Hamza going nowhere!

This is why I don't like the EU, in theory all of Europe coming together is a great idea and I like it, we have a common heritage and values, having free trade and open borders is wonderful. However the bureaucracy and interference of the EU annoys me, what gives some some eco-hippy human rights EU court the right to interfere with our foreign policy, I voted for the British government to make these decisions not some foreigners called Fritz or Pierre in Strasbourg. :)
 
Babar Ahmad has been held in our prisons (possibly Belmarsh) for 6+ years without trial or conviction relating to this case.
People may not like and/or agree with what he preaches but there is absolutely no reason to lock up an innocent (as he is before being convicted) man for such a lengthy time with no trial.
It's quite sickening, and certainly begs the question if we are a democratic first World country.
 
Personally i think he should be locked up here in this country, he's far more dangerous lose in a muslim country recruiting martars
 
Abu Hamza and three other British men complained about the length of sentence they may face if convicted in the US.
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Boohoo.

Is that really all it takes to avoid extradition? "Hey, but I might be punished over there!"
 
I don't like the dude either, but the conditions in Colorado does merit a stay of extradition. The US prison system in general is one of the most barbaric and hostile in the world, with mass rapes, staff apathy & collusion, widespread corruption and excessive unchecked violence. Abu Hamza should be locked away for life, but just that - the UK (and EU by extension) should be above sending criminals away to other nations facing rape, beatings and much worse.

Just trying to give another perspective on this particular story, even if it may be an unpopular one with many.
 
KNiVES said:
Abu Hamza should be locked away for life, but just that - the UK (and EU by extension) should be above sending criminals away to other nations facing rape, beatings and much worse.

Just trying to give another perspective on this particular story, even if it may be an unpopular one with many.
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Soliciting racial hatred is hardly grounds for locking up for life, especially when actual killers often get around 8 years.
Yes, his alleged crimes are pretty awful. His convicted crimes though, are not as serious. Sentencing should reflect the crimes committed and based on fact and the law, not pandering to public pressures. It, to me at least, seems this has been the case.
I'm interested to see why people are so willing to have him sent off to America, instead of just moaning about the European Court of Human Rights.
 
Ahleckz said:
Soliciting racial hatred is hardly grounds for locking up for life, especially when actual killers often get around 8 years.
Yes, his alleged crimes are pretty awful. His convicted crimes though, are not as serious. Sentencing should reflect the crimes committed and based on fact and the law, not pandering to public pressures. It, to me at least, seems this has been the case.
I'm interested to see why people are so willing to have him sent off to America, instead of just moaning about the European Court of Human Rights.
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If I recall correctly, he's been charged with and is on trial for much worse allegations than simply soliciting racial hatred.
 
xibinim, are you actually going to add anything to this conversation?
At least respond to the points that I made and have a proper discussion instead of just repeating things that I've read already.

mmmalas said:
I disagree, its worse. if you commit a crime, its only count as 1.

however if you encourage it. then that count as many
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Encouraging someone to commit a crime doesn't come close to the seriousness of actually committing said crime. If I told you to steal a mars bar from a shop, I couldn't be held with the same proportion of blame as you for stealing it. Yes, it's wrong of me but the idea that just suggesting stealing something is anywhere near the seriousness of theft is ridiculous. (Trivial point with the mars bar, but the point stands).
 
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mmmalas said:
one other thing that I want to point out, terrorism is not linked to islam in any way.
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The islamic terrorists seem to suggest otherwise. Any reason why I should believe you and not them?

mmmalas said:
its the media that mention that. there are terrerist from all over the world. only Muslims ones are highlighted.
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Possibly because the UK doesn't have a huge problem with terrorists other than Islamic ones at the moment. Bar of course the dissident republicans in Northern Ireland, but trust me, they get mentioned on the news every time they do something too.
 
This isn't SC, I thought you were asking about his conviction and charges in the US so I provided it :)

Anyway - I agree that we can't imprison him for life here as inciting racial hatred etc does not condone a sentence of life. By law, what is stopping us from deporting him seeing as he does nothing other than cost us money (prison or benefits) and preach how this country should be brought to it knees? Finally, if the EU really want to stick their oar in, why not Gary McKinnon?
 
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Ahleckz said:
I'm interested to see why people are so willing to have him sent off to America, instead of just moaning about the European Court of Human Rights.
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I would like to see him sent to America as they want to put him on trial for crimes committed under their law. America is one of our closest political allies so I see no reason why we should not extradite someone who has already been convicted of hate crimes in our country to face trial there.

The American prison system may not be ideal but it is better than that in an awful lot of countries and he will face trial by jury which will give him fare opertunity to defend himself. Should he be convicted then he will serve so reasonably hard time, which though not nice for him will at least prevent him from preaching his own particularly nasty brand of hatred on the streets of Great Britain.

Ahleckz said:
Babar Ahmad has been held in our prisons (possibly Belmarsh) for 6+ years without trial or conviction relating to this case.
People may not like and/or agree with what he preaches but there is absolutely no reason to lock up an innocent (as he is before being convicted) man for such a lengthy time with no trial.
It's quite sickening, and certainly begs the question if we are a democratic first World country.
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Babar Ahmad is a tricky one however had he been quickly extradited his trial in the US would be long over and if he was inocent he would have been released, fighting his extradition is prolonging his detention and making him look guilty as hell.
 
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