Star Wars Spoiled Beyond Repair

I just thought the storyline that kicked off Episode one was rather weak, and didn't have enough back bone. Its pretty boring as well, just having a trade dispute between the Trade Federation and the Galactic Republic :o
 
Am I right in thinking SW was meant to be a TV series but Lucas didn't want to do 1-2-3 as he didn't have enough technolgy to show the affects he wanted to?
 
1-3 too modern. Should have done it 70s style. Would have given it that 'feel' back I reckon. For me this is where many remakes and rehashes fall down. Only immediate film I can think of where they pull it off is Batman begins. Even Casino Royale, although gave hints of a return to form, felt diluted by the modern super shiny gleam plastered all over it. T3 too. I'm sure T2 appeared very modern for it's time but part of it's longevity and appeal to me now is the 'feel' of the film which is charecterized by the equiptment they were using at the time.

In my opinion, if Lucas had thrown in some seventies crap in there, it would have brought back some of the magic. I think it succeeded on the merging of the styles of the time combined with what his vision for the future would be (albeit a long time ago, in a galaxy far away), it created something unique. I think that's what was missing for ep 1-3. I'm sure it was all about the effects at the time, but this time round I think they missed the bits they weren't even thinking about first time, that made 4-6 such great films. Everything about 4-6 was great, not just the effects. The designs of the spaceships, the characterisation, the soundtrack, the plot, the haircuts, the colour schemes. They just didn't get it right on 1-3, although they were epic efforts.

I can't wait for the day film makers realise they don't *have* to use current technology and start to shoot things in retro style again.
 
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- Characters in 1-3 are badly written and badly casted. With a small exception of rather whiney but natural Amidala you would be pressed hard to actually give a monkey about any of the characters you see. Obi is an a-hole, Anakin is weird, Jar Jar Binks is oddly moving carribean accented gender confused alien with a brain of a teletubby. It's almost impossible to name most of the ever revolving side kicks. We used be Lukes and Hans on our playgrounds - show me a kid who would like to be Anny or Jar Jar Binks.
- There is no character development - we don't get to properly see why Anakin becomes bad, instead it's shoved down our throat with finesse of an episode of Dynasty where one of the characters comes out of the closet.
- Story is infantile, forced and crushing instead of mystical, fun and twisty. The fleets get destroyed because "look r2, something is pulling us" and "oups". The force is no longer something "that's in all living things, it's up to you to find it in yourself" but instead it's something found at random in your blood, by a lab. Oh, yeah, and Annie is the effect of immaculate conception. And that's only the first of the three movies.
- CG is too clean and too plasticky - having seen 1 and 2 this weekend I had this strange feeling it is looking more and more like an old movie - and not in a good way. It's that kind of "Dr.Who" cheap CGI look. On the other hand the old 4,5,6, although showing their age actually don't look as sterile and fake as their newer counterparts. I will take 20 stormtroopers running in a loop over CGI animated Boba Fetts looking like cut outs from DX9 game any day.

The more I see Ep 1,2,3 the more I doubt Lucas actually came up with plot for 4,5,6 himself. You don't dumb down from that level of plot driven adventure writing in one life time. Not even on acid. There are extended universe books written better and with smaller plotholes than the prequels, and we all know extended universe books were known to be the bottom of the Star Wars barrel.

Effectively Star Wars as a legend would be better off without prequels, could surely do without those animated idiocies for TV, and seriously, let's not make any more amateur hour malarkies like the cinema animated Clone Wars "do it again to the last dollar" thing that's out now.
 
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stoofa said:
Episodes 4+ follow an extremely simple storyline which requires no brains at all - it's a fairy story set in space.
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You've just described the whole of Star Wars. In fact, when the original was about to be released and no-one though it was going to be anything other than a B movie, George Lucas actually said as much in at least one interview. The only one of the films that deviated even slightly from the Fairy Story ethic was Empire.


M
 
Meridian said:
The only one of the films that deviated even slightly from the Fairy Story ethic was Empire.
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Indeed. Because "Empire" is an Irvin Kershner film rather than a George Lucas one :)

When he picked Richard Marquand to direct "Jedi", he did so knowing full well that Marquand would make the movie the way Lucas wanted it - fast paced and full of action rather than slower and more thoughtful like Kershner's "Empire".
 
Wasabi said:
I used to love Star Wars more than my own mother. But since George Lucas crapped out episodes 1-3 my interest in Star Wars has gradually come to the point where I have no interest in it at all. When the latest film was released I didn't get remotely excited.

Main reasons Star Was was ruined:

  • Jar Jar Binx
  • Force is actually not spiritual - it's about how much Yakult you drank as a young child
  • Jar Jar Binx
  • The new films ruined the legacy of the originals - the difference in quality is shocking
  • Jar Jar Binx

Anyone else feel the same?
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Hi There, welcome to 1999. Please take your complimentary Eiffel 65 CD on the way in :)
 
JRS said:
Indeed. Because "Empire" is an Irvin Kershner film rather than a George Lucas one :)

When he picked Richard Marquand to direct "Jedi", he did so knowing full well that Marquand would make the movie the way Lucas wanted it - fast paced and full of action rather than slower and more thoughtful like Kershner's "Empire".
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And possibly due to the director, it was also the only one where the script (at least the original version) was written by a proper SF writer, rather than a Hollywood hack.


