Will 1080p always be for bigger tvs?
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Soldato
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The problem is that you would have to sit less than 3' away from the screen in order to tell it was 1080p and not 720p so, for most people, there is very little point in the added expense.
1080p isn't the holy grail that most people think it is.
Soldato
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wow didn't know that full hd is only available on the bigger screens. i was under the impression that full hd was more expensive at first but now has become cheaper to make so all lcd tv's released over a year are full hd but obviously not. wonder why.
Soldato
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There is no point.
In order to gell that a small screen is 1080p you've virtually have your face ressed up against the glass, so why bother. Form the viewing distance most people use 30" screens there is no difference between 1080p and 720p so just make them all in the cheaper 720p.
Of course someone will make a small 1080p screen and loads of people will rush out and buy it even though they are wasting their time.
[DOD]Asprilla;11135710 said:
Tell that to people who intend to use their TV as a PC monitor as well.
I sit about 6ft away from my TV when watching movies and so on, the difference between 720 and 1080P IS noticeable, but for a 30" you most probably have a good point, I'm using a 37.
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If you're going to use it as a pc screen too, then 1080P is the more desirable resolution, as with a PC, you WILL notice a difference, - a quite stark one at that.
But if your not gaming on the PC, and intend for DVDs and general TV (SD, or HD) then a 720p screen would be sufficient.
But if your not gaming on the PC, and intend for DVDs and general TV (SD, or HD) then a 720p screen would be sufficient.
Soldato
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when we were looking for a new TV we saw the difference that full HD was s HD ready, he couldn't see any smaller TV's with Full HD so we got a 52" Sony ([FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]KDL52X3500U[/FONT]), it was a good thing that we knew the owner of the shop (£1300 4tw)
Soldato
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That's fine, but that's niche usage, not the mass market therefore doesn't really make economical sense to produce them.
I was specifically referring to a 30" screen.
Of course there is a difference between 1080p and 720p, it's just that the distance you can resolve that difference at is a function of the size of the screen.
Hi,
I thought of sharing some of my findings with you all, which hopefully may help to decide whichever direction you want to go. Ofcourse, like most people, personal findings also have a certain amount of personal opinions attached to it but I will try to remain as unbaised and objective as possible.
There have been several questions in this post but most center around: is 1080P worth it and at what screen size min/max is it best/worthwhile at or will 720P look just about as good on min/max screen size.
The definition of 720P http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/720p
The definition of 1080P http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080p
Basically 1080P contains more pixels thus, you would assume, there will be more to see in the picture content itself. As long as the screen, monitor or HDTV, can handle full 1080P, then surely a 1080P image/movie/broadcast should look 'better'. However, I think most will agree, there are 3 more important factors that influence the quality/difference between a 720P and 1080P image/movie/broadcast:
1) the source of this 1080P image/movie/broadcast - BluRay(firmware depended though I believe, hencewhy PS3 is a favourable BluRay player), HD DVD(RIP!), Compressed format content with advanced codec like H264/MPEG4 AVC, Broadband Digital Signal, ie, Sky HD etc.
2) size of Monitor/HDTV - the smallest size that can handle 1080P, afaik, are 24'' monitors and on the other end we have @50'' size HDTV, they do go higher, like the Panasonic 150'' monster recently shown at the CES 2008, it uses ultra high definition but it could also easily do 1080P, but lets stick with 24'' to @50'' monitors/HDTV as thats the majority market.
3) the distance you sit from your monitor/TV.
From my findings I have found a 4th important factor that will also influence the difference between 720P and 1080P on X size screen and that is, the actual content of what you are watching, will explain more below(see about Batch 1 & 2).
For my testing and findings I used my current Dell 2405FPW monitor and my HD-TV, bought at Xmas, Sony KDL-40X3000U. This is my setup.
Next, in order to keep the source material the same, I used Compressed format content with advanced codec like H264/MPEG4 AVC. I could not use my bluray player alas, as I could only connect it to my HDTV not my Dell 24'', so it would not give me a proper comparison. With running the material off my PC, I would run from an identical source on both the Dell and the Sony, by using DVI-DVI or DVI-HDMI leads and I could run the material on both at the same time for better comparisons.
