What should i expect part ex? or shall i sell?

[DM]

This is the point on which i will always stick to (within reason, i will happily pay for all justifiable diagnosis time, and i am lucky enough to have had very few run-ins).

What i will not pay for is for somebody to replace parts which were not needed. As you point out, it is of no concern of mine if they have wasted all morning replacing something which they have incorrectly diagnosed. Mistakes happen in business which i accept, but i expect the business to write them off as a loss, why should the motor industry be any different?

I do not think it unreasonable to expect correct diagnosis first time - they are selling themselves as experts. If they are in any way not sure then they should not tender for the work, either that or when they do blag it, and then get it wrong resulting in a loss to them, they need to accept that loss - just as every other type of business would.

I do not think that this is at all unreasonable, and tbh i am amazed anybody accepts it

Thats my view, im just not paying for **** ups, if you cant do a job properly dont do it, or certainly dont ask me to pay for it.

Im lucky iv got my garage of choice for each of my main makes of cars i buy, and none of this ever comes into our relationship.

These nightmare garages thrive on shy and retiring people caving in, well not me.

 

[Jez]

These nightmare garages thrive on shy and retiring people caving in, well not me.

This is exactly it. The tricky situations are intermittant faults for which you have already paid, or when its a local garage which you may well need again in the future for convinience.

 

[DM]

If you have cars that regularly need help it pays you to cultivate a decent local, like i do, an extra tenner drink on a bill and a bottle of scotch at christmas is money well spent.

 

[monkey_boy]

Intermittant faults are a very hard thing to deal with indeed, luckily i am yet to really have many. I had a similar issue on the mercedes with my headlamps blowing their bulbs though which could be related to others. Course of events went something like this:

1) I arrived at mercedes to look at the blown bulb - they replaced the bulb and did their usual "checks" & i paid the bill (fairly large - typically mercedes).
2) It blew again, i went back and explained what had happened, they replaced the bulb again, and after a short argument agreed that it should be FOC even though the "warranty" on work does not cover bulbs.
3) It blew again, this time i booked it back in, they diagnosed that the ballast was faulty. They obviously wanted payment for a replacement ballast, AND a new bulb. I disputed this, happy to pay for a replacement ballast but obviously for none of the labour for diagnosis, and i wanted all previous money deducted from the balance. They refused. I ended up writing to MBUK and agreeing it that way. End result was that i paid for the diagnoses on the last occasion, one bulb, and a replacement ballast - with all of the labour from previous occasions refunded - the point being that they should not have replaced the bulb without doing their diagnosis properly in the first place.

Odd one intermittant faults, and often very hard to deal with. And rather different to iain's examples above of a clear solid warning light fault. But the end result is the same, that being that you should not be paying for any work which was not necessary - especially parts.

Thanks, this and the following posts were really useful. I know it didn't deal with Iain's 'problem' directly but it does deal with one I expect to be having very shortly with my PDC playing up. It also matches with the OP as he said that it takes a few days for the light to return so he could be excused from believing that the problem had been resolved at the time he picked it up and it's how to deal with that aftermath that was interesting.

Out of interest Jez/Mark, as traders have you had to deal with any difficult warranty situations from the other side of the table? How do you play those? (be honest )

 

[DM]

Thanks, this and the following posts were really useful. I know it didn't deal with Iain's 'problem' directly but it does deal with one I expect to be having very shortly with my PDC playing up. It also matches with the OP as he said that it takes a few days for the light to return so he could be excused from believing that the problem had been resolved at the time he picked it up and it's how to deal with that aftermath that was interesting.

Out of interest Jez/Mark, as traders have you had to deal with any difficult warranty situations from the other side of the table? How do you play those? (be honest )

My car selling venture is on about 10th speed and not happening till Jan now. Thanks son

What we will do though is uphold our obligation to fix anything reasonable for 3 months then it will be between the customer and the warranty company if they decided to buy one.

 

[Jez]

Out of interest Jez/Mark, as traders have you had to deal with any difficult warranty situations from the other side of the table? How do you play those? (be honest )

I would imagine Mark is doing higher volume than me, i only do it as pocket money really around fulltime employment which is often longish hours in itself.

