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Triple-lock on pensions will stay. Pensions will increase when earnings have decreased

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by HACO, 24 Sep 2020.

  1. RandomMonkeH

    Gangster

    Joined: 18 Oct 2019

    Posts: 340

    Location: U.K.

    Remember when there was absolutely going to be an 18% hike in pensions due to the triple lock and nothing could be done to stop it?


    Pepperidge farm remembers.
    2.5% second year running. Told ya so.;)
     
  2. LeMson

    Mobster

    Joined: 21 Mar 2012

    Posts: 4,153

    lying tories lulz
     
  3. Tefal

    Capo Crimine

    Joined: 30 Jun 2007

    Posts: 68,537

    Location: Wales

    Now it's time to watch the labour voters who were against the lock suddenly be in favour of it
     
  4. Tefal

    Capo Crimine

    Joined: 30 Jun 2007

    Posts: 68,537

    Location: Wales


    Well then they'll be the pensioner vote
     
  5. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: 20 Jan 2005

    Posts: 42,070

    Location: Co Durham

    My point was they could have dropped it last year rather than absolutely state it was staying and wouldnt be dropped and even passed it through the HoC. We all knew that it would never stand that kind of increase this year so why even try to lie to us?

    But it was well and truly buried under yesterdays announcement. A commentator said today the remocal of the pension lock would have been headline news in every paper and today itsjust a small footnote :)
     
  6. KNiVES

    Capodecina

    Joined: 4 Jan 2005

    Posts: 14,871

    I have no party affiliation but I am sad the triple lock isn't in place this year. I worry about my elderly mum all the time and I would have loved her getting an 8% bump to her pension.
     
  7. R.P.L

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 20 Mar 2012

    Posts: 2,122

    Location: London(ish)

    Politics 101.
     
  8. Hagar

    Capodecina

    Joined: 1 Mar 2010

    Posts: 11,342

    Location: 5 degrees starboard

    Yes, that 8% compounded over a decade or two could have made the pension much more interesting for the following generations
     
  9. 413x

    Capodecina

    Joined: 13 Jan 2010

    Posts: 23,760

    Location: Llaneirwg

    Have also this mindset.
    You can see it coming. Unless there's something significantly new (like literal robot slaves, or we can do away with capitalism) we are on the decline.

    You can't milk much more out of the next generations. While leaving the mega rich untouched. Pension and NHS will soon be unaffordable.

    We are in negative feedback loop territory now. Take more from young now, they we have less when we are older. Rinse and repeat.

    More and more people are going to be renting when they are pension age. In this case the welfare bill will be unaffordable.
    So no pension.

    But I guess by that point people will have voted for a non tory party. But still, where will the money come from?

    Only way I can see things going is a big big house price correction. As its the cost of living thats devastating. If a tiny percentage of people own it will be wanted too. At that point all bets are off.
     
  10. chrcoluk

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 27 Feb 2015

    Posts: 8,646

    Building social homes over the long term will pay itself back, there is extraordinary amounts of money right now been funnelled to private landlords via LHA.

    That in term will give people more spending power who otherwise would have been private tenants, which gives a bit of headroom, otherwise its a combination of borrowing and tax increases.
     
  11. FoxEye

    Caporegime

    Joined: 17 Feb 2006

    Posts: 28,819

    Location: Cornwall

    A number of factions in the Tory party want the pension age to rise to 75 within the next 15 years. (It should surprise no-one that IDS is all for it. Having killed many disabled people already, he now seeks to spread misery elsewhere.)

    We'll go back to work till you die for many people.

    One thing is certain, society is going to change, and probably quite radically, in the not-so-distant future. I think we're going to see a lot more extremes. Even more extreme wealth for the top 1%, and a descent into extreme poverty for the bottom 50%.

    The idea that some still cling to - that life is improving top-to-bottom - that myth will be blown wide open before too long. What is unknown is if the people will be able to rise up against it. Or if those at the top have such complete control over literally everything - from the money you receive to the roof over your head to the food you eat - that nobody will be able to revolt anyhow. Subsistence is better than death?
     
