Does Cardio burn muscle?

Barks · 12 Jun 2009 at 08:58

Please forgive me if this has been covered but I can't find any information in the stickies.

Anyway a mate and I are going for it at the gym this summer. He said today "I don't want to focus too much on cardio as it burns muscle, I'd rather bulk up"

Surely this is rubbish. I was under the impression your body breaks down sugar for energy and then fat, and finally muscle as a last resort?

Furthermore I always thought that high-intesnity short running and/or HIIT would not cause you to lose muscle as it's more of a cardio workout than a fat burner. Needless to say I hope this is not true because I've been doing HIIT/runs and weights on alternate days and it'd be a joke to find out this is counter productive. I don't see how it can be true since lifting weights is a cardio workout in itself!!??

Any thoughts?

Smit · 12 Jun 2009 at 09:26

Simple really:

To gain weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a higher intake of calories than it burns off.

To lose weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a lower intake of calories than it burns off.

You can't gain and lose at the same time. You can't just lose fat and not muscle. You can't just gain muscle without fat.

Depending on what your specific goals are will determine whether what you are doing is counter productive or not.

Barks · 12 Jun 2009 at 09:33

Smit said:
Simple really:

To gain weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a higher intake of calories than it burns off.

To lose weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a lower intake of calories than it burns off.

You can't gain and lose at the same time. You can't just lose fat and not muscle. You can't just gain muscle without fat.

Depending on what your specific goals are will determine whether what you are doing is counter productive or not.

Is this entirely true though. In the last few months I've packed on quite a bit of muscle and lost pretty much all the excess fat I had around my belly from drinking too much at university.

Freefaller · 12 Jun 2009 at 09:46

Smit said:
Simple really:

To gain weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a higher intake of calories than it burns off.

To lose weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a lower intake of calories than it burns off.

You can't gain and lose at the same time. You can't just lose fat and not muscle. You can't just gain muscle without fat.

Depending on what your specific goals are will determine whether what you are doing is counter productive or not.

Not entirely correct. You can gain muscle whilst losing fat. And it's a bit more complex than pure calorie intake/deficit.

Gilly · 12 Jun 2009 at 10:08

Smit said:
Simple really:

To gain weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a higher intake of calories than it burns off.

To lose weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a lower intake of calories than it burns off.

You can't gain and lose at the same time. You can't just lose fat and not muscle. You can't just gain muscle without fat.

Depending on what your specific goals are will determine whether what you are doing is counter productive or not.

Whilst that is simple, it doesn't make it accurate.

jamief · 12 Jun 2009 at 10:15

Smit said:
Simple really:

To gain weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a higher intake of calories than it burns off.

To lose weight (muscle and fat) your body must have a lower intake of calories than it burns off.

You can't gain and lose at the same time. You can't just lose fat and not muscle. You can't just gain muscle without fat.

Depending on what your specific goals are will determine whether what you are doing is counter productive or not.

I think you should do some more research

Barks · 12 Jun 2009 at 10:25

Does anyone care to explain what's wrong with his statement, rather than just tell us it's wrong

Gilly · 12 Jun 2009 at 10:36

Calorific intake is important in that you need a lot when trying to gain and less when trying to lose. To say it only in those terms though is vastly over-simplifying it. You still need the right foods, not just lots of them.

Barks · 12 Jun 2009 at 10:42

Gilly said:
Calorific intake is important in that you need a lot when trying to gain and less when trying to lose. To say it only in those terms though is vastly over-simplifying it. You still need the right foods, not just lots of them.

I'm not too fussed on being meticulous with the diet. I eat extremely healthly, get pretty much everything (fish, meat, dairy, carbs, fruit) and don't eat crisps, biscuits, junk food, coke etc.

Vegetarian · 12 Jun 2009 at 11:15

Cadio only - eats fat and muscle. You are more likely to put on waight later as you have less muscle eating fat.

Waights only - eats fat and and gains muscle. You are likely to put on waight - but look better for it. There will be fat loss. Lets say someone does 500 cals worth of cardio - basicly thats all you will lose. In the same time doing waights you might lose less than 100 cals. However, because the body has to repair its self you can lose over a 1000 more cals doing nothing... eat sensilible you will lose fat.

Waights with cardio - this is best way if you want to lose waight while eating a high protien low fat and carbs diet. Cardio will burn fat and the waights will stop you losing muscle mass. I'd do 40% cardio to 60% waights.

Barks · 12 Jun 2009 at 11:17

Vegetarian said:
Cadio only - eats fat and muscle. You are more likely to put on waight later as you have less muscle eating fat.

