This certainly encourages an AMD PC Ecosystem.
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Now imagine this for a minute. RX 6800 xt providing that level of performance with the efficiency that far exceeds Ampere. Wasn't AMD always called out for being a power hog back in the day?
Wow!!! What a turn of events this turned out to be. Now only do you get the performance but you do so without new power connectors, updated PSUs nor having to buy special "mini connector" cables.

Now, lets not get it twisted, when you want to OC a RX 6800xt to 2500Mhz (for example) the power requirements will get higher. However, based on the results from HU posted earlier it's only going to beat out a 3080ti when it's released IMO. AMD is looking to sack "GPU King of the Hill". Even if it doesn't out right beat Ampere on all fronts. That's pretty amazing stuff.

All of this at just 256 bit bus width vs a 384 bit bus width!!! It's far more efficient then I expected. Which

NVIDIA cards are also getting SAM and unlike AMD, this won’t be locked to their platform and will work on both Intel and AMD so expect to see NVIDIA cards keep up on this metric too in future.

The power consumption seems almost the same to me on both cards.30 watts less power than 3080 but it also performs slightly slower as well.
 

TNA

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Catching up with this thread. Here we go!


The gn reviews offer a face you would never tire of slapping. :p
Lol. You love slapping/punching faces don't you Gerard? :p


His reviews are terrible recently and a sellout. Go check other reviews. He sees AMD have 1 % lead and sits there going over it many times in a positive manner but NVIDIA beat it by 20%+ he goes well AMD is fast enough at that resolution and don't need more frames than that. He's really full of it recently and look at his body language at the end, liar liar pants on fire behaviour. Sellouts like many of the reviewers on youtube.

AMD did good and happy to see they are back but sorry 3080 vs 6800xt , 3080 is still better value.

Also HU are clearly siding with manufacturers that are sponsoring them or back hand payments or free hardware. Many more are doing this now, Even digital foundry are not the same , total Nvidia shills now and Intel shills. I'm not sticking up for AMD or Nvidia here they are both as bad as each other.

BUT youtube reviewers are disgusting these days with their shilling and twisting facts or adding negatives when their results clearly show it's better.
I don’t know, I like his reviews, never found him too bias. I mean everyone has a bit of bias, but I think he is the least of the ones I know.

For sure for me the 3080 is the better card as I game at 4K, have two g-sync panels and all three of my most anticipated games have RT/DLSS. But kudos to AMD, they really delivered.

Did any games come with the 6800 XT? Godfall?


No matter what side you want, red or green, the fact AMD have a card that competes with Nvidia after all these years, is a good thing for pushing each other. Happy to stick to AMD as I've Freesync but if this pushes Nvidia then AMD will have to work hard again to compete...that's good for all of us :)

+1


Yep, somewhere in the middle here but the inefficient 8nm process is there for all to see.
PRnIBPF.png
I got my 3080 running at around 250-260w by undervolting it. It has much more stable clocks like this and matches stock performance in benchmarks I have run. But I am sure one will be able to do something similar with the 6800XT if they did well with silicon lottery :)


Are you going to replay a game because it has RT? Are you going to buy a game you skipped because of RT? Do you think devs are going to take away resources from future games to assign it to an old game that has no future monetary value to the company? And implement it in a way that is better than turning it off?

It is not an easy "tack on" you need to go through and check how all the shaders look and respond to this new system, as well as debugging and performance testing the entire game.
I wouldn’t. So far everything I have tried with RT has either been ok, or meh. But then I felt that way about the actual games themselves so can’t really polish a turd with RT :p

Not tried metro yet, may consider it if I can get it under a tenner on sale.

For me RT is about upcoming games like Cyberpunk, Dying Light 2, Vampire Masquerade 2 and Atomic Heart.


If you're on 4K yes the 3080 is the better card
I am, thanks :D;)


10GB is not a problem on the 3080 there is a whole thread for that wing nut argument. Not one game max's out 10GB. Not even Godfall.
Indeed. Soon when we get Cyberpunk out running fine with 10gb also, we can put this argument to bed. By the time it becomes a big issue I will be rocking a next gen card.


For me lack of Ray Tracing performance and DLSS is more of a worry going forward than a 10GB VRAM limit. Especially up to the next 24months. RT will become massively popular, starting with Cyberpunk next month, only a couple of games will need more than 10GB in the foreseeable and this will be cured by dropping a level on one setting, turning off RT in some title's will loose way more visual quality.

Agreed.


I think we have to give AMD credit for what they have achieved but remember this isn't no AMD vs Intel situation and the cards perform about even with AMD winning in some titles and nvidia winning in others, you also have to remember that AMDs feature set is weaker than nvidia and prices are not much difference.

