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Will you be buying a Radeon VII?

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by Gregster, Jan 10, 2019.

?

Will you be buying a Radeon VII?

  1. Yes

    8.0%
  2. No

    50.3%
  3. Will wait for more info on pricing/performance

    41.7%
  1. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 29,699

    Location: Ireland

  2. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 29,699

    Location: Ireland

    How does upscaling lower res image quality make it look better than native 4k? Entirely subjective imo.
     
  3. Kaapstad

    Man of Honour

    Joined: May 21, 2012

    Posts: 27,257

    Location: Dalek flagship

    I am not even going to pretend I know the technical reasons but it definitely works.
     
  4. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 2,687

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    True, but at least with DLSS the upscaling algorithm is trying to replicate a known reference picture with its fewer generated pieces, rather than an image agnostic process. When it works I can see DLSS offering incredible upscaling quality, but obviously it will never be as good as just rendering natively.
     
  5. Howling

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Sep 14, 2008

    Posts: 1,925

    It can't/won't look better than native, it's purely a performance hack - attempting to get as close to native image as possible with the least power requirement.
     
  6. muon

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 8, 2006

    Posts: 17,040

    The move to 7nm gives either 25% more performance or same performance for half the power consumption for the same performance.

    I think AMD should have gone for the latter route. Vega 64 performance at 150W to compete against the RTX 2060.

    Instead of eking out that performance with the same high power consumption as Vega64.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 29,699

    Location: Ireland


    Then people would still have complained about no top end performance. Amd are in a situation currently where on the gpu side no matter what they do a vocal group will still be on the moan.
     
  8. muon

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 8, 2006

    Posts: 17,040

    But I think they would have sold a load of cards. I don't think the card they have launched will sell that well.

    Obviously I can speak with hindsight. AMD didn't necessarily know what nvidia were going to do.
     
  9. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 2,687

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    But that's Navi, supposedly.
     
  10. muon

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 8, 2006

    Posts: 17,040

    Well Navi should hopefully also have IPC gains. Otherwise it would just be a Vega shrink.
     
  11. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 29,699

    Location: Ireland


    Makes absolutely no sense, you can't just take a lower res asset and make it look better through some weird upscaling technique. If anything upscaling should make it look worse. I'll be interested to seeing actual side by side comparisons once this is something reviewers are looking at. What nvidia have shown so far reminds me of the old dvd\vhs comparison where people pushing dvd messed with vhs to make it look a lot blurrier than it was, was the same thing with dvd and bluray with dvd's suddenly looking like ass in the comparison. I think there are some shenanigans afoot, time will tell.
     
  12. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 29,699

    Location: Ireland


    Depends really, if it offers 2080 performance i think it'll sell reasonably well. Not everyone is sold on the rtx\dlss thing.
     
  13. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 2,687

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    Well it's GCN 6 so far more than just shrinking Vega.
     
  14. muon

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 8, 2006

    Posts: 17,040

    But you can do that. You won't get it perfect as ultimately you are guessing, but over millions of pixels you should improve the image.

    The key point that annoys me is that, you do this through lots of tensor cores. You might as well have replaced those tensor cores with rasterisation cores and drawn the image correctly with that additional die area.

    DLSS is an afterthought imo. They built Turing with ray tracing in mind, and now are coming up with other use cases for tensor cores, forgetting the fact ray tracing is a gimmick to begin with.

    The key demo nvidia are using is also FFXV which has a terrible TAA implementation which just blurs everything. Making DLSS look sharper and better in comparison, although that doesn't mean it is doing nothing.
     
  15. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 29,699

    Location: Ireland

    I honestly don't see it, i seen nvidia's demos and even then they were very hit or miss to see if there was much difference. If you have to zoom in x amount of times to see a difference i don't see the point.

    It's definitely something that was bolted on late in the game.
     
  16. Panos

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Nov 22, 2009

    Posts: 8,766

    Location: NE Lincolnshire

    RVII is MI60 salvaged part, that cannot be used on MI50 either.
    Once the HBM is attached to the substrate it cannot be removed if the GPU is faulty on all cores. So the only way to not throw into the bin $400, is to strap a cooler and sell it as RVII.

    And have no worry. AMD ain't going to have them gathering dust on the shelves. They will sell like hotcakes to the non gamers. Pay a visit on content creation and especially AI & Machine Learning enthusiast forums.
    You shouldn't be surprised if you see the card selling for £1000 by end of February due to supply & demand.

    And supply going to be very tight, as the manufacturing matures also over the upcoming months.
    AMD isn't crazy to lose money selling RVII instead of MI60 or MI50.
     
  17. muon

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 8, 2006

    Posts: 17,040

    Neural net image upscaling is definitely a real thing. Going from 1440p to 4k is hard to see, especially with video games.

    However if you search on the internet for photo examples (where your eyes are much better at detecting image quality) you'll see how amazing it is.
     
  18. LeMson

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Mar 21, 2012

    Posts: 1,801

    Where's the cheap 7nm cards AdordedTV promised, dammit!
     
  19. Nevk

    Associate

    Joined: Nov 13, 2014

    Posts: 13

    My graphics is Vega 64 LC edition and im prepared to buy Vega VII...
    If Vega VII can faster 30% tahn Vega 64 LC, i will buy it when Vega VII released.
     
  20. TNA

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Mar 13, 2008

    Posts: 9,997

    Location: London

    It will likely be no more than 20% faster on average than an LC imo.