Why being an Engineer means nothing in this country

[DB_SamX]

An engineering degree usually lasts 4 years including the Masters year to achieve recognition from the body of Chartered Engineers, CEng. An engineering degree is very demanding and not many people get through to become a chartered engineer. It involves problem solving techniques, heavy mathematics and science principles, such as Physics (Mechanical & Aeronautical Engineering), Chemistry (Chemical Engineering) and Biology (Medical Engineering) amongst many other fields. In order to succeed you would need to understand concepts from first principles such as Newtons Laws of Motion and Fluid Viscosity. Bernoulli concepts and electrical laws such as Ohms and Faradays laws. How a capacitor works and how it can analogue real life situations. It also involves thorough research using the most accurate and precise instruments and skills that are not taught over night. Such as CAD programs (AutoCAD), programming software (MatLab), economic value engineering to determine the cost to usefulness ratio.
I’ve also missed a hell of a lot more but you get the message.

So that’s 4 years of hard learning, plus many more years of experience in the industry and you’re still learning some more.

Then a plumber/electrician/boiler man/car mechanic comes a long to your home to fix what ever needs fixing and calls him self an “engineer”.
When something goes wrong, these companies send out “engineers” to fix the problem.

It is now a case that engineers and these “call out helpers” are now categorised in the same league as non/semi-skilled.

Did those people go to university to get a degree? Did those people receive recognition (not that it even means anything any more)?

When was the last time a plumber/electrician/boiler man/car mechanic used the Euler Buckling Theory to design a bridge that will span the Severn River?

You are not the first to realise that, and unfortunately not the last. This issue has been plaguing most engineering institutions for years if not decades. Every other issue of The Structural Engineer has an article or letter about it and there has been petitions on that government website, which failed, the response being wishy washy at best. I think it will happen eventually but we have to be patient, providing support when our respectivie insitutions take steps to protect the term engineer.

 

[rypt]

I think it was Prince Charles that said something to the effect of changing titles of things was just done to make people feel more important than they really are.

 

[Sone]

i think we need a rant about graduates you think they know everything but have zero experiance in the real world.

Knowing theorys and throwing around big words means **** all. All the engineers i have met who i respect are guys who went back to uni after a few years of work and understand what they need to know.

 

[KaHn]

i think we need a rant about graduates you think they know everything but have zero experiance in the real world.

Knowing theorys and throwing around big words means **** all. All the engineers i have met who i respect are guys who went back to uni after a few years of work and understand what they need to know.

What do you work as?

KaHn

 

[Geek]

An engineering degree usually lasts 4 years including the Masters year to achieve recognition from the body of Chartered Engineers, CEng. An engineering degree is very demanding and not many people get through to become a chartered engineer.

And then once you have your degree you have to apply to an instutute who will tell you your course isn't accredited then you have to fill in loads of stuff to prove you are competent BEFORE you can consider applying to become chartered AND then its another 3-4 years at least before you can become chartered as well.

 

[DB_SamX]

And then once you have your degree you have to apply to an instutute who will tell you your course isn't accredited then you have to fill in loads of stuff to prove you are competent BEFORE you can consider applying to become chartered AND then its another 3-4 years at least before you can become chartered as well.

You'd have to be pretty stupid not to check whether your course is accredited with the institution you want or not before applying.

 

[V4NT0M]

The people who matter know the difference...

 

[Geek]

That aside i also find it funny that everyone calls themselves engineers. I enjoy hanging out the maintenance crew as they are easy going and can do things i can’t, but that does not make them engineers. I once had an argument where i was working that proved why i was an engineer and they where mechanics.

I'd like to say I'm an engineer, are you therefore impying I'm a stuck up **** because of my job title? I'm easy going; I don't brag about my job, if people ask I'll say engineer, if people then ask what type I'll tell them. One girl who worked with my friends when she who I worked for and I replied "a small engineering company in XX" she said "was I the secretary then" - I'm a girl therefore I can't be an engineer.

 

[Peter Diffey]

I employ 9 heating engineers, they had to go to college, and sit their tests before being officially labelled as such.

Wrong.

You employ 9 technical monkeys, Im betting most of the population could sit their courses and get what qualifications they have got

Engineering = design

If you dont contribute to design in anyway, then you are not an engineer.

