Tropical fish tank, a question

[MagicBoy]

I thought under gravel filters stopped being common about 10 years ago? Last time I saw one was when my Dad kept tropicals in the 80s.

I've got two tanks - 2ft has an internal power, the 3ft has a external canister.

 

[Malt_Vinegar]

Under gravel are old school! I believe modern external and canister filters are far superior.

RE: Pets at home... There are some decent ones. It largely depends on the knowledge and dedication of the "fish person" at the store. There are a few near me, one i never buy from, one I pop in and will buy from if I can't get stock from anywhere else, and another I would never hesitate to buy from.

I do tend to buy the majority of my stock from local Maidenhead Aquatics though.

 

[pastymuncher]

Few points:
o Pets at home are a bad place to buy fish from, they look pretty in the decorative tanks but are usually in very poor condition. Look for a local Maidenhead Aquatics or similar. Chesterfield acquatics appears to be near you as does Spire Aquatics, might be worth seeing what they are like?

o 28 degrees is a bit high for the temperature and reduces the amount of oxygen the water can hold. Aim for 24 - 26 degrees, however make sure you reduce it down very gradually (over 3 or 4 days) else it may affect the fish.

o Doing a half water change should only be done in extreme circumstances as it stresses out the fish. A 15-20% water change every couple of weeks minimises the impact on the fish.

o You really should have testing kits to tell the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels in the tank. Ammonia and Nitrite levels should be zero when introducing new fish and Nitrate should be 20ppm or lower. Ammonia is formed due to adding new fish (due to more fish feces breaking down). Ammonia slowly breaks down into Nitrite which in turn slowly breaks down into nitrate. Nitrate can be reduced via water changes and having live plants in the tank

o Finally for a novice at keeping fish you are buying difficult fish to keep. cichlids, Gouramis and Mollys can be challenging to keep, particularly together. This is the benefit of going to a proper fish shop, they will tell you what will/won't work. I suggest when you buy more fish consider something from the Tetra family (neons, black neons, etc), Harlequins or Danios.

Excellent advice there. I thought 28 degrees was a bit high as well. My tanks all run at 24-25 degrees.

Not all Pet's at Home are poor though. The fish in ours are pretty good. What is poor however are the staff. Most of the time they now nothing about fish at all. One time i spotted a pair of spotted talking catfish (Spotted Raphael Catfish - Agamyxis pectinifrons) in their tanks but no prices for them. I asked the man who was cleaning out the tanks how much they were and he told me that they were not spotted talking catfish at all and were Otocinclus dwarf sucker mouth catfish and were £1.99 each. I was tempted to argue the point but snapped the two spotted cats up at that price. £3.98 for a pair of gorgeous catfish. Mine have a very dark colour with bright white spots and look much better than those in the picture.

When you do your filter cleaning i hope you are using water from the tank and not cleaning the filters under the tap. If you are then the tap water will kill the beneficial bacteria on the filter pads.

You will need a water conditioner as well for your water changes. Tap water contains harmful things such as chlorine, metals etc. Ours has chloramine in it which is a chlorine/ammonia mix so i use Waterlife's Haloex as it's one of the only ones to remove chloramine. Find out what is in your water from the local water company.

Get a good test kit and test your water regularly. It may look clean but often it's not.

 

[Rainmaker]

i use Waterlife's Haloex as it's one of the only ones to remove chloramine.

My collection consists solely of 20+ individually housed Siamese fighting fish (plakat Thai), so I can't offer any advice re: a "normal" tropical setup. However, your comment did pique my interest as every conditioner I've seen so far removes chloramine and binds heavy metals, in addition to plain chlorine. Tetra's AquaSafe and Hagen's AquaPlus to name just two others.

Depending on the amount of water, and frequency of water changes, pond treatment usually works out cheaper than those little bottles anyway. For example, AquaPlus requires 2.5ml per 10 litres of water. Not so bad when I'm buying in bulk (about £4 for 500ml), but when you consider that the same stuff with a 'for ponds' label on it treats 1,000+ litres per dose, and costs the same per bottle...