M
 
I've always loved Star wars and will continue too in the future, Admitedly eps 1 & 2 were shockingly bad but i have to say i quite enjoyed eps 3 apart from anakin moaning like a 4 year old girl.
 
stoofa said:
As for Jar Jar Binks - you are totally against that character and then rave on about a film containing Ewoks?
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Indeed!

Got to quote Clerks here:

'"Empire" had the better ending. Luke gets his hand cut off, finds out Vader is his father, uh, Han gets frozen, taken away by Boba Fett. It ends on such a down note. I mean, that's what life is, a series of down endings. All "Jedi" had was a bunch of Muppets.'

Muppets indeed!
 
I liked all of them, what i really object to is Lucas chopping up my childhood by constantly adding crappy cgi to the origonals and insisting we should ignore the first cut as it's not what 'he' envisioned.
Sorry bud, i prefer starwars the way you first made it, not the now production line of edited and re-edited 'special editions' you keep throwing out there.
 
For me the trouble is the effects had moved on so much that they could do fights so much better. This looked good but messed with the story of how powerfull Jedi where supposed to be. It makes people look better as appentices than masters in the original trilogy.

You went from the lightsabre fight with vader and obi basically banging broom handles together in star wars to an apprentice taking on dooku with two sabres.

The series made Maul look stronger than he actually was.

For anyone thats read the expanded universe books almost every single book written is better than anything Lucas has come up with. I'd rather he hadve made films set after the originals to show how strong Luke becomes and with Han and Leia's kids.

The battle against the Vong would make an epic trilogy.

I detest some of the CGI in attack of the clones.
 
Mohinder said:
It's just that you were 9 when you first watched Star Wars, and now you're a grown up.
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Misa speaka likea thisa.

'nuff said.
op said:
  • Force is actually not spiritual - it's about how much Yakult you drank as a young child
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When was the force ever spiritual? Not looking to be contradictory here, but aside from the virgin mary fiasco I can't see how their attitude to the force is any different in the new ones than it was in the old ones?
 
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Casual viewer: I enjoyed all the Star Wars films, even the newer ones, they were good fun lol.

True Star Wars Fan: Episodes IV, V & VI and the ONLY Star Wars films worth watching. The rest are an abomination of all that is holy, featuring a completely different tone notable for its' complete lack of grit, appalling script, complete lack of charisma and character interaciton, an insane amount of mis-casting, and armageddon-inducing acting (good old Hayden). III was the only one that can be considered tolerable, but even that causes suffering in many places. Ian McDermid is a legend, and gave a stand-out performance in every film, especially III. Lucas deserves to burn in hell for ruining the greatest franchise that he himself devised.
 
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If you loved 4-6 then nothing should change that, regardless of how bad you think anything after 1983 has been.

Some of the changes in the SE's and again in the DVD versions of 4-6 worked well, others didn't but overall I think I prefer them to the proper originals.

4 is a timeless classic, 5 is the best of the series and 6 is good but having watched it again recently the Ewoks aren't much less cringeworthy than Jar Jar Binks himself, otherwise Jedi could have been better. I think if the prequels had replaced Jar Jar with Ewoks they would have been panned for their inclusion but strangely Ep6 is largely not criticised for having them, I think it was something they could get away with in the early 80's but doubt they would have now.

Ep1 & 2 very disappointing by 4-6 standards and in general but never thought they were as bad as were universally panned. Stories couldn't have been any different but the scripts, dialogue and acting were poor with the exception of Palpatine.
I feel that despite Ep1 having a young Anakin the film without Jar Jar and the kiddy type humour taken out, could have been much better. Theres a fan edit on the net with loads of crap taken out and Jar Jar's got a totally different voiceover thats supposed to be much better.

Thought the prequels were good arround Palpatine and him playing everyone for fools in getting into power, def the best character in all 3 films. Some great action, CGI great apart from the cartoon-fest that is the end Battle Of Naboo and the Clone 'Arena' which was poor.

Darth Maul not used enough, shouldn't have killed him in Ep1, Neeson given some poor dialogue and emotion lacking. Thinks of how emotionless his speech was when dying and compare to his speech at the end of Schindlers List, yes the subject matter no comparison but the acting itself world's apart.

Apart from some poor acting at times esp by Anakin, thought Ep3 was a great film and a great Starwars film. The dialogue scene in the theatre between Palpatine and Anakin great scene, the action and CGI awesome throughout and much more emotion and the films almost as good as Jedi overall for me, just again some poor dialogue and script at times.

As for the spinoffs such as Ewoks adventures, Clone Wars and new Clone Wars, they don't interest me at all but I may watch the live action tv series when it's out.

If I were being OTT then I'd argue a true SW fan isn't interested in anything post 1983, proper true originals and nothing else.
 
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