NVIDIA brings a dual GTX 470 prototype to Computex, causes power shortages in Taipei

[richb93]

Via Engadget

We'll hit the pause button on all the power-sipping tablet talk for a moment to show you NVIDIA's maddest and baddest beast yet. This is a dual GeForce GTX 470 card, meaning that two Fermi dies reside on the same board, along with the necessary circuitry and an apparently beefed up apportionment of GDDR5 RAM as well. Measuring in at 12 inches long, this prototype is being shown off at Computex by add-in board partner Galaxy -- probably just to prove that the mammoth undertaking is even possible. You'll be forgiven for mistaking it for one of 3dfx's final ill-fated productions, and with a requirement for two 8-pin power connectors and a doubling of the standard 470's 215W TDP, this dualie card sure looks set for a similar future of pretty pictures and no retail viability. All the same, if you happen to have a nuclear reactor and a wind farm in your backyard, this could be just the GPU for you.

Apologies if this has already been posted, I didn't see it if it has.

 

[Tute]

Can't see it ever getting to retail - it'd be expensive, hot, noisy, and yields would be really poor.

Plus it'd be what... twice the power of the HD5850? So the HD5970 would beat it hands down. Nvidia wouldn't go for that.

 

[richb93]

430W

 

[Rroff]

Can't see it ever getting to retail - it'd be expensive, hot, noisy, and yields would be really poor.

Plus it'd be what... twice the power of the HD5850? So the HD5970 would beat it hands down. Nvidia wouldn't go for that.

Not true - while the GTX470 as a single card doesn't give very impressive performance 2 of them in SLI is very competitive against 5870 crossfire and very rarely loses to the 5970. If price and power/heat issues aren't a worry for you its a reasonable setup.

 

[drunkenmaster]

I really wish you'd stop saying that, and other people, if a 470gtx doesn't give very impressive performance, I can tell you right now, that 2x sli doesn't give more than 200% the performance of a single card. 2x not impressive performance, is still not very impressive performance. As SLI most certainly does not average a 100% scaling from SLI then its 2x less than already not impressive performance.

Trying to spin that as 470gtx's come alive in SLI, is laughable. The idea that they scale better than xfire, thats possible, thats fine, that might happen, but you're not really saying that. Compared to another set of cards, 470gtx sli gives better comparable performance, 2x470gtx's in sli give less performance than 2x470gts's individually, and you've already said they aren't that impressive to start with.

As for the 5970 not often beating 470gtx's in sli, why would they, they are downclocked and inherantly going to be slower than 2 separate cards with the same speeds.

a dual 470gtx card, WILL BE SLOWER than 2x470gtx's in sli, because thats just how life goes, when you throw in downclocked gpu's, it will be arounda 5970, but won't beat it into the ground.

Also, lets not forget the site listing what it is, also suggests the 465gtx reviews were mostly positive and that the 465gtx is a far better value buy than a 5830, and a 5850 costs $30 more and doesn't mention its miles faster.

In other words, dodgey site, no actual specs of the "card", could be guessing at what it is, could easily be two heavily cut down 465gtx's or a gf104 based dual card, it could be anything, it could also be a mock up like one of the hundreds of mock ups we've seen at various events(by most AIB's) that never actually make it to market, because they are more about appearing innovative and getting headlines than actually making a product.

 

[Rroff]

Unfortunatly the benchmarks scattered around the web aren't always running the best drivers/setup show some rather varied results, don't often tell the whole story, inconsistancies and in some cases just very odd results.

http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=327705&mpage=1

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru.../30999-nvidia-geforce-gtx-470-sli-review.html

http://www.guru3d.com/article/geforce-gtx-465-sli-review/14 (also has 470 SLI results)

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2010/03/26/nvidia_fermi_gtx_470_480_sli_review

http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/3306/galaxy_and_palit_geforce_gtx_470s_in_sli/index13.html

but (and especially with 256+ drivers) GTX470 in SLI does give very competitive performance despite the lacklustre efforts of the single card. At the resolutions and settings that really matter they are a bit more potent setup than 5850 CF and the 5970.

 

[straxusii]

Just checked out the first review I found about 470sli on the site that cannot be mentioned and it seemed to comprehensively beat a 5970

 

[craptakular]

Not true - while the GTX470 as a single card doesn't give very impressive performance 2 of them in SLI is very competitive against 5870 crossfire and very rarely loses to the 5970. If price and power/heat issues aren't a worry for you its a reasonable setup.

Oh hai matey!

I have seen a GTX470 for £270 del in the wild. Given that a 5850 is anything from £230-£300. Is that a good deal?


I am about to sell my 5770 and my GTX260 to help fund a new card.

ArmA 2 is a hungry beast

 

[straxusii]

To compare the price fairly I would say you would be nuts to pay over £240 for a 5850 and £290 for a 470 (stock versions).

The 470 is significantly more expensive than a 5850

 

[wolvers]

Trying to spin that as 470gtx's come alive in SLI, is laughable.

It's OK though because Rroff has been doing some back to back testing with 5850cf and has the results for us to mull over........

Either way, for NV to rock up with a dual gpu card 6 months later and not be a good 20% faster is pretty rubbish.

 

[Tute]

Not true - while the GTX470 as a single card doesn't give very impressive performance 2 of them in SLI is very competitive against 5870 crossfire and very rarely loses to the 5970. If price and power/heat issues aren't a worry for you its a reasonable setup.

Performance is going to vary wildly depending on game though?

 

[straxusii]

Performance is going to vary wildly depending on game though?