Anyway, I digress. Good luck with your fish OP.

 

[Doctor_Zhivago]

Fish tank noobs again...

1) 28C is too high! turn it down to 24C
2) Clown loaches grow very big! They need AT LEAST 200 litres, same for plecs.
3) The heat for sure would have killed your fish.
4) Never buy fish from pets at home
5) Get an API masters water test kit, even pets at home sells them

If you need any more advice ask. I am the expert at all things tropical fish.

 

[Biohazard]

Please don't give up on the fishies!

 

[vincent1989]

what is the actual size of the tank in litres, some of those fish you have/had/bought can grow quite large and will need a fairly substantial tank, mine's too small at 125 litres.

are you dechlorinating any water you put in the tank?

did you do a fishless cycle?

dont buy from P@H, try and find a smaller local petshop, they tend to take better care of their stock and it gets rotated quicker.

Fish tank noobs again...

1) 28C is too high! turn it down to 24C

If you need any more advice ask. I am the expert at all things tropical fish.

how would you advise this being as room temperature can often be above what you are suggesting, added to that the temperature created by any lights will bump up the temp, 26-28 is fine (although admittedly not ideal).

 

[MagicBoy]

dont buy from P@H, try and find a smaller local petshop, they tend to take better care of their stock and it gets rotated quicker.

That's not strictly true. We've got 3 P@H nearby and the two smaller ones are crap. Low stock levels and the fish never look that healthy. The big one has a huge marine show tank, large marine section and sells healthy looking discus. The staff only work in the fish section and apart from the part time weekend staff they know a decent amount.

 

[Magic_x_uk]

THANK YOU ALL so very much for all your information. Some really helpfull people on here.

I shall reply more later, just in the middle of some stuff at moment.

I will write back with all your questions answered shortly. Just turned temp down a bit, and will do so more over the course of the day.

Someone above asked how long I have my fish tank light on for. Well basically I put it on when I wake up and turn it off when I go to bed so about 7.30am till 11pm

Is that bad ?

 

[MagicBoy]

Someone above asked how long I have my fish tank light on for. Well basically I put it on when I wake up and turn it off when I go to bed so about 7.30am till 11pm

Is that bad ?

Yes.

The light is basically needed for plant growth. The fish in natural habitat are not used to that amount of direct light, although it depends on the type and number of tubes. I've got a Tiger barb that came in a tank I inherited from someone and he hates the light - hides away whenever it's on. A soon as the light goes off he comes out to play.

Too much light (sunlight or artificial) will also result in a lot of algae growth. My main tank runs the lights 5 hours a day from 6-11pm.

 

[Lystra]

I think that might be too long - I was told to keep mine on for about 10 hours max or the fish get stressed out (and may encourage algae) - too much light and it's kinda like someone keeping the bedroom light on half the night when you're tired and want to sleep.

 

[Malt_Vinegar]

It has to be said that dont think that by going to a smaller local fish shop you will get much better advice. Many are just as bad. Fish forums are a good way of getting a load of opinions from people with practical experience. I consider myself an experienced fish keeper, but will still go to MFK, or tropical fish forums for opinions when needed.

You only have to look online (and to use an example in this thread) for a bit to see all the different reccomendations for clown loach tank sizes.

The only fish shop brand I have seen to be always good is Maidenhead aquatics. Been to about 4 or 5 different branches now, and they all have knowledgeable people, and in the odd instance they are not able to help, they will refer to well known books, and even phone specialist suppliers to get accurate advice from the same place as they source their fish.

Choosing fish, and stocking a tank can require some planning if you intend to keep anything really interesting. My main tank is 190 litres and contains a Senegal Bichir, Geophagus Brasiliensis and some rasboras. This is quite a careful selection of fish which need some particular things to keep them happy. For example, the Brasiliensis needs a sand substrate, as it an "eartheater" which filters sand to get food.

