Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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JordanLTU said:
Oh my god. These reports is exactly what I am talking about, just cancel everyone who says it from their own analysis. Same as them guys from Newsguard they just block and demonetize everyone who wouldn't go with narrative. Those guys do not call anyone names and stuff (Thanks for Russian troll and **** sucker epithets). All they do is taking news articles and other reports and produce the analysis. Alex Christoforou might be a bit harsher and more biased with words but Alexander Mercouris provides very good analysis and insights.
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So now that you've been shown that the integrity and reputation of these people is in the toilet, maybe you need to take another look at your 'awakening' you had since it's basically based on lies.
 
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woppy101 said:
You received insults because you‘re a Russian troll
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Sadly you will always get people who are sceptical of the "official" story just because it's the official story, just because he doesn't view Russia as unfavourably as most in this thread doesn't mean he's trolling (hence why I believe it's actually against forum rules to accuse him of such), there are plenty of other posters on this forum who "prefer to do my own research" with similarly skewed views on a variety of subjects :(


Thekwango said:
why even engage with these weird posters
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Because if everyone refused to engage with people who had different opinions/beliefs then the forum would turn into a Facebook style echo chamber, and that would suck.

I personally have no issue engaging with the pro-Russia posters because (A) over the course of this thread it has actually sometimes worked and (B) because I'm a firm believer that if your can't bare to have your own position questioned then that in itself is a question of your position, hence engagement.


CaptainRAVE said:
Should be easy pickings.
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Yeah it should be a slaughter.

The Challenger 2 was developed from the Challenger platform which was developed from the Chieftain platform which was developed from the Centurion platform, which ate T-55s for breakfast :D
 
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Harlequin said:
SO those French AMX or Leopard ones will pop a T55, the L7 was designed for them!
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The hotter 30/40mm rounds will do em from anything other than the thickest armour, from the way things have gone so far wouldn't even be surprised if they wouldn't fail to stand up to it frontal even - seen BTR-4s able to do critical damage to T-72s, etc. in some cases (I'm guessing no additional armour/reactive and sub-standard steel).
 
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ubersonic said:
Sadly you will always get people who are sceptical of the "official" story just because it's the official story, just because he doesn't view Russia as unfavourably as most in this thread doesn't mean he's trolling (hence why I believe it's actually against forum rules to accuse him of such), there are plenty of other posters on this forum who "prefer to do my own research" with similarly skewed views on a variety of subjects :(
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It's 100% trolling.
 
ubersonic said:
Sadly you will always get people who are sceptical of the "official" story just because it's the official story, just because he doesn't view Russia as unfavourably as most in this thread doesn't mean he's trolling (hence why I believe it's actually against forum rules to accuse him of such), there are plenty of other posters on this forum who "prefer to do my own research" with similarly skewed views on a variety of subjects :(
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You can just tell with some of these though they are trying to propagate opinions they don't even believe in themselves and don't have any basis in reality - not just questioning what might be propaganda, etc. or a viable, if controversial, alternative take on something but things which can't be remotely true like claiming the US is occupying a larger area of Syria than Russia is in Ukraine.
 
I can respect a more balanced opinion with some basis in reality, I think @Rroff provides this here pretty well, with sound reasoning and using facts rather than copium.

Charging into a thread and spewing disinformation is just trolling, and none of us should agree that it's OK to do it.
 
~Mike~ said:

This can't be true can it?
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I would wager it is, you have to remember that Russia gambled HARD in the opening days of the war and lost HARD. They've been failing for so long now many forget how Blitzkrieg-ish they started off and how many lucky breaks Ukraine caught.

IIRC they sent groups of Spetsnas in to capture airports to give them a landing zone so they could bring in equipment/troops fast and take Kiev, that succeeded but sadly (for them lol) Ukraine managed to shoot down the transports brining in their reinforcements so the equipment transports never took off, the troops holding the airports were then overrun and killed, the first week of the war that's was over 300 Spetsnas dead in just a couple of days.

