4600 migrants "rescued" in two days. Is this what's called deterring the people smugglers?

deuse · 30 Aug 2016 at 10:12

Barham2016 said:
We are still in the EU, so of course we get a say?

RaohNS · 30 Aug 2016 at 10:15

Liquiduk said:
Sounds like a lot of paperwork

It does lol.

Tefal said:
does Libya even have an effective government to get permission from?

Just rock up with "hey these guys where drowning we saved them for you....nah don't know anything about immigrants"

Yes. It made me laugh when the Egyptian billionaire wanted to buy a Greek island for the refugees. Lol you can just imagine it: Egypt... How will be get rid of refugees that are here? Buy an island and send em to ot, they will be Europea problem not ours.

Chris Wilson · 30 Aug 2016 at 10:17

deuse said:
Move the our ships closer to where they are coming from and tow them back. Problem solved.

I am not a maritime law expert, I'm just a fancy mechanic, but maybe the boats can't legally go into Libyan waters? They rescue them from outside Libyan territorial limits, into which the people smugglers have ensured they can sail?

Tefal · 30 Aug 2016 at 10:21

Chris Wilson said:
I am not a maritime law expert, I'm just a fancy mechanic, but maybe the boats can't legally go into Libyan waters? They rescue them from outside Libyan territorial limits, into which the people smugglers have ensured they can sail?

to be a pragmatist, does it really make a difference?

there's no effective government (we kinda bombed the **** out of the last one didn't we?), ongoing civil war and no navy to speak of.

send on of our ships meant for amphibious landings and keep dropping them off with the hovercraft?

edscdk · 30 Aug 2016 at 10:22

it's a shame we cannot set up proper refugee camps in their own country and tell the fighting faction come any where near the camp and we will **** you up, no holds bared.

as to what to do with the ships its a difficult one, I don't have a clue... I don't want them here, but is it really fair to send them back?

Liquiduk · 30 Aug 2016 at 10:25

Chris Wilson said:
Costs of handling the situation versus the cost of allowing these economic migrants and maybe in the future their families, who seem noticeably absent, to land and live in Europe?

Cue those who will come forwards saying what an asset these often illiterate, certainly jobless, pugnacious, tribally hostile lot will be...

I don't know why you are quoting my post as if I was responding to you? Of course a step in any direction needs to be taken. I was referring to sinking boats, which in my eyes is probably not the best course of action.

Playing devils advocate for a moment here, are these particular traits highlighted above indicative of the opportunity these people are given at life which quite honestly isn't much... born in to terror, hate and war?

Efour · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:09

Vote to leave the EU and take back our sovereignty, thaT will stop the problem. That and 40mm bofos.

RaohNS · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:09

Tefal said:
to be a pragmatist, does it really make a difference?

there's no effective government (we kinda bombed the **** out of the last one didn't we?), ongoing civil war and no navy to speak of.

send on of our ships meant for amphibious landings and keep dropping them off with the hovercraft?

Thing is I think even if you decide to fire warning shots at these boats (like I've seen the Aussies do), they will either just carry on or start shooting back.

Is the bigger and deeper picture here to do with cause being foreign meddling in a sovereign nation?

RaohNS · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:10

Efour said:
Vote to leave the EU and take back our sovereignty, thaT will stop the problem. That and 40mm bofos.

Ouch... The hurt is strong still it is.

CREATIVE!11 · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:11

Jono said:
This is madness, surely?
"What, so we should just let them drown?"

Sorry, but yeah. Their choice. Well no, not exactly - but round them up and dump them back on the coast from whence they came.

That's what Australia does.

And they warn them, you wash up illegally on our shores. You are going right back.

Tefal · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:12

RaohNS said:
Thing is I think even if you decide to fire warning shots at these boats (like I've seen the Aussies do), they will either just carry on or start shooting back.

Is the bigger and deeper picture here to do with cause being foreign meddling in a sovereign nation?

the reffuge boats?

they;re willingly being picked up.

the navy i don't know if they have boats that ould detect ours and get there in time.

Efour · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:13

RaohNS said:
Ouch... The hurt is strong still it is.

I'll bite. What? HE can shred ribs and other small craft rendering them unseaworthy

do_ron_ron · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:15

Chris Wilson said:
There was extensive talk of EU countries sending ships to the Mediterranean to deter migrant people smuggling, yet in the last 2 days alone over 7600 migrants sent to sea with just enough fuel to get in range of rescue ships posted off the Libyan coast, have been safely ferried ashore into Europe. Is this what is called deterring people smuggling? We might as well just offer free ferry service, every Eritrean, Libyan, Somalian and their neighbours will be on their phones and social media incredulous about how the West are actually now facilitating economic migrancy.

How has this madness become mainstream with huge numbers of illegal migrants being collected from the seas where they obviously set off knowing they would be rescued and brought to Europe? What deterrents are ACTUALLY occurring out there? Any at all? We (the EU) might as well try and run an official ferry service from Africa to the EU, free of charge... What is the legal position of charities facilitating illegal entry of migrants using charity funds?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-37216881

Cameron's legacy. Without his regime change in Libya there would be no path via that country. Apart from opening up this country to criminal gangs smuggling people it has become a base for IS.

Roar87 · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:26

I am so glad we voted Leave. I can only hope we have a complete split from the farce that is the EU.

RaohNS · 30 Aug 2016 at 11:27

Efour said:
I'll bite. What? HE can shred ribs and other small craft rendering them unseaworthy

That is a good idea actually. When they are dropped back off, take their boats and sink them.

The issue I have with the refugees is mainly: We have no idea at all who they are (and what they are capable of) and they have a totally backward and incompatible culture.

Blackjack Davy · 31 Aug 2016 at 02:33

RaohNS said:
How do we stop them then, Chris?

Turn them around and escort them back to where they came from? I think they'd get the message. At the very least take some steps to crack down on the traffickers who are obviously making a great deal of money its got to be ending up somewhere.

Malevolence · 31 Aug 2016 at 05:22

Sinking the boats won't make a blind bit of difference. Once they've been set off from the Libyan shore those boats are written off by the smugglers. Or do people really think that the smugglers pop over to Italy/Greece, steal back whatever boats haven't already sunk and then pilot them back across the med?

We need to start targeting the smuggling gangs and taking them out of the equation in such a way that anyone who feels like stepping up to fill the vacuum has some serious seconds thoughts about doing so.

Tefal · 31 Aug 2016 at 06:28

Malevolence said:
We need to start targeting the smuggling gangs and taking them out of the equation in such a way that anyone who feels like stepping up to fill the vacuum has some serious seconds thoughts about doing so.

such as?

kitch9 · 31 Aug 2016 at 06:51

Chris Wilson said:
Costs of handling the situation versus the cost of allowing these economic migrants and maybe in the future their families, who seem noticeably absent, to land and live in Europe?

Cue those who will come forwards saying what an asset these often illiterate, certainly jobless, pugnacious, tribally hostile lot will be...

How will we get our mushrooms picked without them though?

Lovely mushrooms. Hmmmm.