Was the employee a F1 fan? The reason I ask is that if most of us saw those docs, we wouldnt think anything of it. Anyone not into F1 would know absolutely nothing about those docs or their content.
2008 Turkish GP - Race 5/18
- Thread starter rpstewart
- Start date
Was the employee a F1 fan? The reason I ask is that if most of us saw those docs, we wouldnt think anything of it. Anyone not into F1 would know absolutely nothing about those docs or their content.
So then why didnt Fisichella even get close to Alonso during 2005/6? I remember, Fisichella winning the Australian GP, but apart from that Alonso was the daddy.
Alonso still has to drive the car.
You are making it sound like the electronics are doing all the work, while the driver just sits there giving an impression of driving the car. Driver aids do help and may blur the picture a little bit, however, as we are seeing this year, the drivers who were quick with driver aids last year are also quick without driver aids this year. We cant say with any authority that a particular driver has moved up or down the pack as a result of losing driver aids. Massa initially struggled, but he is the most in-form driver now, winning 28 pts from the last 3 races.
Many Brits wanted to believe that Button was a fantastic driver who would thrive without driver aids. However, now that we are in the middle of 2008, we can see that he is of a similar pace to Barrichello, just as he was last year. Nothing has changed.
Ferrari hadnt yet got their act together in 1998. They were still moving forward. MS had quite a few retirements that year. Compare this to the bullet proof reliability he had a few years later and you get an idea just how good MS/Ferrari were and what Alonso/Renault were up against (in 2006).
I can see you are not a fan of driver aids and so you feel that anyone who wins with lots of electronics is not worthy of winning. Driver aids and electronics are not the fault of the driver. They must do the best possible job they can do with the equipment they have. Generally though, drivers who do best with driver aids also do best without them. The jury was out on Massa, but even he has now adapted.
Yep.
It was a bloke, so chances are he will know a slight bit about F1. But if someone handed you 200 pages of Ferrari tech info to photocopy, and you are not standing in Italy, you may think it is suspect. Especially when you live close to McLaren.
Might not be hard to tell if it has Scuderia Ferrari headers on the pages
I would, but i hate McLaren. I am not necessarily pro Ferrari, i just hate McLaren.
They are so smug and think they are great, considering they have won **** all lately.
And they are cheating ******s.
Like i said though, i am not a huge Ferrari fan, just don't like McLaren. If i had to pick one team and only support them, it would probably be William's, but i am not a die hard supporter of anyone. But i am happy Kimi is winning as i like him, as he is a little bit rock and roll. Ever since a couple of years ago in Monaco when he retired a McLaren and went straight to his yacht for a wee glass of vino, he went up in my books.
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As for who i would call, i would call one of 2 places, Ferrari (number will be in the docs, if not i am sure they have a web site with a number). If i don't get anywhere with them, i'd phone Autosport, they would get through to SF for me.
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As for last year. I am convinced that McLaren were told that they would be thrown out drivers and all after Ferrari-gate. The compromise was that the drivers could stay in as long as neither won the title.
Two races from the end it would have required freakish results for neither Lewis or Alonso to win it - and look what happened !
Trye fiascos, gearbox gremlins and errors - too much of a coincidence.
Two races from the end it would have required freakish results for neither Lewis or Alonso to win it - and look what happened !
Trye fiascos, gearbox gremlins and errors - too much of a coincidence.
In the Brazillian GP, 2007, when Hamilton went off trying to keep in touch with Alonso - that could not have been pre-staged. It was vintage Kamikaze Hamilton. And in China in the rain, for him to go off at the place he did - you couldnt make that sort of thing up.
I couldnt help but think though, that in those 2 races Alonso was being overly cautious, even though it meant that Raikkonen was able to race off to win the race and the Championship.
For 3 drivers to finish within 1 point of one another is unprecedented.
I would say though, that McLaren lost the WDC title, rather than Ferrari won it. If McLaren had backed either one of their drivers from mid-season on, that driver probably wouldve won the title, as Hamilton and Alonso were taking points off of one another.
They had the strongest and most exciting driver pairing in over a decade and they totally screwed up. I blame McLaren management for the 2007 screw-ups.
McLaren didn't know how much impact the Hamilton fever would have. Even 4 races before Silverstone the boy was practically a British legend.
How could they choose between the two? Alonso, two time champion and being paid ****-loads. Or Hamilton, rookie, British hero and super star of a chiefly British F1 team...
If McLaren execs could have made a choice I'm sure they would have. It's obvious they favour Hamilton now but unfortunately it just took them too long to decide that. And I think last year they just couldn't bare the thought of spending so much cash on Alonso and yet make him the rear gunner!
If any mistake was made it was made in late 2006 by underestimating Hamilton, as corny as that sounds!
