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UK Government Performance 2019-2024

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Dirk Diggler, Dec 13, 2019.

  1. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 35,510

    Location: Co Durham

    Simple economics though. Germany is in the EU and a market of £500million, we as of yesterday are legellay trading on WTO rules and tariffs come 1st january 2021

    London being the current eipcenter of finance will have nothing to do with Elon Musk's decision and clearly skills,culture and location didnt trump import/export costs and tariffs in his decision to go with the EU. In fact location was in the end the one thing that killed the whole deal.

    And I doubt he will lose enough sales from the few "patriotic" UK car buyers who are only going to buy cars fitted with UK batteries and hence not buy Tesla compared with the massive extra costs of us not being in the EU and customs and tariffs.
     
  2. thenewoc

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 9, 2012

    Posts: 5,925

    Location: West Sussex, England

    I said it's economic consequences of lock down, which it is, businesses have closed or are shrinking back / retrenching and thus don't require as many employees for an economy involving less sales. We can become more competitive with the freedoms to legislate independently from the EU however our government chooses providing they have a parliamentary majority for such legislation. In general I suspect it will involve reducing red tape to lessen the economic and productivity burden that causes, such as less red tape for planning permission, more state aid in certain areas. Maybe we'll introduce more tax on foreign businesses on what they sell here rather than those businesses choosing to offshore their profits. Personally I'd like to see a reversal of IR35 changes and promote entrepreneurship, I think we need a more dynamic workforce to get through this.
     
  3. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 35,510

    Location: Co Durham

    But after 1st January there is more red tape than there has ever been before for British business?

    And there definitely shouldnt be any reducing of "red tape" for planning permission after the recent scandals, state aid will be nice but highly unlikely to appear (or with any size to make any real difference) .

    Taxing foreign businesses on what they sell here is basically just tariffs. Good luck in starting a tariff war in an attempt to boost our economy. You must have stolen that idea from Trump?

    IR35 rules need to be toughened not slackened off so people get a free rid on tax.

    AGreed we will need a more dynamic workforce and personally I think billions should be pumped in the Job development schemes. Give every business £10k for every new employee they take on. Let business generate the jobs and the wealth.
     
  4. Murphy

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 4,387

    I know what you said, i read it, it's just I'm not entirely sure you understand what you wrote. If the consequences of lock down is businesses having to close or are shrinking back / retrenching and thus don't require as many employees for an economy involving less sales then you can't become more competitive with the freedoms to legislate independently. You can't do that because like you say the demand simply isn't there, you can't create demand where there isn't any, if people ain't buying your stuff because they can't you could be giving it away and it wouldn't matter because they simply can't get it.

    It's pretty simple, you can cut as much red tape as you like, reduce taxes, cut overheads, and do numerous other things to reduce the cost of doing business but none of that matters if you have fewer, or no one, there to buy what your selling.
     
  5. thenewoc

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 9, 2012

    Posts: 5,925

    Location: West Sussex, England

    You can have a more competitive set of taxation and less barriers to growth through less red tape than what would have been if remaining shackled to the EU and not having the former maneuverability that comes with being independent.
     
  6. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 35,510

    Location: Co Durham

    The problem there is the "red tape" you are referring to are the things like removing the right of employees to take employers to tribunals, removing the working time directive, removing the minimum wage etc. A few of the leading hard core brexiteers want this as obviously its very very good for business and profits. I don't think thats a good thing for the people who work in the UK.

    Even Dyson said he backed Brexit ebcause that meant (hopefully) that the UK would be able to return to having workers being able to be paid £5 per hour and have few rights, in which case he would happily shift his factories back to the uk.

    I dont really want the UK to become the sweatshop of Europe. I was hopign for better things tbh.
     
  7. thenewoc

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 9, 2012

    Posts: 5,925

    Location: West Sussex, England

    Then set up your own business and pay huge salaries, I'm sure you'll get plenty of applications but won't be in business for long.
     
  8. wesimmo

    Mobster

    Joined: Mar 19, 2012

    Posts: 4,289

    That's his point.
     
  9. sigma

    Suspended

    Joined: Nov 13, 2006

    Posts: 17,973

    lol
     
  10. Minusorange

    Soldato

    Joined: Nov 25, 2005

    Posts: 5,604

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-53246899

    It's a nice sentiment but where is he going to house up to 3million new migrants ? It's all well & good offering citizenship but not if we don't have the capacity to cope with such an influx in numbers ?
     
  11. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 35,510

    Location: Co Durham

    Whoosh. Right over you head. You really advocating that a benefit of brexit is for us to pay poverty wages and become a sweatshop cheap labour country we few employee rights when we used to be the 5th biggest economy in the world and a big player hitting well above our weight? Wow. You must really hate Britain.
     
  12. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 35,510

    Location: Co Durham

    Clearly he isnt going to build any social housing or do anything. The housing market will get a massive boom and there will be a killing to be made by buy to let landlords. There will not be any extra money put into more doctors, schools or hospitals. Pretty much what got the country into resenting immigrants in the first place.
     
  13. thenewoc

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 9, 2012

    Posts: 5,925

    Location: West Sussex, England

    If you think the grass is greener on the EU side why not move there?
     
  14. thenewoc

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 9, 2012

    Posts: 5,925

    Location: West Sussex, England

    Because growing the number of unskilled jobs is not the right way as it doesn't generate great tax receipts from masses of low paid workers. You don't need social housing to drive more doctors, schools or hospitals. All planning permission for new homes involves financial commitments from house builders towards the cost of infrastructure such as you mention.

    The 3M from HK is an obligation rather than an unrestricted open door with the EU.
     
  15. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 35,510

    Location: Co Durham

    I will if this country is allowed to become a **** hole like you and others want it to become then I will. But for now because I happen to love my country and care for people who live here, I am going to stay and try and stop it being destroyed thanks.

    If you want to trash this country I wish you would bugger off to Turkey or Vietnam or similar where you will get what you want.
     
  16. Murphy

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 4,387

    Sorry but can you quit the spin, saying we'll have more maneuverability is a meaningless soundbite if you're not going to explain what you mean, if you're not going to explain what it would allow us to do differently, etc, etc. You may as well be saying we'll be more bouncy, more pink, or more walky.

    Like i said though you can cut taxation, barriers, red tape, and all that until you're blue in the face but if the demand isn't there it will amount to nought, you're trying to address a demand side issue from the supply side, it's like cutting your prices by 50% when no one can get into the shop because you've locked the doors, or cutting your prices by 50% when half the town have lost their jobs or no longer live there.
     
  17. thenewoc

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 9, 2012

    Posts: 5,925

    Location: West Sussex, England

    I prefer the democracy we have here thanks and putting limits on our immigration numbers.
     
  18. thenewoc

    Soldato

    Joined: Mar 9, 2012

    Posts: 5,925

    Location: West Sussex, England

    We could do anything we've not agreed not to in any new trade deal agreement with the EU. It's pretty open ended at the moment if we're not being offered a suitable trade deal then we'll be free to legislate for pretty much any amount of divergence from the EU, companies will still be free to make stuff to EU standards as well as any other standards.
     
  19. Devilman

    Hitman

    Joined: Feb 9, 2004

    Posts: 586

    How does making items to multiple differing standards reduce red-tape and unnecessary expenditure? How will this make things better for UK businesses?
     
  20. sigma

    Suspended

    Joined: Nov 13, 2006

    Posts: 17,973

    We don’t need the worlds largest traffic bloc on our doorstep! We’re bigger than that!