Then you had the in fighting where for some reason known only to Putin there were Spetsnas forces under the command of Wagner, who were using them for standard infantry stuff so they didn't lose their own "super elite" troops :P
 
Yeah many of the elite airborne/airmobile and special forces brigades deployed to Ukraine took upwards of 70%, 90+% not uncommon, losses in the opening weeks of the war. I'd caution there though that they "only" deployed about 40% of the pre-war numbers - they haven't lost 90% of their entire special forces as some claim, though more have been committed since these units were reorganised and sent into the south around Kherson and Bakhmut, etc.

A bunch of them apparently took a beating about 10 miles south of Bakhmut over the last couple of days facing off against tanks. (EDIT: Though Russian sources claim it was just AFU reconnaissance and they destroyed them with artillery LOL).
 
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ubersonic said:
Sadly you will always get people who are sceptical of the "official" story just because it's the official story, just because he doesn't view Russia as unfavourably as most in this thread doesn't mean he's trolling (hence why I believe it's actually against forum rules to accuse him of such), there are plenty of other posters on this forum who "prefer to do my own research" with similarly skewed views on a variety of subjects :(



Because if everyone refused to engage with people who had different opinions/beliefs then the forum would turn into a Facebook style echo chamber, and that would suck.

I personally have no issue engaging with the pro-Russia posters because (A) over the course of this thread it has actually sometimes worked and (B) because I'm a firm believer that if your can't bare to have your own position questioned then that in itself is a question of your position, hence engagement.
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Are you for real with these statements? These posters aren't offering differing opinions, they don't have different beliefs. These are just mindless idiots, who are trolling or spreading propaganda/disinformation. They have no thought processes of their own. Their arguments have no basis in any kind of reality and are easily torn apart. But that doesn't matter to them, they just post another equally stupid and incoherent statement later on. And notice how they never really answer any question directly or offer any counter points when they are shown to be wrong.

People with genuinely differing opinions and beliefs, that's all good. It would be a dull forum if everyone was the same, but these aren't genuine posters. Can you not tell the difference?
 
melmac said:
Are you for real with these statements? These posters aren't offering differing opinions, they don't have different beliefs. These are just mindless idiots, who are trolling or spreading propaganda/disinformation. They have no thought processes of their own. Their arguments have no basis in any kind of reality and are easily torn apart. But that doesn't matter to them, they just post another equally stupid and incoherent statement later on. And notice how they never really answer any question directly or offer any counter points when they are shown to be wrong.

People with genuinely differing opinions and beliefs, that's all good. It would be a dull forum if everyone was the same, but these aren't genuine posters. Can you not tell the difference?
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We collectively picked apart all of that troll sity europas arguments and said why they were wrong, provided evidence etc.

As you said, they just moved onto some other balmy statement, or derailed the thread by bringing up other topics.

I'm also certain that debating anything with people like this is pointless.
 
dowie said:
You're giving way too much credit to the Russians there, I don't think their tactics have progressed beyond artillery bombardments and human wave attacks.
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My first thought was the corpses booby trapped with grenades, not the same scale but similar trap mentality in principle.

So yea, crimea river vatnik!
 
Minstadave said:
Brilliant tactic, will slow advance considerably and not be great for morale.
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And the best bit is you don't even have to do it that often.

All you have to do is wire up random buildings or even just a few rooms (keeping a note for your own future records), and the Russians have to treat every single room in every building as booby trapped, and either send in well trained teams to check them, or large numbers of untrained people to likely die - and that's going to be great for morale, and once the rumour mill spreads the message then the Russian officers are going to find it increasingly hard to push their soldiers into those buildings (and Friday frag night is increasingly likely).
This was an issue for the US and British in the likes of Iraq and Afghanistan from memory, but the buildings were typically much smaller, with very few large/high rises so relatively quick to clear once the professional and motivated troops involved where given training on how to spot the traps, and the supporting specialists were on hand.
 
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