First off I watched the material in 720P then watched it again in 1080P, sitting at a distance of about 1.5M. I also used certain paused scenes to compare 720P images with 1080P onces: Batch 1 -Bourne Ultimatum, Children of Men, The Brave One.
Results on Dell 24'', saw absolutely NO noticable difference between 720P and 1080P.
Results on Sony 40'', saw a 'minor' difference between 720P and 1080P, but only very minor in this Batch. 1080P did look very slightly better on the Sony 40'' compared to the same material in 720P.
Same test but sitting further away @5M.
Results, same as before on the Dell, NO difference.
Results on Sony 40'', that 'minor' difference had now disappeared altogether. NO noticable difference between 720P and 1080P on Batch 1.
Conclusions for Batch 1 - Make sure you sit at the optimal distance from your screen if you want to see the most from 1080P content. I would also come to the conclusion that, the larger the screen size, the more 1080P content would be appreciated if you had to sit a longer distance from the screen. IE. if I had a Sony 50'' model of the same make, I am pretty sure that the best viewing pleasure would be at 5M, where the 1080P would make the same impression as my 40'' at 1.5M. But I would presume, sitting at 1.5M infront of a 50'' would be less enjoyable then a 40'' screen. So size and viewing distance is pretty important, in this case!, when it comes to appreciating 1080P to it full.
But here comes factor 4. I repeated the same test condition with the following Batch 2 - Shrek 3, Ratatouille and Transformers. Again first sitting at @1.5M distance.
Results on the Dell 24'', there was a noticable difference between 720P and 1080P, especially on Shrek 3 and Ratatouille, not so much on Transformers but still noticable.
Results on Sony 40'', this is really where 1080P shines, the difference is significant, again mostly on Shrek 3 and Ratatouille, but also considerable on Transformers.
Same test but sitting further away @5M.
Results on Dell 24'', pretty much stopped seeing the difference between 720P and 1080P, was barely noticable.
Results on Sony 40'', the difference was still very noticable, but not as much as 1.5M but still significant. Pretty sure that if I would sit further away, alas that would mean breaking down a wall, soon enough I would stop seeing the difference.
So what do I conclude from all this, well size and distance, like we already said is important, but factor 4, the actual content of what you are watching is also important if you want to see a difference between 720P and 1080P.
Most movies, like batch 1, ie. normal recorded movies with little or no special effects or picture enchancements, can be enjoyed equally in 720P and 1080P, but only when 1) your screen size is @42'' or less 2) your sitting at the right distance for the size screen you have. I would think, the larger the screen size is, ie 50''+, the more you would appreciate 1080P, IF you sit at the right distance.
But:
Batch 2, movies that are either totally made of CG, ie shrek 3 Ratatouille Beowulf etc, or have a lot of CG effects or enhancements done, ie Transformers Star Wars 1,2 & 3 etc, their difference between 720P and 1080P is simply much more noticable and would be more appreciated on any size screen but again, at the correct viewing distances.
To me, the final major advantage, is that a 1080P screen allows you to use the screen as PC monitor, at 1920x1080 res. This is great for gaming, whether from PC or from console, as 1080P in gaming is very noticeably better when compared to 720P. Like someone said before, this is probably more of a niche useage of HD-TVs. But as the quality improves and prices drop on LCD screens, this may become more and more viable to many others especially gamers.
Some more pictures, but alas it won't really show a comparison between 720P & 1080P. But at least you can see how I compared things.
Anyways, it is a bit long winded, but I thought it would be worthwhile sharing for anyone wanting to know the difference, from my personal findings, between 720P & 1080P before taking the plunge in getting 1080P HDTV. I hope this will make your choice a little easier.
Cheers
I thought of sharing some of my findings with you all, which hopefully may help to decide whichever direction you want to go. Ofcourse, like most people, personal findings also have a certain amount of personal opinions attached to it but I will try to remain as unbaised and objective as possible.
There have been several questions in this post but most center around: is 1080P worth it and at what screen size min/max is it best/worthwhile at or will 720P look just about as good on min/max screen size.
