Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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Soldato
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Utter rubbish by China.

Is it though?

I do wonder whether the US/UK/EU don't have some at least some part to play in all this. I do wonder if Putin/Russia had been treated with more respect and a more nuanced approach to Ukraine (in, but not quite, if you know what I mean) whether things would have escalated the way they have. I mean, if this was always going to happen irrespective of "Our" approach to Ukraine then fine. Just wonder if it could have been handled better.
 
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yea with no rescue footage... seems more like an empty building got hit or azov blew it up to try and force a ceasefire before they lose mariupol.
but I get nazi people would never lie.


do they control the internet? are people smuggling videos out by mail

want some whataboutism? what about fake videos from other wars
https://edition.cnn.com/2016/11/24/middleeast/mannequin-challenge-white-helmets-syria/index.html

Another Putin fan I see, they infest everywhere.
 
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This thread is great. We get to debate the correct was to say The Ukraine/Ukraine and which nicknames are acceptable for Putin :)


Situation normal for an internet forum then.... ;) A nuclear holocaust is currently a distinct possibility, but meanwhile we must be sure no one, not even one of the orchestrators of the situation, can claim offence for some linguistic triviality :)
 
Soldato
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Is it though?

I do wonder whether the US/UK/EU don't have some at least some part to play in all this. I do wonder if Putin/Russia had been treated with more respect and a more nuanced approach to Ukraine (in, but not quite, if you know what I mean) whether things would have escalated the way they have. I mean, if this was always going to happen irrespective of "Our" approach to Ukraine then fine. Just wonder if it could have been handled better.

Still doesnt give Puty the right to invade Ukraine.
 
Soldato
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Is it though?

I do wonder whether the US/UK/EU don't have some at least some part to play in all this. I do wonder if Putin/Russia had been treated with more respect and a more nuanced approach to Ukraine (in, but not quite, if you know what I mean) whether things would have escalated the way they have. I mean, if this was always going to happen irrespective of "Our" approach to Ukraine then fine. Just wonder if it could have been handled better.

No.. we've been far too soft on Putin up until this point.
 
Associate
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Is it though?

I do wonder whether the US/UK/EU don't have some at least some part to play in all this. I do wonder if Putin/Russia had been treated with more respect and a more nuanced approach to Ukraine (in, but not quite, if you know what I mean) whether things would have escalated the way they have. I mean, if this was always going to happen irrespective of "Our" approach to Ukraine then fine. Just wonder if it could have been handled better.


You should read, Winter is Coming by Garry Kasparov. It's quite sobering and no we couldn't have avoided this. Putin has been planning this for years. He can't fully integrate with Western values as he is running a dictatorship and has no option but to attack Ukraine and the West as its against everything he stands for.
 
Soldato
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I keep hearing analysts saying 'we caused this'. No, we didn't. You don't have to give in to the demands of bullies.

They absolute BS coming out of Russia, it's suppression of it's own people, the atrocities being committed are proof that we shouldn't have backed down. I'm not discounting that the west does things like 'WMD's' when there are none etc, in an attempt to justify things btw. The Russia level's are just absolutely off the charts.

Being one hundred percent clear here: Russian gov always had desire to take back Ukraine and other former territories and possibly others. It was never about NATO, that was just a convenient excuse.
 
Soldato
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Still doesnt give Puty the right to invade Ukraine.

No.. we've been far too soft on Putin up until this point.

Fair enough. Was just a theory. There are those that believe Putin was almost goaded into this. Or at least sidelined or overlooked as a "gangster" whilst the West set off on it's new path to see China as the new "enemy".

Putin felt like he and his country was having the mickey taken and decided to re-establish his authority.

I'm only trying to see things from as many angles as possible rather than sitting in an echo chamber.
 
Soldato
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Is it though?

I do wonder whether the US/UK/EU don't have some at least some part to play in all this. I do wonder if Putin/Russia had been treated with more respect and a more nuanced approach to Ukraine (in, but not quite, if you know what I mean) whether things would have escalated the way they have. I mean, if this was always going to happen irrespective of "Our" approach to Ukraine then fine. Just wonder if it could have been handled better.

Indeed. Quite straight talking. However to recognise Ukraine would also imply validation of Taiwan.

The question though is this - was NATO in Ukraine before the invasion? No. I thought Belarus was also a sovereign nation covered by the agreements. Putin's puppet some how deposed the elected leader and also there's Russian nuclear weapons against the NATO boundary.

Is the Ukraine a sovereign state separate from russia - yes. The flaw in the Russian negotiation back in the Cold War was it didn't state that the countries themselves could seek to join the EU or NATO. It only covered restrictive covenants for NATO inviting countries in.

Russia didn't like the idea that the Ukraine could provide the EU competitive gas. It goes against the NordStream political leverage, nor the loss of influence with puppets or sympathy.

The actions of Russia abandoning the agreement have left the other countries concerned and seeking closer ties/membership by themselves. The Russian actions have caused a reaction - perhaps that was intended by Putin to validate his plan to take back those states and validate a war against Finland for example.
 
Soldato
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It's a bit like squid game green light red light - where Putin's gaze falls you must be cheering.

Can't remember which Russian dictator it was but they had to install a bell in what I assume was the Duma at the time. As no one wanted to be the first person to stop clapping when The Boss entered they needed a bell for everyone present to stop clapping.
 
Caporegime
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Another Putin fan I see, they infest everywhere.
Building is bombed/shelled.
Apparently hundreds/thousands of people trapped inside.
Footage of building destroyed exists taking 1-2 days after the event.
No footage of any rescue operation, no bodies, no ambulances.
2 days later, told people still trapped/Rescue operation underway.

Sorry for not just blindingly believing it because someone said it on twitter.

of course Ukraine wouldn't want to show of the horrors of what happened like they did with every other atrocity committed by Russia.

Not believing it makes me a putin fan? oh your either with us or against us, your not allowed to have an opinion of whether something actually happened or not, you must believe.....

:rolleyes:
When did the truth stop mattering? when generation millennial?

Cut the phone lines to stem the flow of misinformation and independent thought quick...


and FYI I already said we should just have invaded Belarus and made it our Ukraine.... they don't like their leader and would have welcomed us, either that or we could have decided to occupy the other half of Ukraine so they still exist...

how that;s a putin fan boy? trying to silence people for having an opinion that doesn't match yours is just pathetic...

Whataboutism, gaslighting crap is just cancel culture for millennials to stop any debate.

it's not better than what dictators and communists do.... it's exactly what they do

blinded by emotions are we?
 
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Soldato
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I keep hearing analysts saying 'we caused this'. No, we didn't. You don't have to give in to the demands of bullies.

They absolute BS coming out of Russia, it's suppression of it's own people, the atrocities being committed are proof that we shouldn't have backed down. I'm not discounting that the west does things like 'WMD's' when there are none etc, in an attempt to justify things btw. The Russia level's are just absolutely off the charts.

Being one hundred percent clear here: Russian gov always had desire to take back Ukraine and other former territories and possibly others. It was never about NATO, that was just a convenient excuse.

Putin and his cronies just wanted to reset what Gorbachov started. Back to no questions and a iron curtain.
 
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