As such i have never had an issue, the car is inspected thoroughly before hand when sold and touch wood this has never come back to bite. I may have had the odd thing, i think i had an exhaust replaced once for someone after it started blowing immediately afterwards. TBH it comes back to the same thing as above, if i have ever needed anything doing its me who is the customer of the garage doing the work so the same principles would apply - i do not have much mechanical knowledge and certainly wouldnt attempt anything much beyond bulbs and bits to do with electronics myself. Almost all of my custom is WOM too, so i will always strive to keep everybody happy.

 

[iaind]

That is absolutely not how i would ever deal with a garage. If i delivered as per your example with an emissions warning light, if i returned to find the light still on, and a charge for "supply and fit DPF" then i would not even consider paying them for that job - the fault has not been rectified! I would be asking them why they have called me back to the garage without fixing my fault (and probably be rather angry that they had), would ask them if they are infact able to repair the fault and if the intend on doing so, and if not would remove my (still broken) car from their premesis.

These examples really come as a surprise, i cannot imagine the amount of time and money i would have wasted over the years dealing with garages as you seem to be saying you do! The only time i would EVER expect to see "replaced x" on an invoice (other than a breakdown of the work involved in fixing a fault) is for example earlier in the year where i supplied discs and pads to a garage, and specifically asked them to fit them for me.

I think you might be misunderstanding my point slightly.

You go to the garage with an emissions warning light on, they take a look and tell you it's probably the DPF and ask for your go ahead to replace it. The light goes away and you drive off happy, having paid. The fault comes back due to the intermittent nature.

Now, you're not paying for a **** up, Im sure its the case that with some of these things the only way to eliminate one thing as a cause is to replace it. The garage did it in good faith, the part they sold you is now no longer in returnable condition.

I'd want a good will gesture off the next step, but I think some consideration has to be given to the tricky intermittent faults. Your situation with the bulbs was similar but not quite. You had a dead bulb after they realised what the fault was. After the OPs garage found the fault with his, he's got a perfectly functioning brand mew DPF that will last for many miles yet and would have needed replacing anyway at some point.

I'm not justifying dodgy behaviour from garages, but I'm just explaining that it's not always going to be so clear cut and straight forward as "go and get your money back"

 

[DM]

I think you might be misunderstanding my point slightly.

You go to the garage with an emissions warning light on, they take a look and tell you it's probably the DPF and ask for your go ahead to replace it. The light goes away and you drive off happy, having paid. The fault comes back due to the intermittent nature.

Now, you're not paying for a **** up, Im sure its the case that with some of these things the only way to eliminate one thing as a cause is to replace it. The garage did it in good faith, the part they sold you is now no longer in returnable condition.

I'd want a good will gesture off the next step, but I think some consideration has to be given to the tricky intermittent faults. Your situation with the bulbs was similar but not quite. You had a dead bulb after they realised what the fault was. After the OPs garage found the fault with his, he's got a perfectly functioning brand mew DPF that will last for many miles yet and would have needed replacing anyway at some point.

I'm not justifying dodgy behaviour from garages, but I'm just explaining that it's not always going to be so clear cut and straight forward as "go and get your money back"

I wouldnt want my money back but i would want it knocking off the next job that does fix the issue.

 

[iaind]

I wouldnt want my money back but i would want it knocking off the next job that does fix the issue.

That's all I was getting at, the original suggestion that there would be a warranty on the DPF replacement that would cover the replcement sensor, when the garage wouldn't be under any legal obligation to do so.

Depending on how confident the garage originally was that the replacement would fix the fault, I'd try amd agree something like a parts/labour split

 

[DM]

That's all I was getting at, the original suggestion that there would be a warranty on the DPF replacement that would cover the replcement sensor, when the garage wouldn't be under any legal obligation to do so.

Depending on how confident the garage originally was that the replacement would fix the fault, I'd try amd agree something like a parts/labour split

Dont get me wrong im not a knocker of garage bills its just over the years i have become highly intolerant to people unable to do what they want to charge me for.