The definition of 720P http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/720p
The definition of 1080P http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080p
Basically 1080P contains more pixels thus, you would assume, there will be more to see in the picture content itself. As long as the screen, monitor or HDTV, can handle full 1080P, then surely a 1080P image/movie/broadcast should look 'better'. However, I think most will agree, there are 3 more important factors that influence the quality/difference between a 720P and 1080P image/movie/broadcast:
1) the source of this 1080P image/movie/broadcast - BluRay(firmware depended though I believe, hencewhy PS3 is a favourable BluRay player), HD DVD(RIP!), Compressed format content with advanced codec like H264/MPEG4 AVC, Broadband Digital Signal, ie, Sky HD etc.
2) size of Monitor/HDTV - the smallest size that can handle 1080P, afaik, are 24'' monitors and on the other end we have @50'' size HDTV, they do go higher, like the Panasonic 150'' monster recently shown at the CES 2008, it uses ultra high definition but it could also easily do 1080P, but lets stick with 24'' to @50'' monitors/HDTV as thats the majority market.
3) the distance you sit from your monitor/TV.
From my findings I have found a 4th important factor that will also influence the difference between 720P and 1080P on X size screen and that is, the actual content of what you are watching, will explain more below(see about Batch 1 & 2).
For my testing and findings I used my current Dell 2405FPW monitor and my HD-TV, bought at Xmas, Sony KDL-40X3000U. This is my setup.
Next, in order to keep the source material the same, I used Compressed format content with advanced codec like H264/MPEG4 AVC. I could not use my bluray player alas, as I could only connect it to my HDTV not my Dell 24'', so it would not give me a proper comparison. With running the material off my PC, I would run from an identical source on both the Dell and the Sony, by using DVI-DVI or DVI-HDMI leads and I could run the material on both at the same time for better comparisons.
First off I watched the material in 720P then watched it again in 1080P, sitting at a distance of about 1.5M. I also used certain paused scenes to compare 720P images with 1080P onces: Batch 1 -Bourne Ultimatum, Children of Men, The Brave One.
Results on Dell 24'', saw absolutely NO noticable difference between 720P and 1080P.
Results on Sony 40'', saw a 'minor' difference between 720P and 1080P, but only very minor in this Batch. 1080P did look very slightly better on the Sony 40'' compared to the same material in 720P.
Same test but sitting further away @5M.
Results, same as before on the Dell, NO difference.
Results on Sony 40'', that 'minor' difference had now disappeared altogether. NO noticable difference between 720P and 1080P on Batch 1.
Conclusions for Batch 1 - Make sure you sit at the optimal distance from your screen if you want to see the most from 1080P content. I would also come to the conclusion that, the larger the screen size, the more 1080P content would be appreciated if you had to sit a longer distance from the screen. IE. if I had a Sony 50'' model of the same make, I am pretty sure that the best viewing pleasure would be at 5M, where the 1080P would make the same impression as my 40'' at 1.5M. But I would presume, sitting at 1.5M infront of a 50'' would be less enjoyable then a 40'' screen. So size and viewing distance is pretty important, in this case!, when it comes to appreciating 1080P to it full.
But here comes factor 4. I repeated the same test condition with the following Batch 2 - Shrek 3, Ratatouille and Transformers. Again first sitting at @1.5M distance.
Results on the Dell 24'', there was a noticable difference between 720P and 1080P, especially on Shrek 3 and Ratatouille, not so much on Transformers but still noticable.
Results on Sony 40'', this is really where 1080P shines, the difference is significant, again mostly on Shrek 3 and Ratatouille, but also considerable on Transformers.
Same test but sitting further away @5M.
Results on Dell 24'', pretty much stopped seeing the difference between 720P and 1080P, was barely noticable.
Results on Sony 40'', the difference was still very noticable, but not as much as 1.5M but still significant. Pretty sure that if I would sit further away, alas that would mean breaking down a wall, soon enough I would stop seeing the difference.
So what do I conclude from all this, well size and distance, like we already said is important, but factor 4, the actual content of what you are watching is also important if you want to see a difference between 720P and 1080P.