Waights only - eats fat and and gains muscle. You are likely to put on waight - but look better for it. There will be fat loss. Lets say someone does 500 cals worth of cardio - basicly thats all you will lose. In the same time doing waights you might lose less than 100 cals. However, because the body has to repair its self you can lose over a 1000 more cals doing nothing... eat sensilible you will lose fat.

Waights with cardio - this is best way if you want to lose waight while eating a high protien low fat and carbs diet. Cardio will burn fat and the waights will stop you losing muscle mass. I'd do 40% cardio to 60% waights.

So my routine of doing cardio one day, weights the next is fine? Or do you have to do both cardio and lifting on the same session?

Cheers

dun · 12 Jun 2009 at 12:03

I had a quick look through but what are you goals for training? And what shape are you in now?

For me as a naturally very skinny guy cardio is out. I lift 5 days a week and I lift hard and that's all I need with a good diet to stay lean. But if you are naturally podgy and looking to lose fat then cardio is very important.

Barks · 12 Jun 2009 at 12:55

dun said:
I had a quick look through but what are you goals for training? And what shape are you in now?

For me as a naturally very skinny guy cardio is out. I lift 5 days a week and I lift hard and that's all I need with a good diet to stay lean. But if you are naturally podgy and looking to lose fat then cardio is very important.

Naturally I'm average really, not skinny but not carrying much fat either. Just look like your average footballer. The only thing is having a poor diet and drinking habits at uni has made me gain a bit of weight. I don't really want to be "huge" or stacked, I'm trying to get a toned more balanced body. Hence I reckon my balance of cardio/weights should be spot on

A2Z · 12 Jun 2009 at 13:45

scott212 said:
Naturally I'm average really, not skinny but not carrying much fat either. Just look like your average footballer. The only thing is having a poor diet and drinking habits at uni has made me gain a bit of weight. I don't really want to be "huge" or stacked, I'm trying to get a toned more balanced body. Hence I reckon my balance of cardio/weights should be spot on

you used the T word :eek:

Freefaller · 12 Jun 2009 at 14:05

Arrgh! The "t" word

:/

Anyway. Having more lean body mass means that your body naturally processes (i.e. metabolises) food more efficently and actively. i.e. being alive will mean you burn more calories. If you don't keep satiated your muscles will be used next in terms of calorific value for your body - so it's important to match your food intake with the amount of exercise you do if you want to keep your bulk up.

However this doesn't mean that eating lots will make you fat - if you have a good well thoughtout routine with some decent cardio mixed in you can drop the body fat whilst keeping hold of your lean body mass. It's not easy but it's entirely feasible.

The 2+ stone I've gained over the past year have not contributed to me gaining any fat, in fact I've leaned out slightly.

I personally think CV fitness is vital - and something a lot of bodybuilers/weightlifters don't do enough of. So many times I've seen 18st giants immensly strong and looking phenomenal, break into a sweat walking up some stairs! It's quite silly. So I advocate some cardio whilst lifting, I'm not exactly anorexic as a result and am still fairly bulky at 222lbs, yet my serratus are clearly defined, as are my "abs" but also the striations on muscle groups. Sure, I'd love to drop another 2%, and it'll happen and is happening, but in spite of that I'm still doing lots of cardio 3x a week minimum yet remain "bulky" - after 3 years you'd have thought I'd be skinny

Bear in mind I play rugby in the winter, and basketball and squash throughout the year as well as basic cardio.

dun · 12 Jun 2009 at 14:20

Ye but mate at 88kg before you started training (about right?) you were hardly built like "your average footballer". I think the individuals body composition has a lot to do with it.

Freefaller · 12 Jun 2009 at 14:28

Sure I was relatively broad (85kg roughly when I started really training) I always did lots of sports and exercise, so had a lot of LBM anyway and was active. So the argument still stands that bulking and keeping active doesn't mean you become skinny and suffer muscular atrophy as a result!

jamief · 12 Jun 2009 at 14:55

I don't think there is anything wrong with the term "toned body" - it is just a body type (probably slim/medium build with low bodyfat).

The term "toning" however is something totally different - as if you can do certain exercises which will stop you "getting huge" and just "tone me up" for the "winz".

Big Chris · 12 Jun 2009 at 16:58

I've been doing a day 5 weights plan, with 20mins HIT on the bike on 4 of those days post workout (day off when I train legs as I can barely stand after that, let alone pedal a bike). I've dropped 4kg in 6 weeks so far which isn't bad since I like the occasional drink and pizza from time to time.

Buffman · 12 Jun 2009 at 17:06

Cardio is still important, though if you're trying to bulk up and do cardio it means you need to eat more to compensate for energy used during cardio.