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Will you be buying a Radeon VII?

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by Gregster, Jan 10, 2019.

?

Will you be buying a Radeon VII?

  1. Yes

    8.0%
  2. No

    50.3%
  3. Will wait for more info on pricing/performance

    41.7%
  1. Gregster

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 24, 2008

    Posts: 37,319

    Location: Essex innit!

    Very surprised to see people leaning towards not buying. A 30% on average (give or take) over the V64 is a decent jump in performance but I also see where people are coming from in terms of price. As has been said by @Dicehunter "it is a Mi50 card that looks like a stop gap before Navi, which isn't a bad thing really and it will have enough VRAM to run 8K (although maybe not the grunt).

    I genuinely do feel for AMD and would love to see them, going toe to toe but going from this thread, they are not really helping themselves and whilst NVidia are being the greedy money grabbers, even I didn't expect AMD to follow suit (although price wise, HBM2 isn't cheap, so maybe pricing is a little fairer from AMD). Lisa Su did say a couple of years ago that AMD is no longer a budget brand also.

    With Intel joining the discrete market, I sure hope Navi is decent.
     
  2. SS-89

    Sgarrista

    Joined: May 13, 2007

    Posts: 7,525

    Location: London

    Can a 700 quid card ever be called bang for buck...I had 1080ti sli great cards but hardly what I would call bargains. The 1080ti only looks good still because of how disappointing Turing and Vega 20 are.
     
  3. 0h_no_not_again

    Gangster

    Joined: Jun 29, 2016

    Posts: 156

    Boom. Thanks for the info :)
     
  4. Marine-RX179

    Capodecina

    Joined: Feb 6, 2010

    Posts: 13,954

    The Radeon VII suffer the same problem as some of the gaming laptop with Nvidia GPUs (usually doubling the amount of their desktop GPU counterparts, despite the 1920 res display): excessive amount of vram paired up with a GPU that's never gonna really benefit from it, but users still have to pay the extra for them.
     
  5. easyrider

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 24, 2005

    Posts: 37,414

    Location: Autonomy


    Thats sort of the point. Mine cost me 599 new...If I get 2 years use then upgrade to 3000 series thats pretty sweet considering its on par with current gen both from NV and AMD :)
     
  6. Howling

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Sep 14, 2008

    Posts: 1,925

    I think the lean to not buying is because unlike in the "will you buy an RTX card" the results are spread differently (if anyone can find that thread I'd greatly appreciate it, I went back as far as June and didn't spot it, but I guess I just overlooked it). If memory serves, the options were pretty much the same - Yes, No, Wait for benchmarks... but the spread was either yes or no, the wait and see benchmarks was drastically lower... I think it says more about the difference between the nVidians and the rest of us.. nVidians will buy whatever is put in front of them, whereas sensible people will wait for benchmarks to see if it's worth it. I really would like someone to find me that old thread because I feel a little awkward commenting without the exact numbers at hand, this is just from memory and I'm getting old :(
     
  7. Gregster

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 24, 2008

    Posts: 37,319

    Location: Essex innit!

    Looking at the 2080 sales figures, the 'NVidians' as you call them are not buying either. I bought a 2080Ti and whilst it is a fast card and can do RT and DLSS, I don't mind admitting that the price was way over the top. BFV looks sweet and runs pretty well considering that this is the first game to make use of the Tensor cores and give some RT goodness but £1150 for a GPU that would have cost a max of £500 is nonsensical really.

    I have noticed of late that more and more people are getting pee-d off with the prices and my last build that I did cost my mate roughly £880 and this was a semi midrange build. I am going to put my hands up and say if prices continue like this, I will be going for a console. I can't keep justifying the prices, as others also can't.
     
  8. Howling

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Sep 14, 2008

    Posts: 1,925

    I'm not talking about sales figures, I'm speaking specifically on the poll as we have this poll and that poll to compare (not that I can find the thread... so we have this poll and my spotty memory of that poll :p ). We don't have R7 sales figures to compare.
     
  9. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 2,687

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    So they'll take a hit on their data center cards by rebadging MI60s and slashing their profit margin? I don't see it.
     
  10. easyrider

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 24, 2005

    Posts: 37,414

    Location: Autonomy

    Yeah I hear you mate...It is getting silly...Hopefully Zen 3000 series will keep intel in check as the new Ryzen 8/12 chip is beating 9900k and its only a Ryzen 5 supposedly....Thats why I wanted AMD to shake up the GFX space.

    I have built a 9900k system at Christmas after selling my old 6700k system so it some of the sting out of the cost....But I think Ill keep my 1080ti for some time...I enjoy new tech but its got to manageable and fun...Not silly money

    New cards being released in 2019 should not be the same speed as a 20 month old card and cost more money...I mean where is the fun in that!

