2008 Italian GP - Race 14/18

MilanoChris said:
I wonder if TheStig1 has seen GP2 or any form of Touring Car races?

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/... WTCC Brands Hatch/080727WTCCGeneThompson.jpg

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/...3 BTCC Snetterton/080713giovanardichilton.jpg

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/geraintevans/070506thruxtononslowturner.jpg

These pics probably gave him a heart attack.
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not being funny but BTCC takes the ****. Its Banger racing with some rather expensive cars. Its not racing.

However the stewards let it go because crashes bring in a different type of fan..... and lots of them.
 
JRS said:
Heh, uh....Monza was bone dry actually. Pretty sure Spa was dry as well. Thanks for confirming to me that you know **** all about what you're wittering about.
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Spa 97 was certainly not dry. Remember Ralf spinning on the formation lap and having to run back. Williams comedy of errors on tires where they stuck JV on inters instead of dry when the track started to dry.
 
Overlag said:
not being funny but BTCC takes the ****. Its Banger racing with some rather expensive cars. Its not racing.

However the stewards let it go because crashes bring in a different type of fan..... and lots of them.
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BTCC is great, its fun racing and entertaining. You get to see some great car control, close racing and a little bit of rubbing (;))

Fabrizio is a legend of a driver, and having been in a car with him on the track i speak from first hand experience :D
 
John Cleland rules :p

Its one of the few types of top racing where an independent team can be at the sharp end...

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
Cavallino said:
I think they did tremendously well to have closed the gap to LH, dont forget the Mclaren engine has more BHP on the Ferrari, and should have made short work of the field...
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Does it? I thought it was the other way around. But yeah McLaren definately the 2nd most powerful engine.
 
NathanE said:
Does it? I thought it was the other way around. But yeah McLaren definately the 2nd most powerful engine.
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I also thought that the Ferrari had the horsepower advantage but the McLaren has the downforce advantage, usually the Ferrari's have the higher top speed but the McLarens have the higher cornering speed.
 
The Ferrari has a 25bhp overhead doesn't it? OR is that between Red Bull/Torro Rosso? ITV keep mentioning it anyway. They may have done something to compensate this regarding recent failures but the Ferrari has more power.

LH backed off towards the end of the race to settle for the place he had, he said so at interview. Hence why he was being caught.
 
Dup said:
The Ferrari has a 25bhp overhead doesn't it? OR is that between Red Bull/Torro Rosso? ITV keep mentioning it anyway. They may have done something to compensate this regarding recent failures but the Ferrari has more power.

LH backed off towards the end of the race to settle for the place he had, he said so at interview. Hence why he was being caught.
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I think he backed off because his tyres were roasted. He wouldn't have allowed Webber to catch him otherwise. A "turned down" McLaren engine is probably still putting out more horsepower than a fully race mapped Renault :p
 
NathanE said:
I think he backed off because his tyres were roasted. He wouldn't have allowed Webber to catch him otherwise. A "turned down" McLaren engine is probably still putting out more horsepower than a fully race mapped Renault :p
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Yep, he even said this in the press conference.
 
TheStig1 said:
glock has done pretty well in that car i think
i bet he would look much better in a mclaren just like lewis
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Yes Glock would do better in a faster car, but wouldnt be as quick as Lewis.

Lewis is doing what MS and Senna used to do to their team mates - make them look slow.

The only person who Hamilton wont be able to do this to is Alonso, but everybody else is likely to get blown away.

Before Heikki arrived at McLaren, everybody regarded him highly (on this forum and in F1 circles). During the course of this season, we have seen just how much slower he is than Hamilton, on average. Ive been quite critical of him, but I have said on occassion that he isnt super slow; its just that Hamilton is so damn fast, he is making Heikki look worse than he actually is.

As Hamilton drives alongside more drivers, you will see more evidence of just how much quicker he is than everybody else.
 
on the subject of engines

Behind-the-scenes efforts by teams to make Formula One engine performance more equal are set to be ramped up in the wake of Scuderia Toro Rosso's shock victory in the Italian Grand Prix, autosport.com has learned.

Sebastian Vettel caused a major surprise when he became F1's youngest ever winner at Monza, with a performance that highlighted the differences between his Ferrari-powered STR3 and the Renault-powered car of sister team Red Bull Racing.

The result has provided further evidence to those who believe that there is now a genuine performance gap between different engines on the grid. A number of manufacturers - especially Renault – have already spoken out in claiming that they have lost out by not developing their power-unit under F1's current engine freeze.

Although making improvements to the engines is not allowed, manufacturers can change parts as the FIA's discretion if it reduces costs or improves reliability. Such revisions can also have the added benefit of lifting performance. Further steps forward can be made from improved fuel and lubricants, and the airbox and exhaust design.

Sources have told autosport.com that a number of teams are so unhappy with the situation – which could leave them down on power until 2013 if the rules do not change – that they are now lobbying the FIA behind the scenes to try and level the playing field for next year.

"We just want to make things more equal between all the engines on the grid – as they were when the freeze first came in," said one source. "A number of teams share our feelings, and discussions are taking place with the FIA about resolving the situation."

It is understood that Fernando Alonso's decision about whether or not to stay at Renault next year will be influenced by if the French car manufacturer can address the engine situation to improve their performance.

Renault boss Flavio Briatore told Spanish newspaper AS at the weekend that the improvements made by Ferrari, Mercedes-Benz and BMW was being discussed by teams.

"We have discussed with the other teams to find a solution," he said. "The mechanical side was frozen and three teams took advantage of their reliability problems to move forward. I have met with Max Mosley a few times and by the end of the season all this might be solved."

Red Bull Racing team principal Christian Horner said he was fully behind moves to equalize the engines – claiming that it was inconceivable for the situation to continue unchanged with some manufacturers enjoying what could be as much as a 30bhp advantage.

"Renault give us a very good service," Horner told autosport.com. "Last year we had a competitive engine and this year others appear to be ahead of us from our analysis. And obviously there is no bigger example than between the two Red Bull teams, so for us it is very important that Renault address it in the appropriate way.

"I know that they understand where the issues are. The problem is they took the ruling of the freeze absolutely literally, and others took advantage more than they did. And Renault have paid the penalty for that.

"The problem is, being stuck with that for five years is an untenable position for Renault or any other team that has that kind of disadvantage."

Horner said that idea of an equality was not to free up development, as that would simply drive up costs, but just in ensuring that differences in engines were minimized.

"The FIA has all the information," he said. "At the end of the day we need to keep costs down. We don't need an engine formula to completely open up, but there should be a parity as much as possible among the engine suppliers – otherwise we will all end up with one engine at the end of the day."
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The engine freeze was a complete failure of an idea. Thought up by idiots, implemented by morons and hated by everyone sane.
It's completely ridiculous and serves to gimp a few of the teams with a crap engine for a few years. I'm sure the savings are more than worth it, the money isn't spent elsewhere... *cough*
Bet the teams losing out with this rule are really happy to be losing out on tasty prize money.
 
frakker said:
I can't find anywhere that details how long the Renault contract with RBR will last?

Here's an idea: Mario Theissen suggested during the unveiling of the F1.08 that they would be looking to supply engines to other teams. Quick, someone give him a call!
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Mercedes have been saying that for years - no-one has taken them up on it yet though.
 
dalin80 said:
Other way round supposedly, autosport did a fairly in depth analysis a few weeks ago but i cant find it at the moment.
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I know at the beginning of the season Mclaren had a 25bhp advantage but, owing to the FIA and there allowance of teams to tinker with the engine [to improve reliability and supposedly reduce costs] Ferrari have significantly more power than they started with.
 
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