The review I read saw the 5970 win one game, 470SLI win 6 games.

Of course other reviews could be different but my gut says most will show 470sli soundly beating 5970. And to be fair it should, 2x470 will cost you ~£560 whereas a single 5970 will cost you £500

This is all largely academic though if your m/b doesnt support CF or SLI, mine only supports CF so I wouldnt go Nvidia for that reason alone

 

[RavenXXX2]

LoL it's another wood screw scenario but this time I guarantee the card will not be released. If anyone is going to show of a dual fermi it would be the likes of EVGA not galaxy the fact that Nvidia are at the event and have announced nothing says it all, just galaxy trying make some waves for itself with a dodgy non working sample glued together in some geeks basement.

As for 5970 v 470 SLI, well a 5970 is heavily downclocked 5870 x 2, so I would expect the 470's to beat it, if they ever bring a dual 470 out expect massively reduced clocks.

 

[Martini1991]

The 5970 is comparable to a 5850 CF though...

 

[Ryan-3]

I have an ATi card myself, and two nVidia ones in a different pc, and the nvidia ones havn't had a single fault (yet! ), but my Ati one has had a few and seems to have stopped. Thats why i'd rather have a card that works out of the box, not out of the box in 5months time

Mind, 430W TDP!!

 

[drunkenmaster]

but (and especially with 256+ drivers) GTX470 in SLI does give very competitive performance despite the lacklustre efforts of the single card. At the resolutions and settings that really matter they are a bit more potent setup than 5850 CF and the 5970.

Here in lies the problem, 5850cf can be had for, TODAY, £425, 470gtx sli can be had for £560. 5850's are also heavily underclocked and overclock by up to 40%(25% VERY comftably) and even heavily overclocked produce less noise, heat and power usage than 470gtx's at stock.

Overclocked the 5850cf is NOT beaten by 470gtx's and theres quite a few games 5850cf beats 470gtx's in sli, and quite a lot of games the 470gtx's beat the 5850cf, thats life.

For a £135 saving, less heating/powering/noise issues, its an easy choice. If you don't overclock at all 5870cf very very often beats 470gtx sli, again being quieter, less power issues, cheaper PSU/mobo support to get it running and costs almost the same(last check you could get 5870's at £270, but those are few and far between and take a while to be delivered, £290-300 is more normal).

You can save money, overclock and get better performance with the 5850's, or just get better performance and pay around the same for 470gtx's in sli.

A single card thats not good enough does not scale over 100% with a second, far from it, 470gtx sli is as bad value as a single 470gtx, theres better options for both more performance at the same cost or better value and very very close performance, exactly the same situation as a single 470GTX.

470gtx is a good option when, well, it hits the 5850 price point, because lets be completely honest, whose going to buy 5850's and not overclock them?

Anyone who was buying this gen with a little sense would have gotten 2x5850's for £200 on launch and had them both at 900-1000Mhz a pop for 6 months + already, theres NO beating that value this gen, in any way.


Theres also the little issue of Nvidia making a loss on 470gtx's and AMD making a profit on 5870's. Which company do I want to "survive" or come out on top, the company that if they got a strangle hold, or had one now, would have happily released the 470gtx, at a profitable price, or maybe £400 and the 480gtx at £500+. Thanks but I'd prefer my money went to the company designing products that continue to offer far better value as an investment for good prices in the future.

Honestly supporting Nvidia just feels like supporting some ridiculously priced future GPU's and a company that can't make a competitive product. I honestly won't have any card long enough to be troubled by warranty periods, but I wouldn't be surprised if in a year there are Fermi's dropping like flies and the demand for second hand Fermi's drops with it, while 5870's will likely retain a lot of their value through till the real next gen cards, likely in a year or more from now.

 

[drunkenmaster]

LoL it's another wood screw scenario but this time I guarantee the card will not be released. If anyone is going to show of a dual fermi it would be the likes of EVGA not galaxy the fact that Nvidia are at the event and have announced nothing says it all, just galaxy trying make some waves for itself with a dodgy non working sample glued together in some geeks basement.

As for 5970 v 470 SLI, well a 5970 is heavily downclocked 5870 x 2, so I would expect the 470's to beat it, if they ever bring a dual 470 out expect massively reduced clocks.

EVGA are probably trying to keep their heads low, and Galaxy probably sell a lot more cards than EVGA, they've just not been an enthusiast brand.

The rumours are that EVGA have fired the guy keeping the EU operation alive, so its rumoured that EVGA are pulling out of Europe as there just isn't any profit in selling Nvidia cards in Europe any more, at any level.

THeres also a less substantiated rumour that EVGA has let go of the entire mobo team, which would mean an end to their mobo department obviously, the EU market probably pulled out of, and EVGA looking to be in as much trouble as BFG.

But yes, as you and I got at, seeing a bare board isn't anything like having a released product or a future product. People make up all kinds of rubbish for trade shows that never gets made, they just want to be known as innovative and TRYING something new, even if they don't achieve it.

 

[straxusii]

Here in lies the problem, 5850cf can be had for, TODAY, £425, 470gtx sli can be had for £560. 5850's are also heavily underclocked and overclock by up to 40%(25% VERY comftably) and even heavily overclocked produce less noise, heat and power usage than 470gtx's at stock.

Indeed, given the choice personally I would go for 5850cf over 470sli even though at stock it will be a little slower.

 

[Ryan-3]

But if you ever use Linux?...

 

[IceWind]

Think I will be sticking with my 5970s