Most people are extremely ignorant when it comes to the detail and difficulty of designing something like a car for example.

For a start, to do an engineering degree, you have to have good A-Levels in Maths and Physics, Joe blogs cant even get these qualifications.....

There was a government petition about this a while ago, the response was that it would not be worth the hassle.
No wonder no one wants to do maths and physics at A-Level to become an engineer, when the most common exposure to "engineers" is the greasy ***** who fixes your boiler.

 

[Geek]

You'd have to be pretty stupid not to check whether your course is accredited with the institution you want or not before applying.

My course wasn't accredited when I started it; it was the only course of it's kind in Europe so that is why I was STUPID and did it. However by the time I finished it was accredited by 4 institutes. Engineering was a second degree for me and because I am STUPID I did a different degree first one of which was not accredited by an engineering institute because it was in Physics. So yes even though my course was accredited I still had to fill all the paperwork in as a procedure as my first degree is in Physics. When they got all my info and paperwork I got a reply saying “you are accepted we don’t need anything you sent it’s a formality”.

 

[Cosimo]

It makes every Tom, Dick and Harry think they are something special when in reality it means nothing all. I wouldn’t worry about it too much.

 

[mjer1984]

I'd like to say I'm an engineer, are you therefore impying I'm a stuck up **** because of my job title? I'm easy going; I don't brag about my job, if people ask I'll say engineer, if people then ask what type I'll tell them. One girl who worked with my friends when she who I worked for and I replied "a small engineering company in XX" she said "was I the secretary then" - I'm a girl therefore I can't be an engineer.

No i am not implying that at all. People would assume girls are not engineers but that is not my problem, i have worked with some good ones.

What i am trying to say is that everyone using the same title is stupid, if you are a car mechanic then that should be your job title not engineering technician. As engineering in my opinion means you have a further understanding of the problem rather than just being able to fix it.

For example i can diagnose and fix problems on a gas turbine just like maintenance. I can then look further into the problem and minimize the chance of a repeat failure; maintenance crew would not do this. From my experience if they are ever asked they do a half-arsed job.

 

[DB_SamX]

My course wasn't accredited when I started it...

So you knew it wasn't accredited when you started it? That makes the difference between knowing it wasn't, yet doing it forseeing future accreditation (which I have no problem with) and not even knowing what future prospects your course offers within your industry of choice (which is a bit dumb).

When I did mine, it was accredited by 2 engineering ones (which I wanted at least) with potential for ARB exam exemption as well (which I wasn't fussed about at the time). In the end, we never got the ARB one, which I eventually came round to wanting, so I had to do all the paperwork stuff and sit an external exam, so I know about procedures you had to go through.


In general, when someone tells me they work in engineering, I usually get them talking about what level of engineer they are or aim to be (incorporated, chartered, etc) and what insitution they are a member of. That usually sorts them out.

 

[FeFiDoh]

 

[p4radox]

I used to care about this a lot, but now I just don't. There used to be a distinction between military engineers and civil engineers, and in modern terms the civil engineers would be the "real" ones. But Da Vinci was a military engineer and you couldn't exactly call him stupid.

As much as I'd like to re-label all the "fake" engineers as technicians, I know I'd just come off as a massive engineering snob. So I try not to let it worry me...

I'd probably say Mechanical Engineering is the true engineers.

What about all the other accredited courses you could do? Electrical, civil, chemical, information, software etc.

The people who matter know the difference...

Exactly.

Is Dr Dre a real doctor?

Yes.

 

[Stretch]

When was the last time a plumber/electrician/boiler man/car mechanic used the Euler Buckling Theory to design a bridge that will span the Severn River?

When what the last time you did?

 

[georges]

Chartered Engineer is a protected title. Only engineer isn't

You need more than just 4 years at uni to become chartered.

 

[Soviet]

Who cares about the title? it's what you do that counts not what your called!

 

[mjer1984]

Chartered Engineer is a protected title. Only engineer isn't

You need more than just 4 years at uni to become chartered.

I think you will find that if you tick all the boxes and can afford the fee, they will let you have the title. Although it may be difficult to tick the boxes now without a degree in engineering.

 

[scorza]

Chartered Engineer is a protected title. Only engineer isn't

You need more than just 4 years at uni to become chartered.

Yeah, but you won't become a Chartered Engineer with relevant experience fixing central heating systems.