Trivium - The Crusade`

Carzy said:
Basically you'll just have to come to terms with the fact that Trivium sound nothing like Saetia, The Kodan Armada, or any other screamo band. Woody has pretty much covered it though, as always, in a far more measured tone. He seems to have a lot more patience than me for repeating information over and over again to people that never seem to remember it :p
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Great Im glad we settled that pointless departure...

Anyways, my original point before all this carp got in the way was that:

nero120 said:
Since they have only released one record that defined their screaming vocal sound, veering away from this on their second release (to encourage more radio airplay) will alienate their fan base that has taken them so long to build, and does not guarantee more new listeners.
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note: I omitted the offending word so you guys don't get your knickers in a twist :p
 
nick_lerwill said:
sell outs!!! they stand for everything true metallers hate
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see, i like metal, i like it a lot.

but i hate metallers, they're usually so pretentious and arrogant when it comes to music. well the ones around here seem to be, tell them you listen to slayer and lamb of god and they'll be your best friends, tell them you also listen to limp bizkit (listening at the moment) and other stuff that "true metallers" shouldnt listen to and they'll think you're a total fag.
 
SidewinderINC said:
see, i like metal, i like it a lot.

but i hate metallers, they're usually so pretentious and arrogant when it comes to music. well the ones around here seem to be, tell them you listen to slayer and lamb of god and they'll be your best friends, tell them you also listen to limp bizkit (listening at the moment) and other stuff that "true metallers" shouldnt listen to and they'll think you're a total fag.
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Now you're thinking like an old metal head.

I've just bought 3 DVD's this morning -
The Wildhearts - Live At Scarborough Castle
Machine Head - Elegy
Johnny Cash - Live In Denmark 71

Can you ask nick_lerwill if I can like them or not please because I'd hate not to be hip?
 
SidewinderINC said:
see, i like metal, i like it a lot.

but i hate metallers, they're usually so pretentious and arrogant when it comes to music. well the ones around here seem to be, tell them you listen to slayer and lamb of god and they'll be your best friends, tell them you also listen to limp bizkit (listening at the moment) and other stuff that "true metallers" shouldnt listen to and they'll think you're a total fag.
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Same here. It also applies if you say you like any post-cliff burton era Metallica. With the possible exception of And Justice for All. Those guys can have a :rolleyes: from me.
 
RSH said:
huh? Trivium? Death Metal?.... what?
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Uh...I think you'll find that the entire metalcore genre is built on foundations of Death Metal. His screaming vocals are very death metal-esque. That's what I just said. Trivium are blatently not a death metal band....
 
Woody__ said:
Uh...I think you'll find that the entire metalcore genre is built on foundations of Death Metal. His screaming vocals are very death metal-esque. That's what I just said. Trivium are blatently not a death metal band....
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I'm sorry to say that you're wrong here.

The roots of death metal go back to American (especially Floridian) bands such as Morbid Angel, Death, Cynic, Atheist, Nile, Obituary, Deicide and others. It's extremely dark, extremely intense and, often, not particularly melodic in any kind of major key sense. Metalcore does NOT have its roots in this genre, instead it has its roots in the Scandinavian melodic death metal scene. Bands such as At the Gates, Soilwork, In Flames, Dark Tranquillity etc are the primary influences for a lot of metalcore bands, and that Swedish scene was influenced, to a large degree, by classic metal (e.g. Iron Maiden, Judas Priest) - and this is where metalcore gets its harmonies and catchy melodies from. The breakdown and vocal element of metalcore primarily comes from hardcore, which, vocally, is much higher and 'raspier' than death metal vocals, which tend to be more guttural and 'growly'.

I'd say Trivium certainly WERE more metalcore than anything else, but this latest album is a poor attempt at emulating their thrash metal forefathers.

-C
 
Woody__ said:
Uh...I think you'll find that the entire metalcore genre is built on foundations of Death Metal. His screaming vocals are very death metal-esque. That's what I just said. Trivium are blatently not a death metal band....
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Uh yourself...

Trivium are not metalcore and Matt Heafys vocals have never been anything like death metal vocals...

Caliban and Killswitch, thats metalcore, quite a sound differance to Trivium. (yes even the older stuff)
 
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Trivium Frontman Rejects 'Metalcore' Tag

According to naysayers, TRIVIUM is to METALLICA what GOOD CHARLOTTE is to the SEX PISTOLS. The Orlando-based thrash-metal quartet has faced its share of criticism since forming in 2000, despite high-profile gigs at Ozzfest, Sounds of the Underground, and Britain's Download Festival. Perhaps there's some envy due to its youth: the senior member, at age 24, is drummer Travis Smith.

"If we were acting like a bunch of 16-year-olds, I could understand it," says vocalist-guitarist Matt Heafy, reached aboard his tour bus in snowy Buffalo. "But we've got our **** together live and as people. Age is such a trivial thing."

The outspoken 20-year-old frontman also claims TRIVIUM should never have been accused of pandering to metalcore teenyboppers: "Metalcore is a combination of metal and hardcore, and we've never been into hardcore. We don't draw any influence from that scene. Even our second record, 'Ascendancy', was a metal record. Sure, it had screaming and heavy/soft parts. But only a small number of people would consider it metalcore."
 