Had AMD come in a $499 for the 6800 and $599 for the 6800XT then it would have definetly shook things up more but as it stands they offer similar performance to nvidia for similar prices.
Yeah. I give AMD a lot of credit for what they achieved with RDNA2. They are back in the game.

Had they hit those price points it would have been received a lot better yes.


Did you factor in the cost of the air conditioning unit you will need to keep yourself cool.
Lol. It ain’t that bad man :p

Plus a nice undervolt if you have decent silicon gets you to 250-260w anyway for stock performance. That’s my experience so far anyway. Plus that is only on the latest demanding games. Many others I have tried hover in the 100-160w region because of my gsync 60fps cap :D


AMD CPU with any GPU tbh :p
Yeah. If I had to pick between the two I would go AMD route also. I won’t be touching an Intel CPU until they fix all their security issues and offer a big leap in performance like they did back in the day with their core2 duo lineup.
 

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Yeah. So many AMD boys laughed at Nvidia and now the same happened to AMD :p

In some cases its actually worse than Nvidia. For my local store and I quote "its way way worse than the stock we had come in for Ampere".

Saw on r/AMD from someone in queue at Microcenter in St Louis: "We had about a 100 people queue up all for nothing, the store had 2 cards in total in stock"



rn2meubxc0061.png
 
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Yeah. So many AMD boys laughed at Nvidia and now the same happened to AMD :p

AMD want to provide stock in the next weeks/months while NVIDIA cupboards are completely bare, I believe that’s why we haven’t seen big stocks at launch.

The reason you can now buy a 3090 is that nobody in going pay £1700 for a card that the 6900XT is going to destroy in terms of price/performance in the next few weeks.
 

TNA

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AMD want to provide stock in the next weeks/months while NVIDIA cupboards are completely bare, I believe that’s why we haven’t seen big stocks at launch.

The reason you can now buy a 3090 is that nobody in going pay £1700 for a card that the 6900XT is going to destroy in terms of price/performance in the next few weeks.
Nobody? I can think of at least one individual :p

There are actually a lot more people buying a 3090 than I expected. Kudos to Jensen’s marketing team. They managed to create so much desire in this space that people you would never think would buy such a card are paying more than double the price of a 3080 for 15% extra performance :p:D
 
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The fact there is seems to be stock of the 3090 from multiple sources indicates to me that demand isn’t that high for a card that was launched just a few weeks ago ;) :)

Not too much desire there! Obviously NVIDIA is reinventing the concept of supply/demand, where having unsold stock show just how good their product is, impressive
 
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TNA

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The fact there is seems to be stock of the 3090 from multiple sources indicates to me that demand isn’t that high for a card that was launched just a few weeks ago ;) :)

Not too much desire there!
Way to miss the point. Spin in whichever way you like. There are loads of people with £1400 plus GPU’s on here.

It is all relative. You can’t expect a £1400+ GPU to sell as much as one that costs half as much. The point is Nvidia have got many happy to part with so much cash and offer a measly 15% extra performance over a 3080 in return. That proves my point about desire right there.

Oh and the card launched 24 September, that is more than a few weeks.
 
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Indeed. Soon when we get Cyberpunk out running fine with 10gb also, we can put this argument to bed. By the time it becomes a big issue I will be rocking a next gen card.
It never fails to surprise me how we can have 100+ pages of discussion and one side is comepletly clueless on the other sides position.
 
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Way to miss the point. Spin in whichever way you like. There are loads of people with £1400 plus GPU’s on here.

It is all relative. You can’t expect a £1400+ GPU to sell as much as one that costs half as much. The point is Nvidia have got many happy to part with so much cash and offer a measly 15% extra performance over a 3080 in return.

Oh and the card launched 24 September, that is more than a few weeks.

It’s not spin it’s reality, I don’t know where you’re getting £1400 from I can find anybody offering a 3090 for that price.

I was just pointing out that for a card with so much apparent desire/demand there seems to be plenty of stock, especially when that card was only released several weeks ago!
 

TNA

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It’s not spin it’s reality, I don’t know where you’re getting £1400 from I can find anybody offering a 3090 for that price.
Loads of people bought the FE yesterday and loads again a few days before that. It is not hard to do. Just set up an alert on telegram or discord. They pop up nearly every week.

Again way to miss my point. Geez.
 

TNA

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It never fails to surprise me how we can have 100+ pages of discussion and one side is comepletly clueless on the other sides position.
Yeah. Because of bias. People project and not read what is written.

Like I say 10gb is enough for me until next gen cards come out. Some read that and understand that I am saying 10gb is enough for everyone and will be enough forever. Lol.
 
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