PS: The last few races of 2007 could have easily been sabotaged by prior arrangement. This is a marketing business, not a sport.
How could they choose between the two? Alonso, two time champion and being paid ****-loads. Or Hamilton, rookie, British hero and super star of a chiefly British F1 team...
If McLaren execs could have made a choice I'm sure they would have. It's obvious they favour Hamilton now but unfortunately it just took them too long to decide that. And I think last year they just couldn't bare the thought of spending so much cash on Alonso and yet make him the rear gunner!
If any mistake was made it was made in late 2006 by underestimating Hamilton, as corny as that sounds!
PS: The last few races of 2007 could have easily been sabotaged by prior arrangement. This is a marketing business, not a sport.
Fisi was rapidly put in his place, we have already heard this year from Fisi's manager how his hands where tied at renault. If Alonso was running alonso came first.
When that happens to a driver and you know your running your whole year as second best that must really hit your motivation.
Briatore is a ****. If you don't sign with him you get 2nd class treatment.
Look at the way he treated trulli and the face on him when Trulli won a GP. Never have I seen a man so upset to win a race. He then started to knock trulli and every opportunity.
The very least you can say about Raikonen is he won a title without having a team mate with his hands tied behind his back, no preferential treatment, no manager as the boss, no emotional ties. When did that last happen 97?
Again for Kimi to win again this year he has to see off his team mate first.
With 2 races to go and Hamilton leading the title race, I wouldve told Alonso to back Hamilton up, as he was now the most likely candidate to finish in front, in the WDC. The problem here though, was that very few people were on talking terms with Alonso, including Ron Denis.
Its a crazy situation when you think about it. You win the Constructors title on merit, but its taken away from you. And both your drivers lose the WDC by 1 point. You honestly couldnt make that up. If they made a move about it, no one would believe the ending.
I just wish that Alonso was still at McLaren. If this was so, I'm confident, Ferrari wouldnt have the sort of advantage they have right now.
Its a crazy situation when you think about it. You win the Constructors title on merit, but its taken away from you. And both your drivers lose the WDC by 1 point. You honestly couldnt make that up. If they made a move about it, no one would believe the ending.
I just wish that Alonso was still at McLaren. If this was so, I'm confident, Ferrari wouldnt have the sort of advantage they have right now.
If anything, Kimi was the 2nd driver.
His first year with the team, and Massa had the ear of MS too, getting advice all the time etc. Kimi just went about his business and got the job done.
But they didn't win it on merrit! They won it with IP that did not belong to them!!
If someone cheats they are not remembered as 'They won it on merrit, but it was taken away from them'
They had data on Ferrari, but I seriously doubt that knowledge of Ferrari set-ups and fuel strategy wouldve made any difference to the outcome of the constructors title.
The truth is, we dont know to what extent McLaren knew about the workings of the Ferrari car and just how much info they were able to incorporate into their own car to improve its performance. That shall forever remain a mystery.
It wasn't only thei set-up and fuel strategy.
McLaren had to scrap their 08 car because so much of it was that close to Ferrari, they scrapped it before the FIA banned them.
You don't need to do that, without using some of it in the previous years car.
I think they took the constructors hit because if not the FIA might have just ripped their 07 car apart and done them for it all.
They didn't scrap their 2008 car.
Their 2007 car was never the concern for the FIA so they would never have "ripped their 07 car apart and done them for it all".
You have very misguided views about this whole subject, JUMPURS. It isn't as simple as "omg they had ferrari data hence they cheated, that is final, end of story". This business has more politics, back stabbing, bungs and cash for honours than there is at 10 Downing Street.
Their 2007 car was never the concern for the FIA so they would never have "ripped their 07 car apart and done them for it all".
You have very misguided views about this whole subject, JUMPURS. It isn't as simple as "omg they had ferrari data hence they cheated, that is final, end of story". This business has more politics, back stabbing, bungs and cash for honours than there is at 10 Downing Street.
Agreed. Briatore is a first class *** IMO. He publicly belittles and bullies his drivers unless their name is Alonso.
The data was clearly good enough to warrant them asking for more by email. The lies about how many people knew and how deep it went into the Mclaren system didn't help their cause.
The failure to sack Pedro who is little more than a contractor is somewhat suspicious.
Mclaren didnt win on merit anymore than a doped sprinter wins on merit.
Not that it matters Mclaren took the punishment and have paid for the crime.
Or he has a contract with a portion of his own percentage. I'd dearly love to see him removed from renault.
I have no doubt at some point in time Briatore will extract revenge on Alonso for his mclaren escape and turning his back on him.
He normally has a good rant around monaco, guess he might get stuck in soon
I thought for Piquet that was some poor career advice going there. Almost as good advice as the great indy drivers that turn up to drive say a toyota and think they are going to get anywhere