Most movies, like batch 1, ie. normal recorded movies with little or no special effects or picture enchancements, can be enjoyed equally in 720P and 1080P, but only when 1) your screen size is @42'' or less 2) your sitting at the right distance for the size screen you have. I would think, the larger the screen size is, ie 50''+, the more you would appreciate 1080P, IF you sit at the right distance.
But:
Batch 2, movies that are either totally made of CG, ie shrek 3 Ratatouille Beowulf etc, or have a lot of CG effects or enhancements done, ie Transformers Star Wars 1,2 & 3 etc, their difference between 720P and 1080P is simply much more noticable and would be more appreciated on any size screen but again, at the correct viewing distances.
To me, the final major advantage, is that a 1080P screen allows you to use the screen as PC monitor, at 1920x1080 res. This is great for gaming, whether from PC or from console, as 1080P in gaming is very noticeably better when compared to 720P. Like someone said before, this is probably more of a niche useage of HD-TVs. But as the quality improves and prices drop on LCD screens, this may become more and more viable to many others especially gamers.
Some more pictures, but alas it won't really show a comparison between 720P & 1080P. But at least you can see how I compared things.
Anyways, it is a bit long winded, but I thought it would be worthwhile sharing for anyone wanting to know the difference, from my personal findings, between 720P & 1080P before taking the plunge in getting 1080P HDTV. I hope this will make your choice a little easier.
Cheers
Last edited:
i just downloaded and tested Ratatouille from psn network ..the 720 & 1080 version to test using a ps3 to play them. its a 46" lcd panel.
sitting at about 9-10 feet away both pictures look great...the 1080 version does look a bit sharper. difference is hardly noticeable but it is there.
reason i bought a 1080p lcd was so i could hook it up to my pc at times and also i can play 1080 games using a ps3(difference in 720 & 1080 is more noticeable in games).
if i was just going to use the t.v for watching high def movies then i would certainly have went for a 720p plasma(or atleast i would now if i were too). the extra u end up paying for full hd wouldnt really be worth it atm.
also if you are getting a lcd then get a recent model which clearly states pure black panel or something along those lines as lcd's havent had great blacks in the past. you would probably end up paying a fair bit for a lcd with really good blacks and low response times(to remove ghosting of fast moving images) and full hd. so go for a 720p plasma if its just for watching movies and the money saved can be spent towards a larger panel which is always better
.
sitting at about 9-10 feet away both pictures look great...the 1080 version does look a bit sharper. difference is hardly noticeable but it is there.
reason i bought a 1080p lcd was so i could hook it up to my pc at times and also i can play 1080 games using a ps3(difference in 720 & 1080 is more noticeable in games).
if i was just going to use the t.v for watching high def movies then i would certainly have went for a 720p plasma(or atleast i would now if i were too). the extra u end up paying for full hd wouldnt really be worth it atm.
also if you are getting a lcd then get a recent model which clearly states pure black panel or something along those lines as lcd's havent had great blacks in the past. you would probably end up paying a fair bit for a lcd with really good blacks and low response times(to remove ghosting of fast moving images) and full hd. so go for a 720p plasma if its just for watching movies and the money saved can be spent towards a larger panel which is always better
.NICE WRITE UP SOVA !!!!! 
I did the same sort of tests on my parents 1080p toshiba x3030 42 inch, and came to roughly the same conclusions. That tv looks great for HD stuff, but there is noticable judder and it is poor for SD.
Very very happy i went for a kuro as the picture at 720p on this set beats any picture ive seen on other 1080p sets. Even when i sit about 6ft away i could not hope for a better picture, and paying for a 1080p kuro at 50 inchs or above would really not be worth the price premium.
I did the same sort of tests on my parents 1080p toshiba x3030 42 inch, and came to roughly the same conclusions. That tv looks great for HD stuff, but there is noticable judder and it is poor for SD.
Very very happy i went for a kuro as the picture at 720p on this set beats any picture ive seen on other 1080p sets. Even when i sit about 6ft away i could not hope for a better picture, and paying for a 1080p kuro at 50 inchs or above would really not be worth the price premium.