    They are taking us for mugs...
     
  11. IT Troll

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jun 15, 2005

    Posts: 2,003

    Location: Edinburgh

    I paid 699 for mine on release day. At this rate it looks like I will be getting 3 years out of it. Which is good in some ways but bad in others.
     
  12. easyrider

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 24, 2005

    Posts: 37,414

    Location: Autonomy

    Well look at this way...You're not loosing out on performance either from NV or AMD on their current GEN cards around the same price. :)
     
  13. Boomstick777

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jan 2, 2012

    Posts: 10,940

    Location: UK.

    Prices are bonkers ! When my VEGA died I looked at prices, RTX 2080 was cheaper than 1080 Ti and RTX 2080 Ti was around £1200.

    So yeah went RTX 2080, no interest in current state of ray tracing either. But man this card is fast. It's awesome in VR. So right choice for me.

    Mainly gaming on console now though, PC for VR and strategy games. This card could last me years tbh, but we all now I like to change em xD

    For an enthusiast who likes to try all the hardware, this hobby is getting way too expensive !
     
  14. Rock_n_Roll

    Gangster

    Joined: Aug 1, 2017

    Posts: 425

    .
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019
  15. Dicehunter

    Capodecina

    Joined: Feb 19, 2007

    Posts: 10,448

    Location: Ye Olde England

    If Nvidia have their way the next gen 3060 will cost £600, 3070 £800, 3080 £1000 and 3080 Ti £1400 and the sad thing is people will lap it up.
     
  16. Killer7xx

    Gangster

    Joined: Dec 27, 2008

    Posts: 339

    I think it's an interesting card. Potentially could OC to 2GHz and above, although I wouldn't count on it due to being the first silicon on TSMC's 7nm HPC process. Perf/clock has definitely increased as well due to more memory bandwidth and ROPs, so at Vega 64 clocks it should beat a GTX 1080 straight up instead of trading blows. It's removed quite a significant bottleneck with Vega.

    This is AMD's Volta equivalent, Navi will be their Turing equivalent. This is a good sign of what AMD can bring to the table later this year with Navi, I expect a 4096 core Navi to be firmly in between the VII and the 2080Ti, whilst having a smaller die size than the VII and GDDR6 over HBM2.

    And if AMD manage to increase core count for Navi past the 4096 core limit, I'd say we'd be looking at 2080Ti levels of performance for a lot less die size, but there's still a lot of speculation over whether that will happen.
     
  17. ltron

    Hitman

    Joined: Aug 30, 2014

    Posts: 929

    I totally agree. The 2080 was one of the most disappointing Nvidia products I can remember and made quite a few YouTubers' worst products of the year lists, for AMD to match this in terms of performance and price while having fewer features is not a good strategy.

    Monitors are also a big bone of contention for me vs TVs, you get so much less for your money. Where are all the 1440P OLED HDR monitors for a reasonable price (£500-700)?
     
  18. Satchfanuk

    Gangster

    Joined: Jun 24, 2016

    Posts: 295

    Location: Norfolk

    You're right, as has been said, these are salvage parts from the Instinct line. The HBM is already attached and rather than throw away all that memory, and in the current pricing environment created by Nvidia, AMD are taking the opportunity to sell these GPUs to gamers at as low a price as they could without taking a loss. Sure the pricing could be better but consider the market these parts were manufactured for and how much they should be if they qualified. They are no doubt ludicrously expensive to make.

    Strangely, these cards have made me more optimistic about Navi. I'm sure we can all agree that Vega wasn't the best chip AMD could have made considering the size of the die etc. But to get this sort of performance from it on 7nm makes me think Navi stands a good chance of being decent. I'm not going to get too excited just yet but I'm looking forward to seeing what it can do.
     
  19. Mauller

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 7, 2015

    Posts: 2,663

    Location: In Space

    It's not the core count limiting the performance. With Navi they could go with fewer cores and have better performance still compared to Vega 7.
     
  20. Gerard

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 29,700

    Location: Ireland

    Some youtube "experts" are suggesting they could make it cheaper by removing half the ram. Not really sure how that's supposed to work considering it would half the memory bandwidth plus as they're supposedly instinct cards that didn't make the cut the ram would already be on the package, even if they disabled it the fact its on there costs them money and hurts the card overall.

    Same as the gddr 6 argument, the core was setup for hbm as was the pcb design, changing to gddr6 would require a lot of work on both the core as well as having to design a new pcb with traces for the ram modules, PLUS having to alter the heatsink to make sure the ram modules had places to touch the heatsink material to help dissipate heat.