I also cannot stock anything smaller than the mouth of my bichir, as he will eat whatever he can fit in there. My tank is pretty low stocked to allow decent water condition and space for growth. I may well move in another Geophagus species (Jurupari) if I can get them to get along.

As I run a planted tank, i cant keep anything like Silver dollars, who will strip soft foliage from plants, and i also have to inject CO2 into the water to keep the plants happy and growing.

As u can see, there are lots of things to consider when stocking fish tanks. You best bet is to get a wide range of advice from many different people. Even people with huge tanks who stock rare fish and have been keeping for YEARS will often ask advice.

 

[Magic_x_uk]

okay my tank is a Juwel

It is 2ft long, 1ft wide and 16 inch high. Just checked the JUWEL website and it is
Rekord model: 600
Volume: approx. 63 Litres
Measurements: 61 x 31 x 42 inch




The tank has a filter and temp built into the back right hand side.

I do always clean my filters out in the tank water, when I am changing the water, ie: rinse the filters in a bucket of the water that is being changed.

My pleco is quite big, think he is happy at least, about 6 inch long and the clown roach is quite big about 3 inch long.

 

[Angus02]

Firstly go to your local aquatic shop and get your water checked or buy the
following test kits PH / Nitrite / Ammonia / Nitrate.

99% of issues stem from this so you need to rule this out before adding any
more fish.

Given that it is 10 days since you have put them in it points to a Nitrite / Ammonia build up as even adding 1 fish puts a strain on your filter system as any increase in stocking needs an increase in bacteria in your filter.

Older fish seem to tolerate bad water to an extent but you will usually find that is is your new fish that die first.

If your water checks out okay try adding your fish a week apart and monitor all the above tests.

PH can be fixed by water changes and PH buffers

Nitrate can be also fixed with more water changes

Nitrite / Ammonia levels point to filter issues.

Also if you are serious - consider an external filter (ehiem etc)to run at the same time as your internal one which will help no end.


First of all you need to know what your water is like.

 

[MeatLoaf]

Are your clown loaches happy and healthy? If your water conditions are crap then id imagine these would be first to show signs of ill health

 

[arc@css]

I completely agree with everything said above.

We've got a decent (compared to the others) Pets at Home near us, but I made the mistake of getting a few Neon tetra's when popping in to get some food. They came with NTD, and wiped out the other 20 in the tank. D'oh!

I usually use Maidenhead, the quality of the fish and the advice is excellent.

+1 for Maidenhead, the staff I have found very helpful there.

 

[Magic_x_uk]

Are your clown loaches happy and healthy? If your water conditions are crap then id imagine these would be first to show signs of ill health

Yes I only have one though and he seems happy enough, although he always hides in my cannon. Not often does he come out to be honest.

 

[Abyss]

Someone above asked how long I have my fish tank light on for. Well basically I put it on when I wake up and turn it off when I go to bed so about 7.30am till 11pm

Is that bad ?

You really need to invest in a cheap timer for your lights (the kind that plugs into the wall). Having the light on for the wrong amount of time can promote excess algae, affect the balance of the bacteria in the tank and can upset the fish. I suggest starting with the light on for around 7 hours, however reduce this if you have quite a bit of tramp light (e.g. the room is bright in the day or
the tank is near a window). The amount of light is particularly important if you have real plants in the tank.

The tank is a bit small really for Clown Loach, however you will be fine for now. Just bear in mind that eventually they will outgrow your tank so you'll either need to buy a bigger one (200L ish) or take them back to an aquatics centre.

 

[Doctor_Zhivago]

63 litres is way too small for a clown loach, I wont even have a clown loach in mine and I have 180 litres. His growth will be stunted and will die a very painful and slow death. Also clown loaches like to be in at least 3 in number. Rehome him ASAP!

 

[vincent1989]

63 litres is to small for most of the things you've bought, it really is only a suitable size for corydoras, tetras, dwarf gourami (and so on). a lot of shops like to sell fish (it is after all how they make money) to unsuspecting people, you should take them back and ask for a refund (or store credit) and then run a fishless cycle.