  12. 413x

    Capodecina

    Joined: 13 Jan 2010

    Posts: 23,760

    Location: Llaneirwg

    Something will give.
    Once you start to get a majority near the poor line you'll see parties that want to rock the apple cart start to gain traction.

    At that point who knows.
    Imagine a house price crash/decline due to some extreme policy because most people don't own a house.
    Or a big tax hike on tech
    Or big tax hike on inheritance
    Etc

    Still think cost of homes/renting is the big issue. If that was brought under control we wouldn't be as bad.
    Even renting, if reduced wouldn't be so crippling. Imagine being able to do a lower paid job you love or stay at home with kids because rent/mortgage is 300 rather than 1000.

    Best thing for everyone would be a steady decline in prices/rent. But I doubt that can be engineered.
     
  13. chrcoluk

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 27 Feb 2015

    Posts: 8,646

    Rents can be engineered by building social homes but not overnight as it takes time to build homes.

    Housing market for buyers would likely also be affected as the BTL market would be affected and also less people will want to buy a house if they have social home security.
     
  14. HACO

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 6 Oct 2009

    Posts: 2,418

    This will lead to a collapse of society in western countries. There will be uprisings, and it will either end in extreme violence, millions dead, or in communist revolutions and some serious wealth confiscation.

    When historians in future centuries, assuming humanity survives, look back at the cause of collapse of society, it's all these small things that we did to give more to the old and destroy our future.
     
  15. FoxEye

    Caporegime

    Joined: 17 Feb 2006

    Posts: 28,819

    Location: Cornwall

    I don't even think there's a long-term plan. I get the distinct impression that each government only looks at the immediate future, about as far as the next election, and doesn't really worry too much about long-term trends or possible warning flags or - crucially - consider any policy that would help in the long term but be unpopular with the electorate/their base in the here and now.

    I just think we're going to muddle along with sticking plasters, not addressing the major issues, until the **** hits the fan, properly. It won't be because we couldn't see it coming, it will be because nobody had the political will to address the issue or do anything about it.
     
  16. HACO

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 6 Oct 2009

    Posts: 2,418

    Yeah, 100% correct. There is no plan. Each government wants to kick the can down the road for future governments to clean up, and they only care about the short-term. That's the greatest bug in western democracies, there are no long-term plans for anything. No government or party will accept short-term sacrifice for long-term prosperity. They will sacrifice long-term health and prosperity of the country (and the world), for a small bump in immediate popularity.
     
  17. 413x

    Capodecina

    Joined: 13 Jan 2010

    Posts: 23,760

    Location: Llaneirwg

    Yeah it's a flaw in democracy. You don't look into the future. I do find for people who have kids that this is a very odd mindset. But hey ho.

    I expect the tail end of my life will bear witness to some sort of big transition. For a while we can keep at this method and keep hoping technology will save things. It might.
     
  18. HACO

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 6 Oct 2009

    Posts: 2,418

    Second half of this century will be quite interesting. Will humanity come together and rise to the challenges? Or will we just keep going as we've been. Technology is great, but it can be used for good or bad. I'm just not optimistic at all. They'd rather develop/fund technologies that keep people occupied, or even kill people, than figure out ways to improve quality of life for all people and not just the rich and powerful.
     
  19. 413x

    Capodecina

    Joined: 13 Jan 2010

    Posts: 23,760

    Location: Llaneirwg

    Most likely it will continue down the greed path. As nature is naturally selfish. Its going to be interesting that's for sure.

    Environmental Disaster is just around the corner and it's not something you can throw a few trillion dollars at and fix in a year with a few lockdowns.

    I'd love to think we are progressing with more people caring about such things, but I just don't. Time will tell.

    Everything goes in boom/bust cycles. We are well. Overdue a bust.
     
  20. chrcoluk

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 27 Feb 2015

    Posts: 8,646

    I think many will agree with you on this regardless of political alignment.