diesel vs petrol power

A diesel engine doesn't belong anywhere near a light hot hatch like a 205. Putting GTi6 engines in them might be popular, but it doesn't help the handling and a stinky diesel weights rather a lot more. Performance isn't just about straight lines, in fact 205s were design to excel along tight twisting roads. Fitting a boat anchor to the front of it will simply ruin it.

I have to say that I simply can't understand how people can think diesels are remotely suitable for hot hatches, they just have completely the wrong power delivery, not to mention sounding like a manic blacksmith is working under the bonnet.

And as for the 206...well, I suppose it's ok if you are a girl wanting a "cute" shopping car, but in terms of raw driver appeal it's a mere shadow of it's predecessor.
 
[TW]Fox;14202993 said:
The diesel will feel quicker as its power delivery style is such that the rate of change in acceleration is quicker than the petrol car, but the petrol cars power delivery is more linear. This means the diesel has more 'urge' which makes you think its quicker than it is, whereas the petrol car lacks this shove which makes you think its slower than it is.
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Do you base this on driving 2 similar cars, as i have ?

i have raced work collegues in 1.8t golfs whilst driving a pd150 and vice versa, the diesel comfortably beats the petrol on ytyhe open road

I trust, from your opinion, that you have had this experience or similar ?
 
I can only speak from what I have experienced and this is mainly in VAG 1.9PD's where the power band is narrow and the torque comes in one big lump.

The 6 speed box in these helps a great deal.

Having recently driven a standard PD130 I thought every gear shift dropped me smack bang into where the power was.

Surely in a 5 speed the gears would be longer?
 
Dogbreath said:
A diesel engine doesn't belong anywhere near a light hot hatch like a 205. Putting GTi6 engines in them might be popular, but it doesn't help the handling and a stinky diesel weights rather a lot more. Performance isn't just about straight lines, in fact 205s were design to excel along tight twisting roads. Fitting a boat anchor to the front of it will simply ruin it.

I have to say that I simply can't understand how people can think diesels are remotely suitable for hot hatches, they just have completely the wrong power delivery, not to mention sounding like a manic blacksmith is working under the bonnet.

And as for the 206...well, I suppose it's ok if you are a girl wanting a "cute" shopping car, but in terms of raw driver appeal it's a mere shadow of it's predecessor.
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duh, no it doesn't weigh anymore :rolleyes:
 
stinka said:
Do you base this on driving 2 similar cars, as i have ?

I trust, from your opinion, that you have had this experience or similar ?
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Of course I have. As everyone on this forum except you is well aware the two cars I drive the most are two identically aged BMW's - a 530i and a 530d. A pretty good diesel v petrol match, given that when current the 530d was arguably the best diesel engine on the planet and this engine is still in use today, albeit in revised form, in BMW's range topping UK market diesels. It is considerably better than any 4 pot found in a Peugeot, for example.

Frankly I'd argue this experience gives you a better real world diesel v petrol experience than 'racing' people in hatchbacks on the public highway.
 
stinka said:
Do you base this on driving 2 similar cars, as i have ?

i have raced work collegues in 1.8t golfs whilst driving a pd150 and vice versa, the diesel comfortably beats the petrol on ytyhe open road

I trust, from your opinion, that you have had this experience or similar ?
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Ah well, with such scientific facts you must be right then....I mean, racing some mates and beating them (or should I say owning?) proves your point completely, close thread....
 
Dogbreath said:
Diesels are pap.



Well, actually some of them are quite good which must make that statement as equally ridiculous as yours.
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nah, its common knowledge that they perform poorly on a car engine as they are not designed for the app, and jenvy's etc will perform much better
 
I used to go on about how the HDi was a big heavy lump.

The chaps over on pug306.net confirmed the HDi is lighter than the 2.0 16v XU engine in the GTi-6
 
stinka said:
Do you base this on driving 2 similar cars, as i have ?

i have raced work collegues in 1.8t golfs whilst driving a pd150 and vice versa, the diesel comfortably beats the petrol on ytyhe open road

I trust, from your opinion, that you have had this experience or similar ?
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I presume you're talking about both 150's here. But why not include the 180PS petrol.

It's the same engine, the same price just a slight mid mk modification. (If it cost more it would be ruled out but it didn't) As I posted in post 88 the 180 engine comfortably beats the TDI. Almost a second to 60 in the Mk1 Leon FR's
 
[TW]Fox;14203075 said:
Of course I have. As everyone on this forum except you is well aware the two cars I drive the most are two identically aged BMW's - a 530i and a 530d. A pretty good diesel v petrol match, given that when current the 530d was arguably the best diesel engine on the planet and this engine is still in use today, albeit in revised form, in BMW's range topping UK market diesels. It is considerably better than any 4 pot found in a Peugeot, for example.

Frankly I'd argue this experience gives you a better real world diesel v petrol experience than 'racing' people in hatchbacks on the public highway.
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yes but my 'test' was on 2 cars with the same bhp and performance figures

was yours ?
 
I think either you like how diesels drive or you don't.

If I had the cash and the option to buy either a 330i sport or 330d sport it would be the 330i everytime.

Listening to the 6 pot sound track and a screaming engine is how it should be in my oppinion.
 
stinka said:
yes but my 'test' was on 2 cars with the same bhp and performance figures

was yours ?
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How much closer do you want to get? Two identical cars at the same pricepoint in the same model range with the same sized engine aimed at the same market sold by the same manufacturer with the same production year.
 
stinka said:
yes but my 'test' was on 2 cars with the same bhp and performance figures

was yours ?
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If they have the same perfomance figures then how can one be faster in a race. :confused:

Also FI petrol engines will make your diesels look even more daft.
 
[TW]Fox;14203075 said:
Frankly I'd argue this experience gives you a better real world diesel v petrol experience than 'racing' people in hatchbacks on the public highway.
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I'd argue mine is better, having driven and raced colleagues probably hundreds of times, in both vehicles during my 7 years as a vw technician
 
( |-| |2 ][ $;14203084 said:
I presume you're talking about both 150's here. But why not include the 180PS petrol.

It's the same engine, the same price just a slight mid mk modification. (If it cost more it would be ruled out but it didn't) As I posted in post 88 the 180 engine comfortably beats the TDI. Almost a second to 60 in the Mk1 Leon FR's
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the argument i am trying to make is that if you take a diesel and a petrol with identical power outputs, the diesel is (usually) better.
this has nothing to do with price or whatever. i am solely interested in bhp.

the same can be said to fox - perhaps the 530d and 530i were similarly priced (i can't remember), but the engines are not comparable. the 530i is better than the 530d in almost every way. compare the 530d to the 528i (both with 193bhp), and then maybe we have a different story

we are talking performance figures, not price or placement within the range.
 
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