Spirit7 said:
I'm sorry to say that you're wrong here.

The roots of death metal go back to American (especially Floridian) bands such as Morbid Angel, Death, Cynic, Atheist, Nile, Obituary, Deicide and others. It's extremely dark, extremely intense and, often, not particularly melodic in any kind of major key sense. Metalcore does NOT have its roots in this genre, instead it has its roots in the Scandinavian melodic death metal scene. Bands such as At the Gates, Soilwork, In Flames, Dark Tranquillity etc are the primary influences for a lot of metalcore bands, and that Swedish scene was influenced, to a large degree, by classic metal (e.g. Iron Maiden, Judas Priest) - and this is where metalcore gets its harmonies and catchy melodies from. The breakdown and vocal element of metalcore primarily comes from hardcore, which, vocally, is much higher and 'raspier' than death metal vocals, which tend to be more guttural and 'growly'.

I'd say Trivium certainly WERE more metalcore than anything else, but this latest album is a poor attempt at emulating their thrash metal forefathers.

-C
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Can I point your attention too:

Woody__ said:
I think there probably are people who dislike them because it's cool. Same as there are probably people who like them because it's cool.

Of course there are millions of bands playing the same kind of music, so much so in fact that the entire "scene" is oversaturated with bands of this nature. That would be, metalcore bands.

To answer you question, metalcore is basically taking the elements of Gothenburg style death metal bands (a la, At the Gates) and mixing it with hardcore elements such as Sick of it All, Madball, Black Flag etc, as well as bits of classic metal (duelling harmonised guitar parts, like Iron Maiden) and balls to the walls riffage of thrash etc. It now seems to becoming the trend (at least, in the circles various friends of mine move in) that a lot of metalcore bands that are outside of the mainstream, that they're more closer to death metal than hardcore. But you of course, get diffrent varitions. Each variation though, still has elements in common with another. Which is why it can be classed roughly under metalcore.

It's clear that Trivium are trying to get rid of this tag altogether by trying to eliminate the more "core" elements of their sound and just trying to play a more straight up version of metal. Like old school Thrash or whatever. Wither this it a concious decision, or due to label pressure or whatever, is irrelevent. They're essentially watering down their sound in order to breakaway from the movement that helped spawn them and give rise to their popularity.

I still detest them anyway. Just boring.

So yeah, Metalcore is another metal genre. Like thrash, like death, like black and so on.
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Said in this very thread :)

I just don't like using the term melodic death metal. It doesn't really sit right with me.
 
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RSH said:
Uh yourself...

Trivium are not metalcore and Matt Heafys vocals have never been anything like death metal vocals...

Caliban and Killswitch, thats metalcore, quite a sound differance to Trivium. (yes even the older stuff)
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I also draw your attention to my last post above. Metalcore is a huge genre. Bands like Terror are Hatebreed are considered metalcore along side bands like Throught the Eyes of the Dead, Job for a Cowboy and As Blood Runs Black. It's a massive term that applies to a multitude of bands that mix any style of metal with any kind of conventional hardcore.
 
riddlermarc said:
:eek: Burn the heathen! Justice had an AWESOME sound, play it loud and you can actually feel the guitar sound gnawing on your bones..
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Justice was a fantastic album imo. Haven't heard much trivium stuff, i've got ascendancy and it really is a brilliant album, but that anthem song is just.. I don't know how to describe it really, but it's bordering on cheesy mainstream crap!
 
Woody__ said:
Can I point your attention too:



Said in this very thread :)

I just don't like using the term melodic death metal. It doesn't really sit right with me.
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Ah yes, sorry, my bad!!

-C
 
Personally, I think all this bickering over stupid genre terms is pointless. I couldnt give a crap what specific "core" or whatever trivium fit into. To me, trivium are simply a metal band which was characterised by heafys screaming vocals. AFAIC, only scenesters need be worried about what kind of fasionable group they fit into se they can define themselves by its trends. Musicians couldnt give a rats ass what scene it belongs to.
 
Well ive bought it but not listened to it yet. Will have to be good to drag me away from A Matter Of Life And Death atm.
 
Woody__ said:
I also draw your attention to my last post above. Metalcore is a huge genre. Bands like Terror are Hatebreed are considered metalcore along side bands like Throught the Eyes of the Dead, Job for a Cowboy and As Blood Runs Black. It's a massive term that applies to a multitude of bands that mix any style of metal with any kind of conventional hardcore.
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FFS! Through The Eyes Of The Dead are deathcore!!!1111 :mad:



I joke... ok point taken, TTEOTD are top notch though.
 
Ive been listening to all 3 albums back to back and I take back anything bad I said about them. They are a seriously talented band....Im still not convinced by the new style of singing Heafy has adopted, but I am really loving The Crusade.

Out of all 3 I prefer Ascendancy. His singing style isnt as harsh as Ember to Inferno. Best song on that album has to be Declaration.
 
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